Debates of June 3rd, 2013

The House proceeded to the consideration of Bill S-213, An Act respecting a national day of remembrance to honour Canadian veterans of the Korean War, as reported (without amendment) from the committee.

Korean War Veterans Day Act

[The Speaker, Conservative, Andrew Scheer]

There being no motions at report stage, the House will now proceed, without debate, to the putting of the question on the motion to concur in the bill at report stage.

[Blaine Calkins, Conservative, Wetaskiwin, AB]

moved that the bill be concurred in.

[The Speaker, Conservative, Andrew Scheer]

Is it the pleasure of the House to adopt the motion?

[Some hon. members]

Agreed.

[The Speaker, Conservative, Andrew Scheer]

(Motion agreed to)

When shall the bill be read the third time? By leave, now?

[Some hon. members]

Agreed.

[Blaine Calkins, Conservative, Wetaskiwin, AB]

moved that the bill be read the third time and passed.

[Eve Adams, Conservative, Parliamentary Secretary to the Minister of Veterans Affairs]

Mr. Speaker, I welcome this chance to rise in the House in support of Bill S-213. As each one of us knows, respect for Canada's veterans unites our country as few other things can. We see it in this chamber every day, regardless of where we sit in the House or where we find ourselves on the political spectrum. Each of us understands the role of Canada's veterans, that incredibly important role veterans have played in building our great nation, not only by wearing our country's uniform but by being leaders and active members of our communities.

Canada' veterans are role models. They are men and women who have taught us the real meaning of character and courage, the real meaning of service and sacrifice.

I have thought about what we have debated regarding Bill S-213. As we have taken turns speaking, we have heard a lot about the Korean War. We know that more than 26,000 Canadians served during the war and that approximately 7,000 continued to serve in Korea after the armistice was signed in 1953. We have discovered that some Canadian troops were still boots on the ground in Korea as late as 1957, some seven years after the war began. We also know, sadly, that 516 Canadians made the ultimate sacrifice during the war.

From a more global perspective, we understand that the Korean War was an important early test for the fledgling United Nations. We know the course of history could have been very different if Canada and 15 other member states had not committed combat troops to the UN's multinational force. We also know that it was imperative for the free world to take action to stop the threat of tyranny and oppression and to defend the right of all peoples to live in peace and freedom.

We all understand this. We accept the facts as they are. We recognize the significant place the Korean War holds in our history, but in doing so, we must guard against losing sight of some of the more important aspects of Bill S-213. We must not allow ourselves to be numbed by too many numbers or too many facts and figures. Most of all, we must remember that Canada's role in the Korean War was ultimately written by the more than 26,000 individual Canadians who stepped forward, all with their own reasons and all with their own stories of service and sacrifice.

This is what I want to focus upon with the time I have left today. This is why Bill S-213 is important to me. We can recount all of the strategic details of many battles and events, and what happened between Hill 355 and Hill 277. We can talk about the dangerous skies over the Korean Peninsula and the perilous waters off its shores, but the real story rests with Canadians who served in a war so far from their home. Theirs is the story of courage, the story of being afraid but carrying on anyway, day after day.

Most of us cannot begin to fathom what it is like to be dug into the side of a hill at nightfall, with the enemy lurking just several hundred metres away in the dark. Most of us cannot begin to imagine what it was like to serve in an extreme climate that could vary from monsoon rains to blazing heat or bitter snow, or to march over the foreign terrain of endless hills, swamps and rice fields.

I am reminded of the words of Sergeant Denis Lapierre, of our Royal 22nd Regiment, and what he said following the battle for the icy slopes of Hill 355 in November, 1951. He said, “We were there to fight, and if need be, to die. And we did”.

That is Canada's story in the Korean War, and it is told one person at a time. It is the story of Canadians who were cut down in the prime of their lives and families forever changed by a nation's loss, like Private Curtis Hayes, who never lived to see his twin girls, who were born after he had shipped out to Korea. His two girls grew up without knowing their father.

Canada's story is told through those who were wounded in body or soul or both, those who were never the same and those who were better for their service. It is told through Canadians who distinguish themselves, people like Tommy Prince, one of our most decorated aboriginal warriors. Prince was an Ojibwa from Manitoba who served in Korea with the Princess Patricia's Canadian Light Infantry. He needed only 13 words to explain his service: “As soon as I put on my uniform, I felt a better man”.

That is what Bill S-213 really represents. It honours the very best of what it means to be Canadian. It recognizes that Canada's history in the Korean War is as proud, tragic and diverse as the individual Canadians who served. It ensures we will never forget their individual service and their personal sacrifice.

