Debates of Feb. 4th, 2013

Fair Rail Freight Service Act

[Dean Del Mastro, Conservative, Parliamentary Secretary to the Prime Minister and to the Minister of Intergovernmental Affairs]

Mr. Speaker, first of all I am delighted to hear the hon. member indicate that he is going to be supporting the legislation.

I think it is important that members recognize that when we talk about Canada's freight rail system, we have to talk about it in a North American context since it really is a fully integrated system. Ultimately we have to recognize that while there are challenges within the system with respect to the shipper-railway relationship at times, even though that rarely happens, we really do have the greatest freight rail system in the world. It enables so much business and gives so much back to our economy.

Does the hon. member agree with the principle that first and foremost we would like to see market-based solutions, and that this mechanism should be used as rarely as possible, wherever there is a situation that cannot be solved between the shipper and the railway?

I think this is a good follow-up system. What the minister has put forward is a good system to support shippers and railways and to help them derive market-based relationships and solutions on their own. Would the hon. member agree with that?

[Denis Blanchette, NDP, Louis-Hébert, QC]

Mr. Speaker, I thank my colleague for his question.

At the beginning of his question, he mentioned that there were continental relationships when it comes to shipping. That fact is undeniable. If there is one thing that CN and CP customers want, it is that their goods be delivered as quickly as possible. That is the problem. And the reason the government has decided to act after many years of standing idly by is that market-driven logic unfortunately failed this time.

Moreover, that is why, in my speech, I called on CN and CP to change their corporate culture, which is focused solely on profit, in an environment where it is really not possible to be ruled by completely market-driven logic. Indeed, you cannot create 10 competitors for CN and CP just like that. As members are aware, this kind of infrastructure makes it is quite difficult to develop competition.

I said in my speech that CN and CP should view this bill as a warning sign that things are bad and that they need to improve their practices. We are here solely because there is a problem that needs to be addressed through Bill C-52.

[Kevin Lamoureux, Liberal, Winnipeg North, MB]

Mr. Speaker, earlier today I made reference to a former Minister of Finance, my colleague the hon. member for Wascana, and the efforts he has put in over the last number of years in calling upon the government to bring forward this legislation.

The need for the legislation has been there for a number of years. Initially, it started as a request in 2007. Liberals are glad we finally have the legislation here. We recognize there is a need for changes to the legislation. There is no doubt there will be a number of recommendations for changes once it hits the committee stage.

One of the questions an NDP colleague had posed to me was in regard to having freight rate charges within the legislation. I indicated that I would have a lot of reservations with regard to that. However, would the hon. member comment as to what the NDP might be thinking in terms of putting freight rates into the legislation?

[Denis Blanchette, NDP, Louis-Hébert, QC]

Mr. Speaker, I thank my colleague from Winnipeg North for his question.

I touched on the issue of committee work. In fact, I asked him a question regarding this during his own speech. I said that I wanted debate in committee broadened to go beyond the scope of Bill C-52 and focus on problems, so that rail transportation can get better.

I hope that my colleagues will agree with me regarding the need to open up debate and see what members have to say about other issues in the report that the bill does not address.

[Anne-Marie Day, NDP, Charlesbourg—Haute-Saint-Charles, QC]

Mr. Speaker, I thank the member for Louis-Hébert. He raised a matter that is close to my heart: the importance of developing resource regions.

Early in the process of colonization, when Canada developed its coast-to-coast railway, the resource regions were not heavily populated. This engine of development was nevertheless put in place in order to promote progress nationwide.

In Gaspé, for example, where I was born, the freight train between Gaspé and Chandler has been removed, depriving small and medium-sized businesses of the development opportunities to which they are entitled.

Does the member for Louis-Hébert want bulk shipping to reach Canada’s remote regions?

[Denis Blanchette, NDP, Louis-Hébert, QC]

Mr. Speaker, I thank my colleague from Charlesbourg—Haute-Saint-Charles for his excellent question, since indirectly, that is what is at the heart of this bill. It is about the capacity of a vast nation like ours to service the entire country, regardless of the population density of its geographical sectors.

That is why the railways were built, and it is unfortunate that, in recent years, the focus on profit at all costs has made it difficult to develop and maintain businesses in Canada's most remote regions.

