House of Commons Hansard #176 of the 41st Parliament, 1st Session. (The original version is on Parliament's site.) The word of the day was seniors.

Topics

Protecting Canada's Seniors ActGovernment Orders

5:30 p.m.

NDP

Élaine Michaud NDP Portneuf—Jacques-Cartier, QC

Mr. Speaker, I would like to thank the hon. member for Chicoutimi—Le Fjord for his question.

Such a phone line could certainly help seniors. They could use this service for various reasons. Some could use it to report their situation, while others, who may not be ready to take that step, could use it in order to find a listening ear, get support and learn a little more about the resources available in their community.

Some type of support may be required before a senior who has suffered abuse feels comfortable and confident enough to report it to the authorities. A phone line where people are always available to answer questions, provide support, show empathy and help the person in their struggle is extremely important. However, it is only one of many measures that should be implemented to help seniors.

Protecting Canada's Seniors ActGovernment Orders

5:35 p.m.

NDP

Dany Morin NDP Chicoutimi—Le Fjord, QC

Mr. Speaker, I will use the extra time I have been given to ask the hon. member whether she believes that the Conservative government is truly willing to help seniors who are being abused or seniors in general.

Over the past year and a half, the Conservative government has implemented a number of measures that impoverish or marginalize seniors.

What does she think of the Conservatives' attitude toward seniors in general?

Protecting Canada's Seniors ActGovernment Orders

5:35 p.m.

NDP

Élaine Michaud NDP Portneuf—Jacques-Cartier, QC

Mr. Speaker, the hon. member for Chicoutimi—Le Fjord has a lot of questions today.

I do not want to cast too much doubt on the Conservatives' good faith. However, unfortunately, the record of bad decisions and cuts to various services for seniors and Canadians in general is quite worrying. I am not suggesting that the Conservatives are targeting seniors directly. However, I would say that they are not necessarily taking into consideration all the measures that could be implemented to help seniors.

As I mentioned, this bill is the first sign of the Conservatives' good faith, and that is why the official opposition supports them. However, the Conservatives are not going far enough to help seniors. It is time for them to take real action.

Protecting Canada's Seniors ActGovernment Orders

5:35 p.m.

NDP

Irene Mathyssen NDP London—Fanshawe, ON

Mr. Speaker, I will be splitting my time with the member for Argenteuil—Papineau—Mirabel.

Bill C-36 deals with the complex and challenging subject of elder abuse. It is difficult to paint elder abuse with one brush because it comes in many forms: physical, sexual, financial and psychological. The scale of the abuse can vary dramatically. It can be something that has been happening over a lifetime or occur when a senior becomes frail and vulnerable. The source of the abuse can be caregivers, spouses, children or even strangers looking to take advantage of a vulnerable, lonely person. Often the abuse is hidden, not spoken of, and this is a great tragedy.

One program or one measure cannot address the varying needs of our older loved ones who are suffering from abuse. We need a comprehensive plan that will address the needs of all seniors and in particular those who are being abused.

That being said, I want to speak in support of Bill C-36. The bill is not perfect but it is a step in the right direction. New Democrats had proposed something similar to this in the 2011 election campaign and I am glad to see that Conservatives are taking some of our suggestions.

However, what we had proposed to tackle elder abuse was a complete package, some points of which we see in the bill. We need something more comprehensive, including an elder abuse hotline; the creation of elder abuse consultants, modelled on a Manitoba government initiative; and changes to the Criminal Code of Canada to ensure appropriate sentences for perpetrators of elder abuse. This package would involve working with the provinces in order to develop, implement and fund such proposals.

Unfortunately, Bill C-36, as it stands, will not have the desired impact on reducing elder abuse without the other steps that need to be taken. By merely adding on to the Criminal Code an aggravating factor for sentencing when a crime impacts someone due to their age and other personal circumstances, we are missing an important opportunity to create a system of support for seniors facing abuse.

The key to addressing elder abuse in Canada is not stiffer sentences but addressing the root causes. The best way to combat elder abuse is to give seniors control over their own lives and ensure they have the finances to live in dignity. I have been listening to seniors and meeting with seniors organizations. I have heard over and over again how there is a desperate lack of funding for programs and a very real and legitimate fear that Canada is not prepared for the rapidly rising senior population.

