Debates of Nov. 7th, 2013

Ethics

[Thomas Mulcair, NDP, Leader of the Opposition]

Good, bad—some progress.

Mr. Speaker, does the Prime Minister remember saying about Paul Martin at the height of the sponsorship scandal that, and I quote, “I don't think he's been forthcoming and honest on fairly simple questions when there appear to be contradictions...”.

Does he remember once thinking that?

[Stephen Harper, Conservative, Prime Minister]

Mr. Speaker, the Leader of the Opposition refers to a matter in which $40 million was taken due to the actions of a political party from the coffers of the taxpayers, and that money, for the most part, still has not been located.

In this case, certain senators made claims that we do not believe were right or legitimate. We know that was done. We have taken action to ensure that those who did that have been held accountable.

[Dominic LeBlanc, Liberal, Beauséjour, NB]

Mr. Speaker, the government falsely told the House on several occasions that there were no documents linking the Prime Minister's Office to Mike Duffy's payoff. We now know that that is not true and that the RCMP is investigating potentially criminal conduct by some PMO staffers.

In the documents handed over to the RCMP, was there a document from Chris Woodcock, former senior advisor to the Prime Minister, suggesting that Mike Duffy lie?

[Paul Calandra, Conservative, Parliamentary Secretary to the Prime Minister and for Intergovernmental Affairs]

Mr. Speaker, as the Prime Minister just said, we are continuing to work with the authorities on this matter.

The Prime Minister's office is under no investigation. We are very happy that finally Senator Duffy has decided to co-operate with the RCMP and provide that information.

At the same time, I am sure Canadians are as disappointed as I am that the Liberals fought for the status quo in the Senate and refused to respect taxpayers by supporting those motions. We know how hard the Liberals fought for the status quo and how they ignored Canadian taxpayers.

We are proud that on this side of the House we fought for, and the Senate fought for, and received those suspensions.

[Ralph Goodale, Liberal, Wascana, SK]

Mr. Speaker, another stonewall. Why can Canadians not get a straight answer? Are the police investigating Chris Woodcock's emails?

Canadians can only assume the answer is yes. The allegation that Duffy was coached to lie and that the coaching came from Woodcock when he was a senior advisor to the Prime Minister is deadly serious. It is corruption in the highest political office in the land.

Since he became aware of that risk, at least last May or earlier, did the Prime Minister ever ask Woodcock what was going on?

[Paul Calandra, Conservative, Parliamentary Secretary to the Prime Minister and for Intergovernmental Affairs]

Mr. Speaker, as I just said, we are going to continue to co-operate with the police. The Prime Minister's office is under no investigation.

I think what this member has to do is explain to Canadians why the Liberals continue to make victims out of these three senators, why it was that their senators either abstained or refused to vote to suspend them, and why it is that, once again, they refuse to stand up for Canadian taxpayers.

I think people understand that when it comes to protecting taxpayers, it is the Conservative Party that they can always count on.

[Ralph Goodale, Liberal, Wascana, SK]

Mr. Speaker, more obfuscation.

Chris Woodcock appears at the centre of a cash for repayment cover-up that involved Duffy, Wright, Gerstein, Perrin, Hamilton, Byrne, Rogers, Novak, van Hemmen, LeBreton, Tkachuk and Stewart Olsen, the Prime Minister's entire entourage, for more than three months. Yet the Prime Minister noticed nothing, was told nothing, asked nothing, did nothing to head off a criminal conspiracy right under his nose? It is still going on.

Why is Chris Woodcock still being paid by taxpayers?

[Paul Calandra, Conservative, Parliamentary Secretary to the Prime Minister and for Intergovernmental Affairs]

Mr. Speaker, we are assisting with the RCMP. The Prime Minister's Office is under no investigation.

Again, the member has to respond to Canadians and taxpayers about why it was that Liberals in the Senate fought so hard for the status quo and so hard against taxpayers.

[Thomas Mulcair, NDP, Leader of the Opposition]

Mr. Speaker, since Nigel Wright resigned, or since he was fired, whichever one of his versions the Prime Minister prefers to use today, has anyone in the Prime Minister's Office spoken with Nigel Wright?

[Stephen Harper, Conservative, Prime Minister]

Mr. Speaker, Mr. Wright is a private citizen.

As we know, Mr. Wright has admitted responsibility for his actions. I understand that he has been fully co-operative with authorities in all investigations.

[Thomas Mulcair, NDP, Leader of the Opposition]

Mr. Speaker, how would he know?

On June 5, the Prime Minister claimed that no one in his office knew about the $90,000 payment to Mike Duffy. Did either Chris Woodcock or David van Hemmen tell the Prime Minister that statement was false?

[Stephen Harper, Conservative, Prime Minister]

Mr. Speaker, once again, the facts are that Mr. Duffy claimed publicly that he had returned money to taxpayers. That claim was, of course, not true. He had received that money from Mr. Wright. He knew that was not true when he claimed it.

I had not been informed of that. It is very clear to me that the sole responsibility for those actions rests with Mr. Duffy and Mr. Wright. That is why they have been subject to the appropriate sanction and are under investigation.

