Debates of Dec. 12th, 2012

National Defence

[Christine Moore, NDP, Abitibi—Témiscamingue, QC]

Mr. Speaker, the leaks to the media about the KPMG cost audit and the cabinet discussions do not in any way change what is really happening: the Conservatives are once again making arrangements to have a single supplier replace the CF-18s.

They told us that the statement of operational requirements that was tailored to the F-35 would be set aside, but are the Conservatives going to commit to presenting a new statement of operational requirements in order to finally implement a real tendering process?

[Rona Ambrose, Conservative, Minister of Public Works and Government Services and Minister for Status of Women]

Mr. Speaker, as members know, the National Fighter Procurement Secretariat is set up to manage this process. It is working on meeting the Auditor General's recommendation, which was for the Department of National Defence to update Parliament and Canadians on the cost estimates for the F-35. Furthermore, its ongoing work will be to do a full options analysis to ensure that we get the right plane at the right cost for the Royal Canadian Air Force.

[Matthew Kellway, NDP, Beaches—East York, ON]

Mr. Speaker,

You can dance, you can sing

Like a puppet on a string

But you ain't in control of a single thing

It is “Crazy Talk”, Mr. Speaker. Chilliwack could have been singing about a whole bunch of them over there, but most notably, of late, the Parliamentary Secretary to the Minister of National Defence. He has been doing his duty, repeating the PMO talking lines, revising history, championing secrecy, and generally misleading Canadians.

When will the Conservatives embrace accountability and hold an open competition?

[Rona Ambrose, Conservative, Minister of Public Works and Government Services and Minister for Status of Women]

Mr. Speaker, as I have explained to the member before, and if he is familiar with the procurement process, we are in a pre-acquisition phase. We have hit restart on this process, and we are doing a full options analysis. The secretariat will be undertaking this full options analysis. Until that is complete, until we have the full costs for the aircraft, we will not move forward with an acquisition.

[Matthew Kellway, NDP, Beaches—East York, ON]

Mr. Speaker, the Minister of Public Works, with the F-35 has now “lost that loving feeling”, while the Minister of National Defence has “been through the desert on a horse with no [plane]”.

The Prime Minister and his merry band of travellers have been misleading Canadians for years on rising costs, on the lack of industrial benefits and on the engineering flaws. If they are serious about looking at other options, will they stand up now and tell us which other planes they are looking at to replace our CF-18s?

[Rona Ambrose, Conservative, Minister of Public Works and Government Services and Minister for Status of Women]

Mr. Speaker, as the member knows, the National Fighter Procurement Secretariat is set up to manage this process. It will be the one undertaking the full options analysis, and its work will be made public.

[Matthew Kellway, NDP, Beaches—East York, ON]

Mr. Speaker, since they have set aside the statement of requirements, and they are going out visiting some showrooms, will they consider the Saab Gripen? It has a maximum speed of Mach 2, a combat radius of 800 kilometres, and a thrust-to-weight ratio of 0.97. Is that being considered by the Conservatives?

[Rona Ambrose, Conservative, Minister of Public Works and Government Services and Minister for Status of Women]

Mr. Speaker, I feel strongly about the integrity and independence of the work being done by the National Fighter Procurement Secretariat. It will undertake the cost and capability analysis of all the fighter aircraft options that are out there to replace the CF-18s. We look forward to its work, and I am sure it will call in all of the expertise needed to do that analysis.

[Christine Moore, NDP, Abitibi—Témiscamingue, QC]

Mr. Speaker, the question seemed simple to me.

Are the Conservatives considering any fighter jets other than the F-35?

For example, the Dassault Rafale has a maximum speed of Mach 1.8, a combat radius of 925 km and a thrust to weight ratio of 1.1.

Are the Conservatives considering that option?

[Rona Ambrose, Conservative, Minister of Public Works and Government Services and Minister for Status of Women]

Mr. Speaker, as I indicated, the National Fighter Procurement Secretariat will be the one doing the full options analysis. I have complete confidence in the integrity and due diligence of the group doing the work. I am sure that when it does the full options analysis in looking at the costs and capabilities of all of the aircraft available to replace the CF-18, it will call on the necessary expertise when needed.

[Christine Moore, NDP, Abitibi—Témiscamingue, QC]

Mr. Speaker, it is fascinating to see just how difficult it is to get a clear answer to a simple question.

Are the Conservatives considering any fighter jets other than the F-35? For example, the Eurofighter has a maximum speed of Mach 2, a combat radius of 601 km and a thrust to weight ratio of 1.25.

Are the Conservatives considering that option?

[Rona Ambrose, Conservative, Minister of Public Works and Government Services and Minister for Status of Women]

Mr. Speaker, as I have indicated, we are in the pre-acquisition phase at this point. We have hit reset on this process. The National Fighter Procurement Secretariat is doing the due diligence necessary to ensure that a full options analysis will be undertaken. I am sure that it will call on the expertise necessary to do the full technical analysis of the aircraft available to replace the CF-18.

[Matthew Kellway, NDP, Beaches—East York, ON]

Mr. Speaker, let us see again if the Conservatives know where they are going with this.