The most important issue voiced over and over by seniors is that they want to stay, for as long as possible, in their own homes. They want to be in their communities, near their friends and family. I really do not think this is asking too much. It is very clear that we need a home care plan, a plan that ensures seniors can stay in their homes and that any modifications that need to be done to those homes are available at an affordable rate.

We also need to ensure that seniors can access services without having to travel great distances, especially as mobility becomes more challenging. A network of community hubs would be an effective way to ensure that access is there for them. This would also help combat the solitude that affects so many seniors, especially single seniors or those caring for their partners or another loved one.

Our seniors are asking for affordable and appropriate housing that will meet their needs as they age. As abilities change, our older loved ones need appropriate care within the community or residence in which they live. Access to families and their social networks is key to the health, well-being and safety of our seniors.

In addition to physical security is the need for financial security. Seniors fear losing control over their finances and over their personal choices. Family and those with power of attorney can take control and take choice away. They can, in fact, can take that senior's dignity away.

Our elders can be forced into housing they do not want and can be told to hand over those finances. Too often we allow this to happen for the sake of convenience or for our own fears for a senior's safety. Yet older Canadians should have a say and they should be able to determine the direction they wish to take. This, I believe, is the most important factor in eliminating elder abuse. With control over their own independence and finances, seniors remain in control of their lives, which makes them significantly less vulnerable.

The World Health Organization has recognized elder abuse as an important problem that needs to be addressed. Globally, the World Health Organization estimates that between 4% and 6% of elderly people have experienced some form of abuse in the home. The organization argues that a number of situations appear to put the elderly at risk of violence.

In some cases, strained family relationships may worsen as a result of stress and frustration as the older person becomes more and more dependent. In others, a caregiver's dependence on the older person for accommodation or financial support may be a source of conflict and vice versa. Social isolation is a significant risk factor to an older person suffering mistreatment. Many elderly people are isolated because of physical or mental infirmities or through the loss of friends and family members.

In Canada, seniors are most likely to be abused by someone they know. Canadians seem to understand that. In an EKOS survey in 2009, respondents felt that most frequent abusers were a family member other than a spouse at 62%, and paid caregivers in an institution at 46%.

Knowing what we know about elder abuse and its prevalence, I am wondering what the government plans to do to actually prevent the abuse from happening in the first place. We do indeed need a plan to ensure that our seniors are able to live in dignity and have the financial security to make the choices that determine how they want to live their lives. The government did have a program in place, the elder abuse awareness initiative. While not addressing the root causes of elder abuse, it at least attempted to bring the issue to the forefront. However, the program has ended now and we are left only with the bill on the table before us.

I want to make it perfectly clear that the bill alone would do very little to prevent elder abuse in Canada. It is a step in the right direction and I suppose no matter how small that is it is a good thing. However, without other initiatives such as an elder abuse hotline, elder abuse consultants and a strategy to deal with the root causes of elder abuse, I am afraid the bill would only allow for harsher sentencing and not prevent the abuse in the first place.

In addition to the fallacy of harsher sentencing is the reality that abusers are rarely caught. We need better training for police officers to be able to spot abuse in the first place. Seniors are very hesitant to speak of what is happening to them, often because they fear identifying someone in their family or circle of friends as the abuser.

We heard from law enforcement officials that police officers need better training to allow them to secure the trust of an abused senior so that real remedies can be pursued. Prevention should be our first goal. For starters, prevention is much less expensive than the mounting costs of emergency health care, courts, lawyers and jails. Crass numbers aside, our main concern must be for the dignity of human life and preventing anyone from facing the long, hard road of abuse.

We owe it to our elders to ensure they have a retirement that has dignity. They have worked so hard building this country and are continuing to shape its future. How we treat our elders is indicative of who we are as a society. If we treat our elders poorly, then we are doing a disservice to Canada and Canadians. Our seniors deserve better. Our families deserve better.

I thank the House for its time and indulgence this evening and will reiterate what is required: financial security. That means not reducing OAS by eliminating the age of retirement at 65, and introducing affordable home care and accessible long-term care. In other words, it means all of the things that are not happening in this country.

Protecting Canada's Seniors ActGovernment Orders

5:45 p.m.

NDP

Françoise Boivin NDP Gatineau, QC

Mr. Speaker, I would first like to thank my colleague, who has also done wonderful work to promote a senior's right to a decent standard of living in our great country.