That is why it is important to once again strike a balance, a word that I have used on several occasions, between profit-driven logic and the capacity to support regional development.

[Djaouida Sellah, NDP, Saint-Bruno—Saint-Hubert, QC]

Mr. Speaker, Bill C-52 amends the Canada Transportation Act to require a railway company, on a shipper’s request, to make the shipper an offer to enter into a contract respecting the manner in which the railway company must fulfill its service obligations to the shipper.

In point of fact, clients of the rail transportation system, like farmers and mining companies, are victims of the near-monopoly held by railway companies: service interruptions, delays and other disruptive situations at Canadian National and Canadian Pacific are harmful to industries such as agriculture, forestry, mining and manufacturing, which do not receive compensation. A large proportion of the goods are intended for export. Poor rail transportation services damage the ability of Canadian exporters to compete on the international marketplace, particularly in terms of agricultural products.

Moreover, a number of shippers have difficulty, not just in getting good service, but in getting any service at all. Shippers complain that they are not able to sign freight contracts with the big railway companies. This situation is detrimental to Canadian exporters. Steps must be taken, especially because right now the trade deficit is very high. I would like to point out that the trade deficit reached $2 billion last November.

Statistics show that 80% of railway clients are dissatisfied with the service they receive. As the situation is one of a quasi-monopoly, it is important that the government take action to ensure that clients are better protected. It is the shippers who have to pick up the pieces if their goods do not arrive on time. This causes huge inconveniences.

When perishables are being shipped, the situation is disastrous, because by the time the goods arrive at their destination, they may be rotten or just not usable. This hinders Canada’s competitive position. For example, Canadian soybean growers are placed at a competitive disadvantage vis-à-vis their Argentinian competitors, not because of the quality of their product, but because of unreliable shipments. The growers should not have to bear the cost of this situation.

Rail transportation of goods is vital in many respects. First of all, since 70% of goods are transported by rail at some point, we need to have an efficient system. Secondly, rail transportation makes it possible to keep trucks off the roads, thereby limiting greenhouse gas emissions that result from the transportation of our goods. By ensuring that a certain number of trucks are not on the roads, we avoid putting additional pressure on our road infrastructures, that do not really need it.

I come from the Montreal area. Like my constituents in my riding of Saint-Bruno—Saint-Hubert, when I use the highways, I can see many trucks, and I can also see the state of the infrastructure, which is underfunded. Therefore, we need a rail transportation system that is efficient and accessible, so that we do not make the situation worse. Moreover, we need investments to restore our existing infrastructure.

Inaction on this issue will be costly for the Canadian economy. The situation cannot continue. Inadequate rail service is costly for Canadian businesses, and it is detrimental to the economy and to the labour market. In 2008, the government set up a panel of experts that studied the issue for three years. Their report was submitted in early 2011.

The government also initiated a mediation process that served only to show that Canadian National and Canadian Pacific lack the will to solve the problem and to provide adequate service to shippers. Although this bill could be improved, it is part of the solution.

Bill C-52 will cover only new service level agreements, not those that already exist. Many shippers will therefore continue to live with unreliable and unfair service, without having any recourse to dispute resolution if violations of existing service agreements occur.

Furthermore, arbitration is only available for shippers who are negotiating new contracts. Instead of providing fast, reliable dispute resolution for all shippers, Bill C-52 is offering a limited arbitration process for a small group of shippers. The proposed arbitration process may be too costly for shippers and require an unfair burden of proof by asking shippers to prove that they need the services of the rail company.

To find a comprehensive solution, we also have to consider the question of rates. While some members of the shipping community wanted to address problems with rates in this legislative process as well, the Conservatives made it clearly known that they will not be examining that aspect before the next legislative review of the Canada Transportation Act, in 2014 and 2015.

Of course we have to tackle the problems associated with service level agreements, but we also have to consider how we can make rail transportation more affordable. We have to tackle the problem in its entirety to ensure that our businesses, some of which are in rural communities, are an important element of the local economy.

The situation affects numerous sectors, such as natural resources, manufacturing, agriculture, forestry products, mining, chemicals and the auto industry. No one is really spared.

It is also important to note that the mining sector is the second largest employer in first nations communities, after the public sector, of course.