Without a doubt, we have heard at committee from veterans organizations and from veterans themselves that they are very proud of our government because we have taken action to ensure that the Korean War will never again be called the “forgotten war”. Rather, each and every Korean veteran will be forever remembered for their commitment and sacrifice.

As I close, I would like to quote from a poem written by Pat O'Connor, a Canadian stretcher bearer who would die the next day while tending to our wounded and fallen soldiers. Pat O'Connor wrote:

There is blood on the hills of Korea
It's the gift of the freedom they love
May their names live in glory forever
And their souls rest in Heaven above.

[Élaine Michaud, NDP, Portneuf—Jacques-Cartier, QC]

Mr. Speaker, I am proud to rise in the House today in support of Bill S-213, An Act respecting a national day of remembrance to honour Canadian veterans of the Korean War.

This is an important bill intended to designate July 27 as Korean War veterans day nationwide.

I would further like to acknowledge the participation of my colleague from Sackville—Eastern Shore, the official opposition critic for veterans affairs, in the drafting of this bill. I also want to recognize the tremendous work he does every day with our brave Canadian veterans, as well as his sincere devotion to their cause.

I would also like to acknowledge the considerable work done by the member for Châteauguay—Saint-Constant as the deputy critic for veteran affairs. He is also very dedicated to this cause and works very hard on this. He was an excellent critic for this bill, and I want to express my appreciation for his efforts.

This is considered by many as the forgotten war, and to this day the great achievements and contributions of our brave Korean War veterans are still too often overlooked, yet, during this conflict, which lasted over three years, more than 26,000 Canadian soldiers joined the UN mission to help the South Korean people and stop this act of aggression by North Korea.

In this valiant struggle to defend democracy and freedom, 516 of these soldiers made the ultimate sacrifice by giving their lives, and of those who came home, many still bear physical and psychological scars that will never fully heal.

We must never forget their courage and dedication in the service of their country, as well as all the sacrifices that these men and women made to preserve peace in the world.

By marking July 27 as Korean War veterans day, we will help commemorate their bravery and honour them as they deserve.

I come from a military family, so Bill S-213 has a special meaning for me. My father is currently an active member of the Canadian army and my mother is a member of the Royal Canadian Navy reserve.

When I was a child, they started teaching me about the huge sacrifices made by members of Canada's military over the course of history, and they taught me that we have a duty to remember those sacrifices every single day, not just on November 11. That is an important date, but every day should be a day of commemoration.

My grandfather, Lieutenant Colonel Norbert LaViolette, also had a career in the armed forces and was among the Canadian veterans who participated in the UN mission in Korea.

Now, a few days before his 90th birthday, I have the privilege of hosting him on Parliament Hill and paying tribute to him to sincerely thank him for his military service during the Korean War and throughout his career.

Lieutenant Colonel LaViolette enrolled in the Canadian Officers' Training Corps at Université du Sacré-Coeur in Bathurst in 1941. He enrolled in the Royal Canadian Air Force in 1943 and then transferred to the supplementary reserve a few years later. When he realized that he was not particularly fond of airplanes, he enrolled in the Canadian army in 1950 and started studying mechanical engineering at the Nova Scotia Technical College.

He was deployed to South Korea in 1953 and stayed there for one year, making him one of the 7,000 Canadian soldiers who helped keep the peace after the armistice was signed.

When he participated in the UN mission in Korea, my grandfather was 27 years old and was a lieutenant with the Corps of Royal Canadian Electrical and Mechanical Engineers. His unit's role was to provide front-line maintenance support for Canadian vehicles and weaponry.

We all know that our soldiers are dedicated and that they honour human rights and Canadian values. Whenever possible, my grandfather and his colleagues tried to help the poorest people in the villages surrounding their base. It was hard for my grandfather to see these people suffering and to see all the destruction left behind by the North Korean soldiers, who even killed all of the male animals in the livestock herds so that the villagers could not renew their food source.

I am very proud of my grandfather's military service and everything he accomplished in Korea. Lucky for us, the only visible scars he came back with were a fear of snakes and such a bad memory of the taste of the water that he still avoids it to this day.

Lucky for us, he came home and raised his family. He is still with us today and will celebrate his 90th birthday on Thursday. However, not all of our soldiers were so lucky. We need to remember them and all of the sacrifices they made. We need to remember all those whose names are in the Korean Book of Remembrance in the Memorial Chamber within Parliament's Peace Tower. They sacrificed themselves for their country, and we need to pay tribute to them. Dedicating July 27 in their honour would be a wonderful way of doing just that.