I agree with everything she said in her speech. She is concerned that this bill might lead to harsher sentences. I would be tempted to tell her about my own concern, which is that Bill C-36 will be a total waste of time and will not achieve its goal. I would like her to comment on that.

The bill talks about a significant impact on the victim. Crown prosecutors will rarely use that section; they will not demonstrate that the offence had a significant impact on the elderly victim. The seriousness of the offence and the fact that it targeted an elderly person will be totally pushed aside, because prosecutors will be unable to prove there was a significant impact on the victim.

It is not worrisome to see another fine effort that will accomplish absolutely nothing, yet again, despite all the work the committees have done on seniors issues?

Protecting Canada's Seniors ActGovernment Orders

5:45 p.m.

NDP

Irene Mathyssen NDP London—Fanshawe, ON

Mr. Speaker, I am so very afraid that she is absolutely right. We spend a lot time looking at government bills that are meant to keep us busy, meant to create the illusion that something is happening.

The reality is that very few seniors report abuse because they have to live in the home of their abusers. Otherwise, they have nowhere to go because their financial security is such that they are dependent. It may be a child or a grandchild that is the abuser. Seniors are very hesitant to tell anyone that someone that they love and trusted is committing this kind of crime.

Finally, of course, we need to provide the training for police officers so that they can take the time. Seniors do not just call up and say, “By the way I'm being abused”. It takes a great deal of time, trust and discussion between an officer and a victim before anything can be pursued. Therefore, additional sentences just simply are not going to work.

Protecting Canada's Seniors ActGovernment Orders

5:45 p.m.

NDP

Alexandrine Latendresse NDP Louis-Saint-Laurent, QC

Mr. Speaker, I would like to thank my colleague, who is doing an excellent job on this file.

I very much liked her speech and would like to pick up on one aspect of it that can apply to many issues the Conservatives are dealing with quite poorly, in my opinion.

Once again, we have a bill that deals with a serious issue by targeting people after the harm has already been done. There is no mention of prevention. As my exceptional colleague from London—Fanshawe said a moment ago, one of the best ways to prevent elder abuse is to help seniors stay at home as long as possible, be independent and not have to rely on anyone else. That is one of the best ways to make sure such situations do not arise.

The Conservatives took the same approach with bill C-10, that focused on punishment and added new sections to the Criminal Code. That is all well and good, but should we not spend more time talking about prevention and make it so that situations such as these do not arise in the first place?

I would appreciate my colleague's views on that.

Protecting Canada's Seniors ActGovernment Orders

5:50 p.m.

NDP

Irene Mathyssen NDP London—Fanshawe, ON

Mr. Speaker, my colleague is absolutely right. Prevention has to be at the centre of this because prevention means stopping the hurt before it happens. What would any one of us not give to ensure that a hurt that damages a life never happens? After the fact is too late.

She mentioned prevention in regard to home care. Absolutely, seniors need to have that option. I would like to see the federal government invest in real home care instead of playing around and actually cutting the resources to our health care system, such as $36 billion in the future.

I would also like to see the federal government work with the provinces to start talking about long-term care, the kind of care that we should have in nursing homes. Unfortunately, far too many nursing homes are driven by profit. The care, particularly in Ontario, has declined significantly over the years. That is another form of abuse.

Protecting Canada's Seniors ActGovernment Orders

5:50 p.m.

NDP

Mylène Freeman NDP Argenteuil—Papineau—Mirabel, QC

Mr. Speaker, this issue is very important to me. Since I was elected, my work as a member of Parliament has made me very much aware of the enormous challenges that Canadian seniors face, such as violence, negligence and abuse. These are very complex problems.

This bill seeks to ensure that sentencing reflects vulnerability factors in the situations of seniors who are victims of crime, such as their age and other aspects of their personal situation such as health and finances. All these factors would be considered aggravating circumstances for sentencing purposes. This responds in part to demands the NDP made during the last election, in 2011. Unfortunately, the bill does not entirely solve the problem, and I will speak about that a little later in my speech.

The population of Argenteuil—Papineau—Mirabel is aging. Despite the fact that the rural municipalities I represent are strong communities consisting of engaged citizens who take the time to help their neighbours and the people in their community, the fact remains that it is hard to grow old in places where it is hard to access health care and services for seniors.