[Thomas Mulcair, NDP, Leader of the Opposition]

Mr. Speaker, the question was, did either Chris Woodcock or David van Hemmen tell the Prime Minister that was false?

Again, Canadians note that he does not answer simple questions.

Who told the Prime Minister that Nigel Wright did not pay Mike Duffy with a personal cheque? He knows the answer. Who told the Prime Minister that it was not a personal cheque and that he would have to change his story?

[Stephen Harper, Conservative, Prime Minister]

Mr. Speaker, Mr. Wright admitted in May that he paid Mr. Duffy with his personal funds. The facts are clear. I immediately informed the Canadian public, as is my duty.

[Thomas Mulcair, NDP, Leader of the Opposition]

Mr. Speaker, whoever told the Prime Minister that Nigel Wright did not use a personal cheque was obviously aware of the details of the scheme. Who was it?

[Stephen Harper, Conservative, Prime Minister]

Mr. Speaker, I am having trouble following that question.

The fact of the matter is this. As I said, Mr. Wright told me on May 15 that he had used his personal funds to pay the moneys to Mr. Duffy, the moneys that Mr. Duffy claimed publicly he had repaid himself. Obviously, it was unacceptable that this was done, and particularly that I was not informed and my permission to do such a thing was never sought. I obviously would never have given it, and for that reason these two individuals have faced sanctions.

[Thomas Mulcair, NDP, Leader of the Opposition]

Mr. Speaker, was Mike Duffy briefed by anyone in the Prime Minister's Office for any of his media appearances? Yes or no.

[Stephen Harper, Conservative, Prime Minister]

Mr. Speaker, once again the New Democrats are back into the mode of trying to depict Mr. Duffy as somehow a victim here.

Mr. Duffy took expenses that I do not think anybody in this House thinks are appropriate. Mr. Duffy then claimed publicly that he had repaid them when Mr. Duffy himself knew that not to be true. It is Mr. Duffy who is responsible for those actions, and he should be held accountable.

[Thomas Mulcair, NDP, Leader of the Opposition]

Mr. Speaker, who in the PMO was in contact with Senator David Tkachuk or Senator Carolyn Stewart Olsen to whitewash the Mike Duffy report?

Tkachuk confirmed that he had conversations with the PMO. Who was it with? It was the Prime Minister. He knows it. He can tell us and he has to tell Canadians.

[Stephen Harper, Conservative, Prime Minister]

Mr. Speaker, once again, as the senator said, the Senate and the Senate committee take responsibility for their own reports.

Once again, we find the leader of the NDP trying to cast the net wide, trying to accuse people, who have been accused of nothing, of doing something wrong. In this case, Senator Tkachuk has been clear that the Senate obviously got advice from all kinds of sources, but in the end that committee made its own decisions and its own recommendations.

[Thomas Mulcair, NDP, Leader of the Opposition]

Mr. Speaker, actually Senator Tkachuk is on the record as saying he spoke with the Prime Minister's Office. We were asking who, and the Prime Minister again refuses to respond.

Last weekend, Senator Irving Gerstein told Canadians that he outright rejected any requests from the Prime Minister's Office to repay Mike Duffy's illegal expenses. Does the Prime Minister stand by that story? Yes or no.

[Stephen Harper, Conservative, Prime Minister]

Mr. Speaker, once again, my view on this matter was absolutely clear from the beginning, to all concerned. That was that I believe that Senator Duffy should repay the expenses he had inappropriately collected from taxpayers. That still has not been done, which is one reason the Senate has taken the strong action it has, in fact, action without precedent. I hope this is a good example that will be followed going forward, to ensure that these kinds of things do not happen again in the future.

[Thomas Mulcair, NDP, Leader of the Opposition]

Mr. Speaker, that was a simple question, but if the Prime Minister still cannot stand up and vouch for Senator Gerstein's story, what is Senator Gerstein still doing in the Prime Minister's Conservative caucus?

[Stephen Harper, Conservative, Prime Minister]

Mr. Speaker, once again the leader of the NDP casts aspersions on individuals who are accused of doing absolutely nothing wrong. The fact of the matter is that what was done wrong is that Mr. Duffy made a false claim about his expense repayments, or payments that had come from Mr. Wright that Mr. Wright had not been forthcoming about. That is the responsibility of those two individuals. Mr. Wright has taken responsibility. Those two individuals are under inquiry and investigation.

It is very different than the leader of the NDP, who for 17 years knew of bribe attempts by the Mayor of Laval and refused to take any action himself.

[Thomas Mulcair, NDP, Leader of the Opposition]

Mr. Speaker, only a Conservative would consider that asking whether someone was telling the truth would be casting aspersions.

When the Prime Minister named Pamela Wallin to the Senate, he knew she lived in Toronto, not Saskatchewan. Why did he name her? He knew Mike Duffy lived in Ottawa, not in P.E.I. Why did he name him? the Prime Minister knew his close friend, Carolyn Stewart Olsen, lived in Ottawa, not New Brunswick; she worked beside him. Why did he name her?