Improving rail services for shipping goods from mining companies could have a positive impact on the economic situation of the aboriginal peoples in some regions of the country. The government should be working with first nations leaders to improve their living conditions and the economic circumstances of the aboriginal people. There needs to be a sense of urgency to move quickly on this issue.

I will conclude by saying that it is most important that we not solve problems by halves. We have to tackle the problem in its entirety. I know that Bill C-52 is a small step forward, because this is a crisis.

[Kevin Lamoureux, Liberal, Winnipeg North, MB]

Mr. Speaker, again, I want to emphasize the importance of the rail line industry to Canada in many different ways, primarily in terms of the economic impact it has for all Canadians. At the end of the day, as I have indicated previously, the need to do something or take some sort of action is there. It is very real, and it has been called on for a number of years already. Today we are now debating the issue.

The Liberal Party, in principle, supports the legislation to go to committee in anticipation that there will be amendments acceptable to the government, and obviously open it to the stakeholders. Does the member believe, as we believe, that it would be a tragic mistake for the government not to recognize the need to make amendments to the legislation, thereby giving it more strength to protect our shippers, our consumers and, to that degree, the rail lines themselves?

[Djaouida Sellah, NDP, Saint-Bruno—Saint-Hubert, QC]

Mr. Speaker, I thank my colleague from Winnipeg North. I listened closely to his question.

We believe this is a first step in a crisis situation. The Liberals had until 2006 to introduce a bill, but unfortunately they did not do so. This is what we are suggesting. We are in favour of Bill C-52 going to committee, so witnesses can be heard and amendments will probably be made.

[Anne-Marie Day, NDP, Charlesbourg—Haute-Saint-Charles, QC]

Mr. Speaker, this is totally shameful. I have seen the figures and I cannot get over them. I must note that I am not a member of that committee. The report says that 80% of rail shipping service customers are not satisfied. That is unbelievable. If I had a business and 80% of my customers were not satisfied, things would be in a bad way. That is a given.

How can the member explain that? Is it protectionism? Is it declining use? What is going on that results in customers not being satisfied? Do these companies have a monopoly on the railway?

[Djaouida Sellah, NDP, Saint-Bruno—Saint-Hubert, QC]

Mr. Speaker, I thank my colleague for her question.

We are well aware that the Conservatives are protecting their friends in the big railway companies. By giving the railway companies what is essentially a monopoly, the Conservatives are treating Canadian shippers as if they do not matter. Unfortunately, that is the answer to the hon. member's question.

[Dany Morin, NDP, Chicoutimi—Le Fjord, QC]

Mr. Speaker, given that 70% of our goods are shipped by rail and that it is very important to increase demand for rail transportation services and the quality of those services to reduce trucking and greenhouse gases, does my NDP colleague believe that the Conservative government is serious enough about improving Canada's rail transportation system?

[Djaouida Sellah, NDP, Saint-Bruno—Saint-Hubert, QC]

Mr. Speaker, I would like to thank the member for his question.

We are discussing Bill C-52 today because nothing has been done up to this point, obviously. Unfortunately, the government waited until there was a crisis and the shippers and the NDP put pressure on it to introduce this bill.

This is not ideal, but it is better than nothing. That is what the shippers are telling us. They are not really satisfied with the bill, but they hope it will be improved upon in committee.

[Dany Morin, NDP, Chicoutimi—Le Fjord, QC]

Mr. Speaker, again, I would like to thank the member for her answer. I completely agree with her.

I am also bothered by the fact that the Conservative government boasts about defending the economy and Canada's economic growth. I do not know if the Conservatives know this, but the poor quality of rail freight transportation services costs Canada's economy hundreds of millions of dollars each year. Since they have come to power, they have been twiddling their thumbs and have not been serious enough about improving and maintaining Canada's rail system. This robs the Canadian economy, our small businesses, our exporters and even our big businesses of hundreds of millions of dollars a year.

Does my colleague believe that the losses really are this big? Does she feel that the Conservative government should finally open its eyes if it truly wants to develop and grow the Canadian economy and inject money into our rail transportation system?

[Djaouida Sellah, NDP, Saint-Bruno—Saint-Hubert, QC]

Mr. Speaker, I would like to again thank my colleague for his question.