Elder abuse is a reality. When my constituents request legal or medical aid, or assistance in remaining independent, such as housing or money, for example, they are told all too often that there are excessive delays and that there is not enough funding for housing facilities. There is also a lack of training for workers in the legal system on how to handle elder abuse cases. A number of problems arise as seniors work their way through the system to regain their independence, something they are entitled to do. It is very disappointing to see that the system does not help those people.

I have heard from expert witnesses and seniors on the front line combating violence against seniors. When the Standing Committee on the Status of Women looked into this matter, it heard from several organizations that do excellent work in the field. They included the National Initiative for the Care of the Elderly, the Canadian Network for the Prevention of Elder Abuse, the Advocacy Centre for the Elderly and the Réseau FADOQ.

Those prominent stakeholders agreed that people who abuse seniors do not receive appropriate sentences and that judges should be asked to consider the age and vulnerability of the victim. Several other witnesses talked about other aspects that are important to assess. Merely providing for adequate sentences will not solve the problem. To really address the problem of elder abuse, all stakeholders will have to work together to prevent such abuses.

All seniors, regardless of culture, gender or income, may become victims of abuse. This is a problem that affects all segments of society. However, some social determinants such as income, social status, gender, education and housing security may leave an individual more vulnerable to abuse. Older women are more often victims of abuse. This is not necessarily because they are physically weaker than men their age but rather because poverty and housing insecurity are more serious problems for all women.

This affects older women because it affects all women. All women have a lower income than men their age. It is therefore a generalized problem.

So as women grow older, they have an income problem and a problem with access to housing. These are the kinds of issues we should be discussing, because the percentage is higher among women and there are many more elderly women because of their longer life expectancy.

I firmly believe that the independence of seniors is essential if we are to end discrimination and systemic abuse. If that is how we treat our grandparents, it says a lot about who we are. If we ignore this systemic problem and do not give them the pensions they deserve, then our society has a problem. Housing insecurity is a problem for many seniors. That is why we need a national housing strategy. We asked for it during the last election. It should be part of this specific amendment to the bill. We believe that the response to this problem should be coordinated with all sectors of society that are involved and all levels of government. Some provincial initiatives have been helping seniors get out of situations in which they are abused or neglected. Above all, public awareness of the importance of the issue is essential.

Major efforts are being made in my riding. For example, the seniors' round table in Argenteuil performs a play in the Laurentians called Faudrait pas prendre grand-mère pour une dinde et grand-père pour son dindon, meaning do not make the mistake of thinking grandma is a silly goose and grandpa is her gander. It is an excellent play whose purpose is to break the silence around abuse, to raise awareness among young people by performing the play in schools, to condemn the widespread infantilization of seniors and to recommend tools they can use to protect themselves. The play will be presented in schools so that young people can understand the issue, and it will also be performed in retirement homes. Workers will also be present to explain that help is available if they ever want to free themselves from abusive situations.

The government created the federal elder abuse initiative, but funding for the program ended last year. Its role was to develop awareness campaigns to ensure that people could recognize and report elder abuse. It was a good start, but unfortunately no more than a first step. The program should have been allowed to continue.

But that is just the first step. The government really has to address elder abuse and neglect. Programs that support independence and personal freedom should be introduced, rather than punitive and paternalistic programs based strictly on legislation. Ageism is the underlying cause of neglect and abuse. Training is needed throughout the judicial and social system if stakeholders are to be able to help elders escape their situations.

This would not necessarily be a compulsory whistleblowing system. It is important to understand that people might be in situations in which they do not wish to report their assailant because he is a family member.

As I was saying, it is an extremely complex issue. The bill is nothing more than a starting point, and I hope that more will be done to prevent elder abuse.

Protecting Canada's Seniors ActGovernment Orders

6 p.m.

NDP

Raymond Côté NDP Beauport—Limoilou, QC

Mr. Speaker, I would like to thank the member for Argenteuil—Papineau—Mirabel for her clear depiction of all the complex issues in elder abuse.

She also made a very good point when she raised the issue of elderly women in particular because, the older women get, the more they become the majority in their age bracket. In addition to their own specific situations, there is the simple fact that their numbers force us to consider their particular situation.

Further to the member's speech, as I am well aware that her riding is quite large and has a large rural component—a reality that has been raised by a number of my colleagues—I wondered if she could give us a few more details about the challenges that seniors face in her riding, in particular. I must admit that her description of a number of specific local and quite extraordinary initiatives was very interesting.