However, we must also ensure that our veterans receive all the services they deserve after having given so much for their country in the service of democracy. I hope that they will get the support they need, as will Canadian Legions, which need help. They have a difficult time providing services for their members and even keeping their doors open, yet they play a key role in ensuring that members' service is not forgotten. Legions also serve as a meeting place, a place of community. They offer support and organize funerals for veterans.

Those are the kinds of things we need in this country in order to pay just tribute to veterans and take care of them once they return. Many of them left everything behind to take up arms when Canada put out the call. When the UN asked, Canadian soldiers were there. They did not hesitate to join the Korean War. In fact, Canada sent one of the highest numbers of soldiers, per capita, to Korea. Those men and women sacrificed themselves. They went to the front lines and were ready to give their lives for the values we cherish here in Canada. They were ready to defend the ideals of freedom and democracy that we enjoy here and want to see established in every country on earth.

I am happy that all the parties of the House made such a concerted effort to move this bill forward quickly. If everything goes smoothly and this passes through the legislative process quickly, we could be celebrating the first official day of remembrance to honour Canadian veterans of the Korean War this year, in 2013, the 60th anniversary of the Korean War armistice.

We have achieved this outcome today because all parties of the House were able to work together, thereby allowing us to honour people like my grandfather, people who truly gave their all in the service of Canada. It is a great privilege for me to have the chance to pay tribute to him today. I know that that time in his life had a tremendous impact on him.

Earlier I was talking about some of the bad memories he brought back with him. I am sure he had others that he never shared with his family, because soldiers sometimes experience horrible atrocities when taking part in armed conflict. We know this from our veterans returning from Afghanistan, for example. I had the opportunity to welcome some of them home to CFB Valcartier. Some of them were my age, and some even younger. Their experiences overseas will mark them for life. Some of them can no longer be members of the Canadian Forces because of what they went through while they were overseas. Nevertheless, we remember their sacrifice.

I welcome the initiative the House is taking through Bill S-213. Once again, I thank all of my colleagues in the House and those in the other place for their support. I hope this bill will pass quickly so that we can celebrate the first day of remembrance to honour Canadian veterans of the Korean War in 2013.

[Kevin Lamoureux, Liberal, Winnipeg North, MB]

Mr. Speaker, it is with pleasure that I rise today to speak to what is a very important bill. The member who spoke before me talked a lot about the support for Bill S-213. It goes a long way in recognizing what many Canadians have acknowledged for years, particularly our war vets, which is the important role Canadian soldiers played in Korea a number of decades ago. I believe that all members of the House of Commons support passage of this bill and want to see it passed as quickly as possible.

It is important for us to recognize July 27 as the signing of the armistice between South Korea and North Korea. Most people are not necessarily aware that in the neighbourhood of 26,000 members of the Canadian Forces participated in the Korean War, of which 516 lost their lives. Another 1,558 were wounded. This year, 2013, marks the 60th anniversary of the Korean armistice. The war began in 1950. Three years later, in 1953, in came to an end. Canadians continued to serve until roughly 1955 and some as late as 1957.

It was the first time the United Nations deployed members, and Canada was part of the United Nations. July 27 is the day designated a special day to acknowledge the signing of the armistice between South Korea and North Korea.

My colleague from Charlottetown raised the issue of the impact of that particular war. If we want a good indication of the roles the United Nations and Canada played, we should look at where South Korea is today. I will quote what he said, because he said it quite well:

The progress South Korea has experienced in the last 60 years is nothing short of remarkable. It is now the tenth largest economy in the world. The capital, Seoul, is a world-class, vibrant city of 11 million people, with high-rises and modern infrastructure. It has hosted the Olympics as well as the FIFA World Cup. It is a world leader in electronics and manufacturing. We have all heard of Hyundai and Samsung.

South Korea has done exceptionally well in all aspects of being a modern society. North Korea is strikingly different. That part of Korean society has not done nearly as well in terms of progress. We need to recognize that Canada and the United Nations played a significant role.

The Korean War began on June 25, 1950, when military forces from North Korea crossed into South Korea. For the first time in its early history, the United Nations became engaged, and forces were deployed under the UN flag.

Canadians, as I said, played a critical role during that war. We saw action in the battle of Kapyong and many others, beginning in April 1951. During that two-day battle, there were some 10 Canadians killed and 23 wounded. I know my colleague spoke at length, citing other battles that were fought where Canadians played a significant role.