As I mentioned in my speech, 80% of shippers are dissatisfied with the services provided by the two companies that have a monopoly on this means of transportation.

Instead of supporting the monopoly model, the Conservatives should instead look after small and medium-sized businesses. The government should pass legislation that has teeth in order to improve the level of service and try to compensate shippers, particularly in agriculture, who are incurring millions of dollars in losses, as I said.

Unfortunately, these shippers have to check for themselves if their goods arrived at the right place and in what condition they got there. At times, perishable goods have rotted by the time they reach their destination. We can imagine the kinds of losses these people incur.

[Dany Morin, NDP, Chicoutimi—Le Fjord, QC]

Mr. Speaker, I will elaborate on what my colleague said. Just a few seconds ago, she mentioned that two rail companies, CN and CP, have a monopoly. She also mentioned that 80% of exporters are dissatisfied with the poor service, such as when goods do not arrive on time or in good condition.

When exporters want to shop around and get the best price or the best deal, they ask for bids from these two major companies, which, quite frankly, have a monopoly. There is also a big difference in rates. That is why I believe the NDP approach is reasonable.

What we find particularly unfortunate about Bill C-52 is that the Conservative government had a good opportunity to legislate or have input on the rate difference.

I would like to know what my colleague thinks of the fact that Bill C-52 says nothing about rates, which I believe Canadian exporters want the federal government to address.

[Djaouida Sellah, NDP, Saint-Bruno—Saint-Hubert, QC]

Mr. Speaker, once again I thank my hon. colleague for the question. Indeed, what I criticized in my speech was the monopoly held by the two large companies.

I said that the Conservatives are unfortunately not encouraging small and medium-sized businesses. As my colleague pointed out, the losses will be huge. That is why we also want to talk about prices. When people have no choice, or when they have to choose between only two companies, what will they do with their merchandise? They are between a rock and a hard place: either they ship their merchandise with one of those two companies or they let their product rot, if it is an agricultural product.

It seems that all the other companies have no choice. There is no competition. There are no jobs when a monopoly is held by just two companies. Unfortunately, shippers really have no choice.

[Dany Morin, NDP, Chicoutimi—Le Fjord, QC]

Mr. Speaker, it has probably become quite clear from my questions and comments that Canada's railway system is something I care about a great deal.

During my 10-minute speech, I will not necessarily focus on the details of the bill. My NDP colleague just did that, as did many other NDP members, including the hon. member for Trinity—Spadina, our transport critic, who is doing an incredible job in this area.

Bill C-52 affects me personally. We have heard a lot about how this bill will have a national impact and about its many deficiencies, which the NDP has criticized.

I just mentioned the fact that the difference between Canadian Pacific's and Canadian National's rates is quite significant, from one bidder to the next. This aspect bothers the NDP. We would have liked to see the federal government show some leadership on this. Unfortunately, this bill was introduced after five years of dragging their feet, and it was only introduced thanks to the hard work of my colleague from Trinity—Spadina, our transport critic. Fortunately, the NDP is the official opposition and it will hold this government to account.

In my speech I am not going to talk about the national impact or the consequences for big cities. I respect the people of Montreal and Toronto, for whom rail transportation means something different. However, I come from northeastern Quebec and, in the regions, the rail system is mainly used for the transportation of various goods.

Over the past few days, I took the time to find out whether our exporters in Saguenay—Lac-Saint-Jean are satisfied with the rail service they are receiving. Unfortunately, I came to the same conclusion as the other opposition members: there are many shortcomings.

I even managed to get my hands on a study conducted by the City of Saguenay. It is a few years old, but the conclusion was the same. I will share it with the House. This will bring something different to the debate since it pertains more to the regional reality.

This study has to do with issues around rail freight transport in Saguenay—Lac-Saint-Jean.

Editor's note: The findings in this report reflect discussions with most major regional users, including those in the pulp and paper, softwood lumber, fibreboard and aluminum industries, as well as smaller users in other industrial sectors. They basically reflect the comments made.

I just named the economic and industrial sectors that are very important in the region. We export a lot of these products. The people watching at home may be wondering what their rail system looks like. I will explain.