Protecting Canada's Seniors ActGovernment Orders

6 p.m.

NDP

Mylène Freeman NDP Argenteuil—Papineau—Mirabel, QC

Mr. Speaker, it is clear that in a rural area and sometimes even in an urban environment, but primarily in a small town quite far from any services, life is extremely difficult for seniors. If you can perhaps no longer drive your car, it is extremely difficult to maintain your autonomy, because there is no public transportation. It is difficult to get to medical care.

If you are a woman, as I was saying, you are much more likely to be poor. This is primarily because of the inequalities that continue to exist in terms of pay equity in our society. Therefore, when you are an elderly woman, you have a lot less money. That is why it is so important to maintain and even increase pensions, the guaranteed income supplement, old age security and so on. These are extremely important programs because, frankly, they help people who might otherwise lose their independence. This is what these programs are for. They exist to help these people.

Protecting Canada's Seniors ActGovernment Orders

6:05 p.m.

NDP

Pierre Jacob NDP Brome—Missisquoi, QC

Mr. Speaker, I want to thank my colleague from Argenteuil—Papineau—Mirabel for her very instructive speech.

Unfortunately, I must again burst the Conservatives' bubble and tell them that their solution, that is, Bill C-36, is only a very partial response to a very complex problem. Once again, they are putting the cart before the horse. By focusing on punishment alone, they are not really attacking the problem. We want to minimize the number of victims. A comprehensive strategy is needed.

I would like the member for Argenteuil—Papineau—Mirabel to tell me how a comprehensive solution could prevent elder abuse.

Protecting Canada's Seniors ActGovernment Orders

6:05 p.m.

NDP

Mylène Freeman NDP Argenteuil—Papineau—Mirabel, QC

Mr. Speaker, I thank my hon. colleague for his intervention. As we have said, it is an extremely complicated issue. The whole issue has been studied at the Standing Committee on the Status of Women. I do not believe that we were able to address all of the problems that can lead to elder abuse. We really need to find complex solutions.

Old age security must not be slashed. The Conservatives say one thing and do the opposite. Action must also be taken to help seniors remain in their homes, to increase pensions—as I was saying—to guarantee a minimum level of care at home and to attack the national shortage of high-quality long-term care facilities.

Protecting Canada's Seniors ActGovernment Orders

6:05 p.m.

NDP

Charlie Angus NDP Timmins—James Bay, ON

Mr. Speaker, it is a great honour to speak in the House to this bill. It is a very important issue for the New Democratic Party caucus and something I take very seriously.

The greatest influence on my life was my grandmother who came from the Hawkhill in Dundee. She was a miner's widow in Timmins and pretty much raised me. My grandmother was very passionate about seniors' issues. She used to talk about what she called the “poor wee wifies”, the immigrant mining women whose husbands died. There were no pensions in those days. Women faded into the background in any mining town across northern Ontario and northern Quebec and lived in poverty. My grandmother always spoke about the dignity of senior citizens. In fact, my grandmother was the first New Democrat I knew because every month when she got her seniors cheque, she would come upstairs and tell me that the NDP fought for the pension. That is where I learned some of my first lessons.

We are in support of this bill going forward because this comes out of the New Democratic Party election platform of 2011. We know that the Conservative trolls study our election platform very closely, except that they mostly try to misrepresent it, get things wrong, make things up and say absolute complete untruths about all manners of things in it. However, they finally read something in our platform, which is what we have been pushing for, a strategy on elder abuse. Unfortunately, they could not concentrate enough to notice that we had a much broader platform for dealing with seniors issues, something they have dropped the ball on entirely.

We are now dealing with only one piece of the puzzle. There are elements of it that are important but we need to look at the issue of elder abuse in terms of the larger picture, which are the issues that we in the New Democratic caucus have talked about, such as protecting pensions. When I first heard that the government would protect senior citizens, I thought they would protect them from people stealing their pensions, like what has happened under the OAS. We in the New Democratic caucus believe that senior citizens deserve the right to retire at 65 and that they are not a problem, unlike the Prime Minister who told the millionaires in Davos that, in his view, Canada had a problem and that problem was senior citizens. That is a very shameful thing to say and I am shocked that he said it to the Davos millionaires and did not have the nerve to say it to Canadian seniors when he was campaigning.