How about the Boeing Super Hornet? It has a maximum speed Mach 1.8, a combat radius of 722 kilometres and a thrust-to-weight ratio of 0.93. Is that being considered by the Conservatives?

[Rona Ambrose, Conservative, Minister of Public Works and Government Services and Minister for Status of Women]

Mr. Speaker, as I said, the National Fighter Procurement Secretariat is in charge of doing the due diligence necessary. It will be undertaking a full options analysis. I am sure that it will call on the necessary experts to provide the technical expertise. Perhaps the member could give it some advice.

[Jack Harris, NDP, St. John's East, NL]

Mr. Speaker, again and again we get no answers and the Minister of National Defence sits there refusing to even answer questions, refusing to answer for misleading Canadians on the F-35 for the past two years or for why the Department of National Defence is so single-minded about its love for sole sourcing. He once even said that there was a contract for the F-35s and that any number other than $9 billion was being made up.

Is the minister now ready to stand up and apologize for making the largest procurement fiasco in Canadian history?

[Rona Ambrose, Conservative, Minister of Public Works and Government Services and Minister for Status of Women]

Mr. Speaker, there has been no one in the House who has stood by and stood up for our Canadian armed forces more than the present Minister of National Defence.

I will just remind the hon. member that one of the things the Auditor General did say was that no money was misspent. Why is that? It is because no money has been spent.

[Jack Harris, NDP, St. John's East, NL]

Mr. Speaker, the minister does not seem to be able to stand up for himself.

The Minister of National Defence once boasted that the F-35 was the best and only aircraft for the Royal Canadian Air Force. He once even entered the cockpit and mugged for the cameras.

The defence minister is the one responsible for the replacement of the aging CF-18s. Does he stand by his claim that the F-35 is the only plane, or will he apologize to Canadians for misleading them?

[Rona Ambrose, Conservative, Minister of Public Works and Government Services and Minister for Status of Women]

Mr. Speaker, as soon as the Auditor General's report was tabled and he raised concerns, we immediately took action to reset this process. We have put in place the National Fighter Procurement Secretariat, which is managing this process. That includes independent oversight, which is very important. It will ensure that we get maximum due diligence in the decision-making process leading up to the acquisition of the aircraft to replace the CF-18s.

[John McKay, Liberal, Scarborough—Guildwood, ON]

Mr. Speaker, the Minister of National Defence said:

—let us look at the actual contract. What the Canadian government has committed to is a $9 billion contract for the acquisition of 65...aircraft.

Since there never was a contract and may never be a contract, and since the government has lost all confidence in the Minister of National Defence, as point one of the Minister of Public Works' seven-point plan, will the minister who speaks for the Minister of National Defence apologize for her colleague's contempt of Parliament and ask him to resign?

[Rona Ambrose, Conservative, Minister of Public Works and Government Services and Minister for Status of Women]

Mr. Speaker, that is ridiculous. The Minister of National Defence has done an outstanding job and we are all very proud of him.

There has been no money spent on the acquisition of any new aircraft. As soon as the government received the Auditor General's report, we hit reset on this process. We are undertaking a transparent process to ensure that we have the full cost of aircraft to replace the CF-18. We are doing a full options analysis to ensure that we have all of the information on cost and capability.

[Denis Coderre, Liberal, Bourassa, QC]

Mr. Speaker, the only thing about the F-35 that is working is the ejector seat because, since the Minister of National Defence sat on it, he has been missing in action. The fighter jets are clearly not the only thing that can be stealthy around here.

It is not complicated. The F-35s were supposed to cost $9 billion. This amount increased to $29 billion and now they are going to cost $40 billion or $45 billion. We should have had $9 billion in economic spinoffs, but now we will not even break even.

When will the Prime Minister do the honourable thing by kicking his minister out of cabinet and replacing him?

[Rona Ambrose, Conservative, Minister of Public Works and Government Services and Minister for Status of Women]

Mr. Speaker, the Auditor General also said that no money was misspent and that is because no money has been spent on the acquisition of any fighter aircraft. We have pressed reset on this process. We have established the secretariat to manage the process moving forward. It is ensuring that there is transparency and due diligence in the decision making leading up to replacing our CF-18s. We look forward to that work and we will not be making an acquisition until all of that work is done.

[Judy Foote, Liberal, Random—Burin—St. George's, NL]

Mr. Speaker, for two years Liberals stood up and opposed Conservative plans to sole source the CF-18 replacement. For two years the Prime Minister and the Minister of National Defence attacked the patriotism of anyone who dared question the cost of the F-35. The Prime Minister fought an election stating, “the contract we've signed shelters us from any increase”. He now admits there never was a contract. The F-35 represents Conservative deceit and incompetence.

When will the Prime Minister fire his defence minister and finally agree to hold an open and competitive transparent competition?

[Rona Ambrose, Conservative, Minister of Public Works and Government Services and Minister for Status of Women]

Mr. Speaker, I would remind the hon. member that it was actually the Liberal government in 1997 that signed the MOU to be a member of the JSF—

[Some hon. members]

Oh, oh!