Two companies share the Saguenay—Lac-Saint-Jean railway system: CN and the Compagnie de chemin de fer Roberval-Saguenay or RS, a division of Alcan [or Rio Tinto Alcan]. The CN railway falls under federal jurisdiction and the line ends in Jonquière. The RS railway is a private railway that falls under provincial jurisdiction. The RS railway starts at the Port-Alfred facilities in La Baie and its primary purpose is to provide service to the Alcan plants in the region. As part of a confidential agreement with CN, however, RS provides service to the companies east of Jonquière, including clients from the Chicoutimi and La Baie industrial parks.

The city of Saguenay has two freight transshipment centres: Nolitrex (Jonquière) and Transit PAG (located in La Baie since January 2000), as well as one wood chip transshipment centre (Jonquière). Two other transshipment centres operate in Lac Saint-Jean, in Hébertville (Groupe Goyette) and La Doré.

Northern Quebec Internal Short Line (NQISL)

The NQISL operates the Saguenay-Lac-Saint-Jean, Chibougamau and Abitibi network for CN. Quebec has 11 short lines and private companies, including RS. Unlike the other short lines, which are independent entities that operate secondary lines for CN, CN has maintained control over the NQISL. The NQISL is a semi-autonomous division of CN, wholly owned by CN. The NQISL has a monopoly in the region and operates the largest rail network in Quebec, with 1,756 km of track, including 422 km in Saguenay-Lac-Saint-Jean.

NATIONAL FACTORS

Compared with all the rail companies in North America, the railway has adapted poorly to the new realities of transportation, including the just-in-time factor. Transportation times are long, rail cars get lost and the rates are less competitive, compared to the more efficient trucking industry, which has regained a large share of the market.

Following a string of budget cuts at CN at one point in time, rail car maintenance was neglected as was reinvesting in equipment. Today, the industry is faced with an aging fleet of rail cars. Certain types of rail cars, specifically closed cars that are not watertight, are in poor condition. This situation affects a region like ours in particular since the pulp and paper industry is directly impacted. According to our sources, CN is poised to modernize its fleet of pulp and paper rail cars. [I believe the modernization has already been done, since this study was conducted several years ago.] Other less important industrial sectors have been neglected, however, and will likely have to continue making do with outdated or ill-suited equipment.

CN’s operating system appears to be poorly adapted to the size of Canada and the unique characteristics of sub-regions like those in Quebec. CN’s national service centre is located in Winnipeg. Some customers can go to Vancouver for a price and to Winnipeg to request a rail car that will be sent from Edmonton to a transshipment centre in Montreal. From Montreal, the freight can then be shipped to the Saguenay. The transaction can then be billed in Toronto. Each time, a different person is involved in the process. The system is highly complex and rather daunting for the user. Customers can easily encounter many pitfalls. Another issue is the lack of knowledge of the Quebec market, especially a region like the Saguenay, as well as a strong tendency to apply national standards and rates, allowing little room for regional differences and for contact between a customer and a supplier.

Most of the customers who were consulted said that CN was not highly service oriented and took advantage of its monopoly, especially since the large-scale cuts in recent years. Mention was made of unilateral decisions where CN notifies rather than consults with its customers. [This happens regularly.] Another told us: “You want two rail cars and you get 20. When you want 20 rail cars, you get two.” Others spoke of lengthy delays for one thing or another.

REGIONAL FACTORS

In early 2002, the industry was hit with a major rail car shortage that affected all Canadian railway companies. The softwood lumber industry was primarily affected. Manufacturers picked up the pace of shipments to the United States before the American tax was scheduled to take effect. The softwood lumber industry was hopeful that the situation would sort itself out after May 23. Whether or not that happens remains to be seen. [Many years later, we can see that the situation has not improved.] However, even though this situation was exceptional, there had been a long-standing shortage of CN rail cars, except for major clients. In an October 8, 1999, report, Quebec's transport ministry stated the following about the Saguenay-Lac-Saint-Jean: “...because of the shortage of rail cars, regional transshipment centres may lose customers—indeed, some already have—to transshipment centres in Quebec City where rail cars are easier to obtain.” This situation does not adequately support regional development, nor does it encourage the NQISL to develop regional markets and seek new clients.