We believe that we need adequate pensions, which is a base issue. We believe we need proper social housing for seniors, especially in large rural ridings like mine where seniors are living in old farmhouses that have oil tanks that they cannot afford to fill, where their kids have moved south and there is no proper social housing for them. If they do get into social housing, their entire pensions go toward paying room and board and they have nothing else to live on, which means that their quality of life is then affected. We need to ensure that seniors can move into proper housing with the proper supports and sufficient pensions to live their lives with dignity.

We believe there needs to be a strategy for palliative care and for support for families dealing with loved ones who have dementia or Alzheimer's. We hear many horror stories of elder abuse but the real stories are the small ones, the friction that happens within families because of the pressures they are under when they do not have the resources to help a loved one, a father or mother, suffering from dementia. These are the issues that affect Canadians on a day-to-day basis. The government can certainly pull horror stories of abuse off of the back pages of newspapers. They exist and we certainly believe the Criminal Code should be brought to bear, but, more often than not, abuses happen because of the kind of pressure families are under and we need a coherent plan to address that.

The other issue that seniors face is fraud, which the ethics committee has been studying. We know that data breaches are happening that actually profile individuals. There are massive cyber gangs in Ukraine, Nigeria, et cetera, that are actually able to target individual seniors because of data breaches. We all have a responsibility to look at that. I want to praise my colleagues in all parties on the ethics committee for the work being done to address this. Seniors are using the Internet more and more and we know that fraudsters are targeting them, so we need a coherent strategy to protect them from fraud.

There is a sense of humiliation and shame if people have been defrauded. They do not want to tell their kids that they lost some money or that they got caught up in one of these scams. These scams are really sophisticated and they are getting more sophisticated now because of their ability to gather individual data from citizens. That is another issue that needs to be added in when we look at this.

We are talking about the need to deal with elder abuse. Elder abuse happens in a number of forms. It happens in the form of criminal violence and in the form of the same kind of abuses we see against other victims, but it is also different because, in many ways, it is familial. Simply saying that we will increase mandatory minimum sentences for this kind of crime is a blunt instrument. If there is serious abuse happening, of course we want the judges to have whatever discretion they need to render the sentence that is due, but more often than not, we are seeing, within familial relations, the kinds of pressures that are financial and the kinds of pressure with a loved one.

I remember my wonderful grandfather, MacNeil, my mother's father, who was a brilliant man. He had never gone to school but he was a hard-working miner. He started to suffer dementia as he got older, which had an effect on my grandmother who was trying to look after him in a little house in Timmins without family around and without support. Those are the kind of pressures that we see and seniors see.

There has been a number of great organizations, the health authorities that have come forward, and the work that the palliative care committee did on these issues that we can draw from and actually come together within all parties and look at a coherent strategy.

I want to talk about the Canadian Association of Retired Persons, CARP. CARP has done excellent work in advocating for seniors. Susan Eng spoke out saying:

As a society, we're now far more open to talking about the hidden crimes of spousal abuse and child abuse. Now we need to do the same for elder abuse. …the current law is clearly not robust enough to signal society's abhorrence for this crime.

I think this is something on which we would all agree. In fact, the New Democratic Party is very proud of the work of CARP.

We noticed recently that CARP was attacked by the Conservative government for being what it called a partisan front. I personally find it shocking that an organization that does such good work on behalf of seniors would be attacked by the government. However, it was attacked because the government was feeling the heat on its decisions to steal the pension of seniors under the OAS revisions. I will quote the words of our leader, the leader of the official opposition. He said:

CARP is not to blame for the backlash Conservatives are getting from seniors. The Prime Minister is to blame.

When we hear CARP speaking to issues of elder abuse or to issues of financial security for seniors, we all need to take note. It is a serious issue.

The issues that we are dealing with in terms of support at the family level, the federal government has really been missing in action. The provinces are doing what they can but we have seen the quality of care dropping year after year. It is not the fault of the people working in the homes but we see the inability of seniors to get home care. We see within the institutions the pressure that the nurses and the caregivers are under, and so support starts to drop. That is where people end up having the accidents, the broken hips, the injuries that just destroy whatever quality of life they have remaining. It is the gaps in the system that start to form and the victims are the seniors. Then, within this, is the other element of elder abuse.

