Mr. Speaker, it is a privilege to stand here on the first day of the resumption of this session. I would like to again say welcome to all of the new pages. It is wonderful to see these young people here. They keep us old fellows thinking young and we always enjoy the wonderful service they provide to us as members.
I would also like to say that it was a brutal summer because of the issues before the House. I believe that we need to do a great job as parliamentarians in representing those people who sent us here and in every way reflect the values and the expectations our constituents have.
I would like to address this question, because this whole thing regarding the ethics commissioner has to do with meeting the expectations of our electors. Our electors want parliamentarians to act in such a way that they are above reproach. The expectation of our electors is that we will act ethically. Because of tremendously large breaches of ethical behaviour by the government, the Prime Minister brought forward this multi-faceted package in which one of the facets is the creation of an independent ethics commissioner.
Mr. Speaker, I do not know if your memory is as good as mine, but I clearly remember when I first ran for Parliament. Way back in 1993, the Liberal red book said, “We will establish an independent ethics commissioner”. Here it is 10 years later and we now have a bill that says they want to establish an independent ethics commissioner, so I do not know whether the protestations of the Prime Minister in the intervening 10 years are now suspect, because all the time he was saying that we have an independent commissioner. We have raised many questions about the fact that the commissioner answered only to the Prime Minister and hence was anything but independent. I think those protestations over the last 10 years basically are now confessed by the government to have been misleading. The Liberals are saying that now we are going to have an independent ethics commissioner, but when the bill came forward we found out that it is really much of the same.
I would like to assure members that I am leading up to the actual discussion of the amendment before the House.
The ethics commissioner must be totally independent of the government. I am going to say to the Liberal members opposite, all listening so intently as I speak, that they should pay attention to this, because in the next Parliament, when they are sitting on this side, they will want the protections we want now that we are on this side. They should think ahead a little about the next move and whether or not they should support the bill, as they are now refusing to amend it, because it is going to apply to them in opposition as it applies to them now as the government. I am speaking especially to the Liberal backbenchers.
The issue before us is very clearly hinged upon the independence of the ethics commissioner. I would be inclined to oppose this motion, just as the parliamentary secretary said, if in fact we had assurances that both the appointment of the ethics commissioner and the ethics commissioner's work were truly independent, if that were really true. We asked for it in committee when we were debating this issue day after day. Our party put forward amendments that would require all members of Parliament from all parties to actively be involved in the recruitment and the appointment.
We went so far as to say that there should be agreement among the party leaders. We suggested that there be a two-thirds majority vote in the House. Of course the House leader for the government said no, that cannot be, because the Constitution says there can only be a 50% majority. The fact of the matter is that our research shows we as a Parliament can say that on a certain question we need a two-thirds majority and, notwithstanding anything else, it could apply to that particular issue. We would like to apply that to the appointment of the commissioner.
We live in a very hostile political environment here. The Liberals have shown us in the last 10 years that winning elections is motivation number one. Everything else becomes secondary to it. If they can utilize an ethics commissioner bringing charges against members of the opposition at the appropriate time, that can become a very important factor at election time. So it is absolutely mandatory that the ethics commissioner behave in a totally independent way.
Had the government accepted our amendments in committee, which as we know we cannot bring here now because they were dealt with at committee, if the Liberals had accepted those amendments at committee, then we would have been very pleased to move forward with this new act to establish the role of the ethics commissioner.
As a matter of fact, the way it is going to work will be the same as always. The Prime Minister and his office are going to come up with a name. The legislation says all that is required is that there be discussion with the House leaders or the leaders of the other parties. I do not even remember now which it is, whether it is House leaders or leaders, but there will be discussions with the other parties. It does not say an agreement has to be reached. It does not say anything about consensus. Presently we have five parties in the House and the legislation does not even say that a majority of the parties must agree.
Consequently, the Prime Minister could come up with a name of a person that is unacceptable to those of us on this side of the House and to the Liberal members in the next Parliament when they are on this side of the House. Let us think about it: they will not be there forever. No government has ever sat for 100 years, being re-elected and re-elected. There will come a time when the Liberals will be relegated to opposition status, and they must think of this in the long term.
This motion we are debating here today is one which unfortunately covers only half the issue, I think, but at least it is a step. It says that if there is a ruling by the commissioner, then the member of Parliament affected, or for that matter someone else, can appeal it to a presumably more independent body: the courts of our land. Sometimes we have a little apprehension about the true independence of the courts and their way of thinking as well, but be that as it may, at least it is better. This amendment would carry that.
I would like to, however, put out a challenge to the government. The parliamentary secretary has spoken and I would like to ask him a question; I am sure the staffers are listening and I would like them to answer a technical question. Clause 38 states that only if such-and-such happens, and I will not read the details, “then section 7 of this Act is replaced by the following”. I have read this thing 18 times and what it replaces is identical to what is here; it says that if this thing in the Courts Administration Service Act comes into force, then replace section 7 with what is already there. This is just a notice to the people out there in the legal services department for the government that they should really think about this, those fellows and gals, whoever they are, to make sure they have it right.
I will be supporting this motion on that account.