The NQISL seems uninterested in small customers, occasional customers and potential customers. Except for major users, most shippers get the sense that CN wants to focus on choice customers—aluminum and pulp and paper—while ignoring smaller customers and sectors. For example, occasional customers can wait weeks to get shipping rates for their goods.

The general consensus is that CN is using its regional monopoly to charge excessively high prices. This could make rail transportation unaffordable for small businesses and could cause larger companies to opt for other means of transportation, such as trucks, which put additional pressure on our roads.

For example, recently, a client got an initial quote of $9,280 to send 10 cars to Calgary. That was lowered to $4,390 following a single phone call to a CN higher-up.

For example, a major regional company got rates from Canadian Pacific out of Quebec City that were so much lower than CN's rates, they almost covered the cost of shipping goods by truck on Route 175 even though CP has a longer route through the Eastern Townships compared to CN's direct line between Quebec City and Montreal.

For an 11-kilometre segment, a major part of Saguenay's industrial base—Chicoutimi and La Baie—is served by a third company, RS, for which this is not a priority. Although RS provides very good service, this results in a prohibitive surcharge for shippers just for those few kilometres. This situation could cause problems in the future for the La Baie sector, which has 75% of the new City of Saguenay's industrial development space as well as major regional marine and air transportation infrastructure.

I would like to provide some other information about my region that may be relevant:

Transportation is a determining factor in the location and development of industry. Transportation is more important in regions such as ours than it is in larger centres. More than anywhere else, we need proper, modern, competitive transportation systems if we want economic growth, particularly given recent unemployment statistics...

The railway is an essential mode of transportation in the region. Trains carry approximately one-third of all goods shipped regionally or inter-regionally, 40% of goods shipped inter-regionally via ground transportation and two-thirds of goods shipped across the continent via ground transportation.

The NQISL is the only rail company that gives the region access to provincial, national and continental markets.

In 1996, the break-even point for an internal short line was 37 cars shipped per kilometre of track per year. In the region, the NQISL is definitely profitable, moving more than 61 cars per kilometre, which translates to more than three million tonnes of goods annually (57% of that being forest products).

I painted a regional picture of the rail transportation system and I would like to quote some local stakeholders, particularly the mayors of Saguenay-Lac-St-Jean municipalities. I will not limit myself to my own riding, Chicoutimi—Le Fjord, and I will even venture into the riding of the Minister of Transport, Infrastructure and Communities, who may not show the other side of the coin, since he will want to protect his government's bill.

I would like to read part of a fairly recent Radio-Canada article from November 16, 2010. In the article, people were complaining about rail service.

The town of Chibougamau and its municipal development agency are calling on the federal government to intervene to improve rail service to Lac-St-Jean.

The preliminary report just released by Transport Canada on railroads in Canada's small communities worries Développement Chibougamau, because the document talks about long-term solutions to improve service across the country, but it says nothing about the infrastructure on the Triquet-Faribault line, which links Chibougamau to Saint-Félicien.

Saint-Félicien is in the municipality of the Minister of Transport, Infrastructure and Communities.

The town of Chibougamau, Développement Chibougamau and Génivar submitted a position paper to the federal government last March denouncing the sorry state of the track, railway cars and service on the Triquet-Faribault line.

The general manager of Développement Chibougamau, Pierre D'Amour, also pointed out that mining exploration is booming in the region. “Our fear is that there will be downsizing and that less profitable rail lines will be shut down,” he said. “For us, that would be a catastrophe.”

Too slow

Chantier Chibougamau ships one-quarter of its production by train, but would like to ship more to improve its environmental record.

The company's communications officer, Frédéric Verreault, explained that, for the time being, it is impossible for them to increase rail shipments because the train travels at 40 km an hour owing to the condition of the tracks.

“A moose racing a train carrying our products would get to Lac-Saint-Jean faster.”

A rail shipment to Toronto takes more than a week; it can get there in 24 hours by truck. According to Frédéric Verreault, the decision about the shipping method is an easy one. “The just-in-time concept is central to our relations with our clients,” Mr. Verreault pointed out.

The Chantier Chibougamau representative would like the federal government to invest just as much in rail service as it does in seaports.

I will quote another newspaper article from one of our regional weeklies:

Last week, we published an item about the Forest Products Association of Canada (FPAC), which was urging the federal government to “act decisively” on the various problems associated with the rail transportation of goods. We have further information this week.