A couple of years back in Timmins, we held a forum on Alzheimer's. The issue of Alzheimer's and the need for a national coherent strategy on Alzheimer's is another piece of the puzzle. I am not saying that people who have Alzheimer's will be victimized, but there is pressure on families, especially families in crisis when an individual has Alzheimer's and the lack of a coherent strategy. There is also the issue of dementia, especially when the dementia has not been recognized yet. These are things we all need to look at in terms of how we ensure that we have the proper resources, whether it is at the federal level or at the provincial level.

The New Democrats will be supporting taking the bill to committee. We do believe there are some problems with the bill. Obviously, there are some problems with the bill, it is a Conservative bill. Problem is their middle name.

We want to address and fix some of the problems with the bill but we think it is important to send the message that elder abuse is an abhorrent crime. We need to give families the support they need to ensure that senior citizens, or anyone as they age, have the support they need to live in the dignity they deserve.

Protecting Canada's Seniors ActGovernment Orders

6:15 p.m.

NDP

Robert Aubin NDP Trois-Rivières, QC

Mr. Speaker, once again, I very much appreciated the speech given by another one of my colleagues. It brought the following question to mind and I will rely on his experience to provide an interpretation.

I have been sitting here for hours and have just heard the eighth or ninth intervention from a member on this side of the House. Of course, there is a great deal of consistency in our positions. How am I to interpret the radio silence coming from our friends opposite? Are they avoiding the debate because they believe the bill before us today cannot be perfected, or are they trying to find a new way to muzzle the opposition, out of arrogance?

Protecting Canada's Seniors ActGovernment Orders

6:15 p.m.

NDP

Charlie Angus NDP Timmins—James Bay, ON

Mr. Speaker, I find that to be an interesting observation. I was noticing it myself all day. Earlier, when dealing with a bill addressing the danger of nuclear terrorism, I could hear the sounds of sleeping on the Conservative benches. Nobody was getting up to speak.

The issue of elder abuse is a serious issue but we are hearing radio silence from the other side. It is as though they have misunderstood the role of this Parliament.

Parliament exists to debate serious issues. We are all to come together to debate and find a better way forward. The Conservatives tend to use Parliament as a way of putting out spin, misinformation or whatever the latest lie is that comes out of the PMO's talking points. They think that is the role of Parliament. It is not. It is actually an abuse of the parliamentary tradition.

I thank my hon. colleague for pointing out that, once again, when we get a serious issue here, all the Conservatives take a pass. However, if it is some kind of idiotic speech that is given by the backbenchers, they just cannot wait to get in queue.

To bring up the level of debate, I would encourage the Conservatives to get a little more involved.

Protecting Canada's Seniors ActGovernment Orders

6:20 p.m.

NDP

Irene Mathyssen NDP London—Fanshawe, ON

Mr. Speaker, I would like my colleague to touch upon two things.

First, he mentioned the incredible people who give of their time, love and energy to work in nursing homes. However, very often they are poorly compensated, there are too few of them because the employer does not provide enough workers, and there are too few hours spent per senior.

Second, this is the only country in the G7, except for Japan, that does not have a national housing program. One of the things we hear over and over again is that decent affordable housing is key to every family managing and having dignity in their life and in their future, and that goes for seniors too.

I would like to hear the member's thoughts on those two aspects.

Protecting Canada's Seniors ActGovernment Orders

6:20 p.m.

NDP

Charlie Angus NDP Timmins—James Bay, ON

Mr. Speaker, I thank the hon. member for London—Fanshawe for being such a passionate advocate on seniors' issues over the last number of years that I have been honoured to work with her.

We have a number of shortfalls in the overall system. Part of it is federal and part of it is provincial. There is the issue of a lack of access to home care. When people do not have the proper home care they need, they have accidents, such as a broken hip, and end up in emergency. However, there is no place to put them and the emergency rooms are backed-up.

When I go into my communities of Englehart, Kirkland Lake, Larder Lake, Cochrane, Timmins and Iroquois Falls, I hear from seniors all the time. There is no housing for them to move into. They cannot afford the places they are staying in and they cannot move into places with dignity. We see this issue of the need to have enough qualified staff to be there to work for them when they are no longer able to stay in their houses.

Yes, this is a big issue and I am glad that we are debating it within the House. Obviously, it seems to be a discussion only among New Democrats, but we have always been the party that has said that seniors are a major priority. No wonder my grandmother was such a strong New Democrat.

Protecting Canada's Seniors ActGovernment Orders

6:20 p.m.