I had the opportunity to serve in the forces. On Remembrance Day or in parades, quite often the highlight is put on World War I or World War II at military events. Many argued that we never gave enough attention to what took place in Korea. It is really only in the last couple of decades that there has been more attention given to Canada's role in Korea and the positive impact it had in that region of the world. In time, I suspect, we will see more recognition given to Korea.

Liberals see Bill S-213 as a step in the right direction in acknowledging those individuals who paid the supreme sacrifice and lost their lives while representing Canada and serving through the United Nations. As we move forward, I hope and anticipate that this bill will pass relatively quickly. I think there are many people watching who want this legislation to become law prior to the conclusion of this session for the simple reason that it would be wonderful to give that recognition on the 60th anniversary.

We in the Liberal Party recognize the importance of passing this legislation. We would like the legislation to pass prior to the conclusion of this session, whenever that might be, so that communities across Canada will be able to express their appreciation on July 27, marking the armistice agreement that was signed so many years ago.

[Fin Donnelly, NDP, New Westminster—Coquitlam, BC]

Mr. Speaker, I rise today to speak in support of Bill S-213, An Act respecting a national day of remembrance to honour Canadian veterans of the Korean War. If this bill passes, July 27 will be designated Korean War veterans day.

Bill S-213 originated as a Senate private member's bill introduced by British Columbian senator Yonah Martin. The bill passed third reading in Senate in March and is now in the final stages of debate before the House of Commons. Canada's New Democrats support this bill and its intent to support veterans and their families.

For too long, the contributions of Canada's Korean War veterans have been overlooked. More than 26,000 Canadian servicemen and servicewomen served in the Korean War; 516 of them made the ultimate sacrifice in what has come to be known as “Canada's forgotten war”. The role of Canadian troops in key battles, like Kapyong and Hill 355, demonstrated the courage and distinction with which our soldiers served. After the war ended in 1953, about 7,000 Canadians remained in Korea to serve as military observers until the end of 1955.

Canadian soldiers were the recipients of numerous awards for valour, including nine distinguished service orders, thirty-three military crosses, five distinguished flying crosses, eight distinguished conduct medals and fifty-three military medals. In addition, the Second Battalion of the Princess Patricia's Canadian Light Infantry was awarded the United States Presidential Unit Citation.

The Korean people have also expressed gratitude to our veterans for their service and sacrifice. In fact, when our veterans return to visit Korea, they are treated as honoured guests. Many veterans made the trip this year, including local constituent and decorated Korean War veteran Frank Smyth from Coquitlam who travelled to Korea to visit the war memorials and see how the country has developed over the past 60 years.

However, sadly, when soldiers returned home from Korea, their contributions were not recognized by their fellow Canadians in the same way as other veterans' contributions. It took 40 years before the Canadian government officially acknowledged the sacrifices made by our Korean War veterans who fought in a three-year-long war and watched too many of their fellow comrades die in battle. Veterans' groups like the Korea Veterans Association of Canada and the Royal Canadian Legion have been key drivers in the efforts to ensure that we do a proper job as a country of honouring the fallen soldiers of the Korean War as well as its thousands of veterans.

Thanks to their efforts, today Canadians can visit the Korea Veterans National Wall of Remembrance in Brampton, Ontario, where a plaque bears the names of Canadians who died in service. Canadians can also visit the Memorial Chamber in the Peace Tower here on Parliament Hill, where the Korean War Book of Remembrance contains the names of all 516 fallen soldiers.

I would like to recognize the efforts of Port Moody resident Guy Black who led a multi-year campaign for Canada Post to issue a commemorative stamp of the Korean War. He assembled hundreds of letters of support for the application. He enlisted my help in the campaign, and I lobbied the Minister of Veterans Affairs as well as the minister responsible for Canada Post, both of whom were supportive. Unfortunately, Canada Post rejected Mr. Black's applications. I commend Mr. Black for his many years of hard work and dedication to this cause.

As we now look to designate July 27 as Korean War veterans day, it is important to note that the duty to remember is not only for one day, but for every day of the year. The same, of course, can be said for Remembrance Day. In fact, there is far more we can do as a society to pay tribute to veterans. Respect for soldiers can be seen in the Canadian government's treatment of our veterans through benefits and services provided by the Department of Veterans Affairs. Much work remains to be done to ensure all veterans are given the honour and fair treatment they deserve. Assistance for veterans of more recent missions is particularly lacking.

Earlier this year, we heard the story of Colonel Neil Russell who, as a post-Korean War vet, was denied access to a veteran's bed in a long-term care facility. This policy is unacceptable and must change.