You will remember that, in 2008, the government committed to reviewing poor rail service provided to rural industries by establishing a review panel, which made recommendations.

However, today, the FPAC considers it inappropriate that all measures will be delayed for another three years.

The association pointed out that the government is counting on CN and CP to implement the changes on a voluntary basis and that regulatory measures will not be enacted until after 2013.

Last Friday, La Sentinelle contacted Susan Murray, executive director of public relations for the Forest Products Association of Canada, to find out if the government had responded to FPAC's press release entitled “Forest Industry to Government: Fix Rail Service Now”. She said that the government had not responded.

When contacted by La Sentinelle for comment on the FPAC's press release, the mayor of Chibougamau said she agreed with the association.

She also said that the railway is of the utmost importance for the region's mining and forestry companies, as well as those in James Bay and Matagami.

In her opinion, these companies are stuck because CN has not made any investments in its infrastructure for years.

She also wondered about future projects, namely those that will be implemented in the James Bay sector. “Will CN have the reactive capability to support these projects?” she wondered.

I would now like to mention what the Mayor of Saint-Félicien had to say.

...the Mayor of Saint-Félicien, Gilles Potvin, is also concerned about CN's lack of investment. Mr. Potvin is of the opinion that the Saint-Félicien-Chibougamau line is essential for the Saguenay-Lac-Saint-Jean region because it provides access to the port of Grande Anse. He said, “It is a key area for the future of the region. We have to be concerned about it.”

For the past few minutes, I have been talking about the state of the railway in Chambord, which is in the Minister of Transport's riding. Here is a newspaper article that was published a year after the two articles I just quoted. It reads:

Train Derails in Saguenay-Lac-Saint-Jean

CHAMBORD—Three cars derailed on part of the Saint-André line in the Chambord area of Saguenay-Lac-Saint-Jean late Sunday night/early Monday morning. According to Sûreté du Québec spokesperson Hélène Nepton, Sûreté du Québec was informed of the incident, which was allegedly related to a defective rail, at approximately 2 a.m.

It is disappointing.

In closing, I will let people draw their own conclusions about the fact that another train derailed in Chambord one year later, in 2011, because the track was not being properly maintained even though local stakeholders had asked the federal government to take action, to take responsibility and to invest in the railway.

I am proud to be from the Saguenay-Lac-Saint-Jean area and, as the member for Chicoutimi—Le Fjord, which is home to part of the CN and RS railway, I am calling for the federal government to take responsibility and finally invest in rail transportation. It is important for the Canadian economy.

[Dean Del Mastro, Conservative, Parliamentary Secretary to the Prime Minister and to the Minister of Intergovernmental Affairs]

Mr. Speaker, I am surprised by the member's comments. Over the last number of years there has not been a government that has invested more money into railways than this government, certainly not in decades.

The reality is that we put $1 billion into VIA Rail for improved tracking and new rolling stock in locomotives, which the member's party voted against. In 2006, we partnered with the government of Quebec to put in place a program to rebuild railway short lines with over $70 million, and the NDP certainly did not support that funding. We partnered with Genesee & Wyoming and the Canadian Pacific Railway to rebuild the Huron Central Railway between Sault Ste. Marie and Sudbury. I worked for some two and a half years to put the funding into that. It was the first time in history that the Province of Ontario had partnered with the federal government toward regenerating and rebuilding railway infrastructure in this country.

This government has demonstrated time and again, whether with Pacific Gateway, Atlantic Gateway or railways in general, that we are committed to improving railways in this country. We are committed to improving railway safety and we demonstrated that with a bill that has already gone through this place. We are dedicated and committed to improving rail service. This member should get on board.

[Dany Morin, NDP, Chicoutimi—Le Fjord, QC]

Mr. Speaker, I would like to respond to my Conservative colleague's first point. He welcomes the investment his Conservative government has made in rail transport. However, I remind him that, in 2010, the people in the community, in Chambord, criticized the condition of the rails. That was not just one stakeholder, but rather a lot of people in the community.

I also believe the Conservatives were still in power when a derailment occurred in 2011. The Sûreté du Québec suspected a defect in the rails.

