Debates of May 21st, 2013

Natural Resources—Main Estimates, 2013-14

[Jamie Nicholls, NDP, Vaudreuil—Soulanges, QC]

Mr. Chair, it was a simple question. The minister should know his portfolio, but clearly, based on how he has to shuffle through his papers, he does not know the answer. He did not answer the question correctly.

I will try again. How many new resource development projects was the National Energy Board asked to review in 2012?

[Joe Oliver, Conservative, Eglinton—Lawrence, ON]

Mr. Chair, as I said, the National Energy Board is an independent body.

The main functions of the NEB include the design, construction, operation, the regulation of design construction, operation abandonment of pipelines, natural gas imports, and oil and gas activities on frontier lands.

[Jamie Nicholls, NDP, Vaudreuil—Soulanges, QC]

Mr. Chair, the minister clearly does not know the answer.

I will try another question. How many projects is the board expected to be responsible for reviewing in 2013? Does he know the figure for this year, for 2013?

[Joe Oliver, Conservative, Eglinton—Lawrence, ON]

Mr. Chair, the question has to do with the number of projects that are under regulation in mid-year. I do not have the answer.

[Jamie Nicholls, NDP, Vaudreuil—Soulanges, QC]

Mr. Chair, that is too bad.

Does the minister know that $3 million has been cut from the National Energy Board's budget for 2013-14?

[Joe Oliver, Conservative, Eglinton—Lawrence, ON]

Mr. Chair, the funding to ensure the NEB has clear and robust regulatory oversight throughout the life cycle of the facilities and activities it regulates was put in place. For example, in comparison to 2012-13, the 2013-14 main estimates have increased primarily due to an increase of $5.6 million for pipeline safety and awareness, a decrease of $2.3 million in funding for the participant funding program.

[Jamie Nicholls, NDP, Vaudreuil—Soulanges, QC]

Mr. Chair, it is clear that $3 million has been cut. You can try to change reality, but here on this side, we know what the reality is.

Can the minister tell us where the department thinks the board will find the means to accomplish these savings?

[Joe Oliver, Conservative, Eglinton—Lawrence, ON]

Mr. Chair, first just may I say that the NDP does not really care what the NEB concludes because that party comes to its conclusions prior to the scientific evaluations being done.

[Jamie Nicholls, NDP, Vaudreuil—Soulanges, QC]

Mr. Chair, how many board employees will be responsible for compliance activities in the coming year?

[Joe Oliver, Conservative, Eglinton—Lawrence, ON]

Mr. Chair, the NEB will have available an additional three-quarters of a million dollars for the fiscal year 2014 for a total of $2.25 million for public participation in its review of pipeline projects. The NEB has reallocated $3 million from 2012-13 to 2013-14 and for 2014-15 another $2.25 million for the trans mountain project.

[Jamie Nicholls, NDP, Vaudreuil—Soulanges, QC]

Mr. Chair, clearly the minister does not understand my questions in French, but I will try again.

I asked how many board employees will be responsible for compliance activities in the coming year.

[Joe Oliver, Conservative, Eglinton—Lawrence, ON]

Mr. Chair, as I said, the regulatory authority is independent.

I can assure Canadians that they have enough experts to meet their obligations.

[Jamie Nicholls, NDP, Vaudreuil—Soulanges, QC]

Mr. Chair, it may be independent; however, it is the minister's responsibility to ensure oversight of all agencies associated with his department.

Does the minister agree that Canada needs to improve its pipeline safety measures?

[Joe Oliver, Conservative, Eglinton—Lawrence, ON]

Mr. Chair, as I said, this government manages resources responsibly, and we are using its plan and taking effective measures to improve the safety and integrity of Canada's pipeline projects.

The plan increases pipeline safety by allocating $13.5 million over two years to the National Energy Board in order to increase the number of oil and gas pipeline inspections from about 100 to 150 per year. The plan also doubles the number of comprehensive annual audits in order to identify potential problems and prevent incidents from happening.

[Jamie Nicholls, NDP, Vaudreuil—Soulanges, QC]

Mr. Chair, did the minister know, before May 2013, that the NEB did not inspect backup power systems at pump stations on a regular basis and did not consistently enforce the regulations?

[Joe Oliver, Conservative, Eglinton—Lawrence, ON]

Mr. Chair, the NEB is the agency that oversees the compliance by the energy companies and it will continue to do so.

Canadian companies must comply with National Energy Board regulations. It is an independent regulatory body. The NEB will take all the necessary steps to protect the public and the environment.

When the NEB identifies deficiencies in a company's system, projects or programs, it requires that the company make certain immediate changes to correct those deficiencies or draw up plans for corrective measures that must be approved.

[Jamie Nicholls, NDP, Vaudreuil—Soulanges, QC]

Mr. Chair, I hope that we will comply with the rules for this type of debate and that the time I take to ask my question will be equal to the time the minister takes to respond.

What kind of minister is he? It is clear that the companies have him in their back pocket.

Mr. Chair, did the minister know, before May 2013, that the NEB did not inspect emergency shutdown systems at pump stations on a regular basis and did not consistently enforce the regulations?

[Joe Oliver, Conservative, Eglinton—Lawrence, ON]

Mr. Chair, we have every confidence in the NEB to do its work, and in fact it is doing so. It is a strong independent regulator of pipeline safety. It subjects pipeline development proposals to an extensive review process taking into account pipeline safety and protection of the environment. Public regulated pipelines boast a safety record of 99.9996% of the crude oil and petroleum product that was transported. I have full confidence the pipeline--

[The Assistant Deputy Chair, Conservative, Bruce Stanton]

Order. The hon. member for Vaudreuil-Soulanges.

[Jamie Nicholls, NDP, Vaudreuil—Soulanges, QC]

Mr. Chair, does the minister know when the regulations applicable to backup power systems and emergency shutdown systems went into effect?

[Joe Oliver, Conservative, Eglinton—Lawrence, ON]

Mr. Chair, as I said, we have full confidence in the regulations. The Board has received Enbridge's corrective action plan, which addresses the non-compliance issues, except for Enbridge's plan to address compliance problems on Line 9.

The NEB requires pipeline companies to anticipate, prevent, manage and mitigate situations related to their pipelines that could present a threat and to take immediate action in cases of compliance—

What is the problem?

[The Assistant Deputy Chair, Conservative, Bruce Stanton]

Order, please. Just a word to hon. members. I do not want to take time away from the debate, but members realize that the questions and responses need to be proportionate in time. That said, for a five second question that compels a complex response, the respondent needs the time to explain that as well. Therefore, we are going to have a healthy debate here. A question that actually compels a rather intricate response, time needs to be permitted to do so.

On the other side of the coin, we compel the respondents to do everything they can to make the responses concise and make them as close to that time as they practically can. All of this is an effort to try and make the debate informative and flow in a way that it helps inform Canadians on the question that is before the committee this evening.

The hon. member for Vaudreuil-Soulanges.

[Jamie Nicholls, NDP, Vaudreuil—Soulanges, QC]

Mr. Chair, does the minister know when the regulations applicable to backup power systems and emergency shutdown systems went into effect?

[Joe Oliver, Conservative, Eglinton—Lawrence, ON]

Mr. Chair, in the time allotted I will just say that the NEB enforces the regulations.

[Jamie Nicholls, NDP, Vaudreuil—Soulanges, QC]

Mr. Chair, I can answer the question: the regulations are 14 to 19 years old. There has been no oversight for 14 years.

Does the minister even know what the regulations are called?