NDP

Jamie Nicholls NDP Vaudreuil—Soulanges, QC

Mr. Speaker, while I commend the hon. member for his speech, it is a question of the priorities of the Conservative government when it comes to spending on important things like senior care.

We had in our platform, in 2011, a home care transfer and a long-term care transfer. The costing of those things sounds expensive; each one was about $500 million. However, when we think about the hundreds of millions of dollars that government has spent on advertising, the $664 million it spent on G8 and G20 summits, the $50 million for the legacy fund that benefited the member from Muskoka, we have to question where the priorities of the government are.

When we say there is a need for a long-term care transfer or transfers for our seniors, the government says it does not have the money to do this. Then we see this profligate spending on advertising, legacy funds and 1812 celebrations.

Could my colleague address the difference in priorities of the two parties, which has been underlined today by the silence on the government side?

Protecting Canada's Seniors ActGovernment Orders

6:20 p.m.

NDP

Charlie Angus NDP Timmins—James Bay, ON

Mr. Speaker, I want to thank my hon. colleague for the excellent question.

I want to say to the folks back home, “Get used to it. This is what it is going to look like in 2015 when we have finally gotten rid of the Conservatives. They have abandoned the field to discussion.”

The Conservatives cannot get up and make misrepresentations, so they really do not know what else to talk about. We could be talking about, I suppose, flying limousines for the Prime Minister, hanging out at the Taj Mahal. We could talk about their priorities of taking $50 million in border infrastructure money and blowing it in a slush fund. That is their idea of priorities.

We could talk about the F-35. Well, we are not supposed to talk about the F-35 because they are not sure if it is the F-35 anymore. They were going to have a $10 billion overrun on 65 planes, and then they were going to try to keep it from the Canadian people.

Meanwhile the Conservatives are not interested in the real priorities, for example, getting the transfers for home care for seniors. The hon. Jack Layton, before he died, in the election of 2011, made his one commitment to seniors, that we would pass a bill to get every senior in this country out of poverty. The cost was $700 million. That might seem like a lot, but that is probably not even the cost of replacing the engine in one of the F-35s, because I hear they are not coming with engines.

It is a question of choices. This is what politics is about. It is a question of choices. We have a government that uses its choices again and again to blow money on its friends, to give breaks, to misrepresent facts, to use its time in the House of Commons, not to discuss important issues but to try to misrepresent and fool the Canadian people.

The New Democratic Party has been talking about these issues consistently and coherently. Canadians know that when we are talking about the issues of senior citizens, it is not just that we are going to bring in a mandatory minimum sentence and change the Criminal Code.

We have to have a coherent vision to ensure that, not only can we address criminalization against seniors and their victimization, but that we will have a strategy for fraud that is proactive. We will have a strategy for home care. We will actually have the transfers to the provinces, to ensure the Canadian health system remains something that we can all be proud of, and that it does not continue to deteriorate, as has happened all too often across this country.

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6:25 p.m.

Liberal

Scott Brison Liberal Kings—Hants, NS

Mr. Speaker, I have a question for the member about the obvious inconsistency in the NDP platform. It is against elder abuse, and yet at the same time it wants to abolish the Senate. However, I am not going to go there.

On a more serious note, would the hon. member agree with me that making the caregiver tax credit fully refundable, such that it would help low-income families, would go a long way to helping those families and a lot of Canadians who are struggling with loved ones and seniors who need help at home?

Second, would the hon. member agree that Canada should develop a more robust national Alzheimer's strategy? We are one of the few countries in the industrialized world without a strong national strategy around Alzheimer's.

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6:25 p.m.

NDP

Charlie Angus NDP Timmins—James Bay, ON

Mr. Speaker, I welcome my colleague from the Liberals to this discussion. It is now between us and the Liberals to discuss these important issues. The Conservatives have all gone to sleep over there.

We need a national Alzheimer's strategy. It is very important. Instead of Conservatives wasting time with attack ads and misrepresentations, I would invite them to actually get serious about some of these issues for a change.

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6:25 p.m.

NDP

The Deputy Speaker NDP Joe Comartin

Resuming debate. Is the House ready for the question?

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6:25 p.m.

Some hon. members

Question.

Protecting Canada's Seniors ActGovernment Orders

6:25 p.m.

NDP

The Deputy Speaker NDP Joe Comartin

The question is on the motion. Is it the pleasure of the House to adopt the motion?