The Conservatives may be proud of the money the government is putting into rail transport, but it is clearly not yielding the desired results. I am not necessarily saying they are incompetent or poor managers of taxpayers' money, but people can draw their own conclusions.

Then my colleague said that the NDP could have voted for or against such and such a bill. The NDP is truly a very reasonable party. For example, this Bill C-52 is adequate. It could be better. It could resolve the disparity in rate-setting by companies that hold a monopoly. However, we are pleased that Bill C-52 is a step in the right direction and we will support it.

As we have previously seen, the Conservatives have introduced some atrocious bills despite their good intentions. I am not ashamed to say that we are opposed to bad Conservative bills. That is why I encourage my colleagues to support the initiatives of my colleague, the transport critic.

[Matthew Kellway, NDP, Beaches—East York, ON]

Mr. Speaker, I thank my colleague for his great speech. What I found interesting was his argument about how, even in the area where he lives, which is a little more remote than where I live in Toronto, rail infrastructure is critical to the economic development of that area. Earlier today in my speech I talked about how critical rail infrastructure is to a city region such as Toronto, both coordinating economic activity within that region and connecting that region to other economic activity. It seems that rail infrastructure, at least in Canada, has to be seen as a core component of global competitiveness.

Does my hon. colleague agree with that? If he does agree with that, what does he make of a government that sells itself as an economic manager, yet has taken years to actually deal with this problem of freight rail and the unhappiness of customers with the virtual monopoly we have in this country over freight rail services?

[Dany Morin, NDP, Chicoutimi—Le Fjord, QC]

Mr. Speaker, I wanted to keep my feelings about the Conservative government's management of the railway system somewhat ambiguous. However, since my NDP colleague is urging me to state my position, I will simply say this amounts to incompetence.

The government is very cunning and is doing its best to make us believe the Canadian economy is in good shape. However, it cannot be effective with Canadian taxpayers' money by throwing it at the problem. As military procurement critic, my NDP colleague knows perfectly well how poorly the Conservative government is managing the military aircraft procurement files. It is not surprising that the money it throws or sprinkles around in the Canadian railway system, depending on the situation, is being wasted through mismanagement.

My colleague asked me what I thought about the role of the railways in economic growth. My answer to him is that I am proud that, in partnership with the Conservative government, we are going to have railway service in my region that links the railway to the Grand-Anse terminal so that our seaport can open and cargo can be shipped by sea and by train. So this is really a good opportunity for my region to develop its economy.

[Anne-Marie Day, NDP, Charlesbourg—Haute-Saint-Charles, QC]

Mr. Speaker, it is 80% of the clients who are not satisfied. It is not just the people in the NDP.

The Conservative member says that they have invested money. I would like to invite him to travel, as a passenger, between Montreal and New York. I do not know where they invested their money, but there is some work that needs to be done here.

There is a reason why 80% of people are not satisfied. As the member said in his excellent speech, a moose would get there quicker. That is what he said.

What would my colleague like to say on this issue? There is quite a bit of discontent.

[Dany Morin, NDP, Chicoutimi—Le Fjord, QC]

Mr. Speaker, my NDP colleague is absolutely right. People complain that the train does not go fast enough, at 40 km/h, because the tracks are worn out and poorly maintained. People want to be able to ship their goods. A number of executives and exporters in my riding prefer to ship goods by road, as the railways in our region are poorly maintained, and this results in more pollution.

Moreover, the ever-increasing price of gas does not help the SMEs and the corporations in our ridings, in my riding or my colleague’s, to make a place for themselves and win a share of the domestic and international marketplace.

I am proud that the NDP wants to upgrade Canada’s railway system. I just hope that the Conservatives will be able to deal with any price gouging that might arise from the CN and CP monopoly, but I do not have much hope for such a jaded government.

[Dean Del Mastro, Conservative, Peterborough, ON]

Mr. Speaker, a lot of the comments that I have heard are simply rhetoric. They are not fact-based at all.

Has the member actually looked into the improvements that have been made by CP and CN in terms of on-time delivery and on-time pickups from shippers right across this country? Has he noted the increase in rail freight traffic in this country in the last five years? Has the member noted any of these things, or is he simply here to spew rhetoric of a partisan nature?