My mother-in-law Signe Radelet, who is 93 years young, is a veteran of the Second World War. She served three years in Kitsilano, Vancouver. She never received government support her entire life; now she does require support, such as a wheelchair and housing assistance. However, because she did not serve overseas, she is ineligible for government assistance from veterans affairs. Like so many other veterans, Signe served her country, asked little in return, raised her family, and now, near the end of her life, requires a little help. The government should be there to provide this help. It is the least it can do, given her contribution to Canada.

The treatment of Canada's Korean War vets should be a lesson in avoiding the practice of splitting up vets into different categories that receive different levels of recognition or benefits. The government should treat all veterans fairly, regardless of where or when they served. Some of these wrongs are slowly being corrected, like expanding the eligibility criteria for the Last Post Fund and returning unfairly deducted benefits to veterans, yet many are concerned that a quarter of a billion dollars in cuts to veterans affairs will hamper progress.

I hope the House will indulge me to take a moment to also recognize the important work of former MP and MLA Dawn Black, who drew much-needed attention to the problems of post-traumatic stress disorder and other psychological injuries among soldiers returning home from Afghanistan. Dawn was an excellent representative for her constituents, and her legacy is great. I want to thank Dawn for her many years of public service, and I wish her and Peter all the best as they begin to enjoy their retirement years together.

Bill S-213 proposes to create a Korean War veterans day. I would like to reiterate the official opposition's support for this timely initiative. The year 2013 marks the 60th anniversary of the end of the Korean War. It also marks 50 years of Canadian-Korean diplomatic relations, and Canada has designated 2013 as the Year of Korea.

Our countries' long-standing bilateral relationship is an important one based on co-operation in key areas like arts and culture, trade, democracy, human rights and tourism. Evidence of this can be seen in the constituency I represent of New Westminster--Coquitlam and Port Moody, which is home to a large, vibrant Korean-Canadian community.

I have also had the pleasure of being a member of the Canada Korea Inter-Parliamentary Friendship Group. This has afforded me an opportunity to play a small role in strengthening the friendship between our two countries.

I am pleased to support Bill S-213 at third reading and I look forward to its becoming law.

Finally, I would like to acknowledge the efforts of the member for Sackville—Eastern Shore, the official opposition's veterans affairs critic, for his contributions to the early stages of this legislation and for his continued efforts on behalf of Canada's veterans.

[Blaine Calkins, Conservative, Wetaskiwin, AB]

Mr. Speaker, I would like to thank all my colleagues in the House today and at previous readings of this bill for their support. We had unanimous support for this bill at a standing vote on second reading.

I would like to thank my colleagues for their kind words. Sometimes people feel as though they might be all alone in having family affected by the Korean War. It was inspiring to hear that I am not the only member of this House with family members who served in the Korean conflict.

I would especially like to thank my good friend Senator Yonah Martin for spearheading this. She has been a stalwart supporter of our Korean War veterans. I have nothing but respect and admiration for her as she is doing what should have been done so long ago, which is rightly paying tribute to the Canadian Korean War veterans who fought so valiantly on behalf of the people of Korea.

I would like to thank the Korea Veterans Association of Canada, KVA Canada, for all they do in organizing all the events that are important in not only commemorating the Korean War and respecting our veterans but also in making sure our Korean veterans are well served.

I would also like to thank the Royal Canadian Legion, all branches, for their stalwart support of veterans in the broader scope, including, of course, our Korean War veterans. I could not be more proud of an organization in our country than the Royal Canadian Legion.

I would like to thank the men and women of our Canadian Armed Forces. They have my respect and the respect of all members of this country as they continue to do what those who fought before them have done so valiantly. They are always standing on guard for our country.

I would also like to thank the Government of South Korea for all that they do. I mentioned this in my speech. They have never forgotten the sacrifices that have been made. While we here in Canada might call this the “forgotten war”, I can assure members that in Korea they have not forgotten the sacrifices made by United Nations countries, Canada being one of them. I thank them for all they do, including the bereavement program that brings bereaved family members or veterans back over.

I have one little quick story. When I was in Korea last November, I had the opportunity to go to the United Nations cemetery in Busan, but due to some flight issues I missed the actual ceremony. I was over there with some veterans who had described Korea as shanty towns and bombed roads, and today it is 12-lane highways with high-rise towers everywhere.

In the area of the UN cemetery in Busan, the buildings are quite low to the ground. It is an anomaly. People have to look at it and see that there are no high-rises. It is because the Government of Korea has decreed that no building can be built that will cast a shadow upon the grave of somebody who fought and died on behalf of the people of South Korea. That is just one example of the reverence the people of Korea have for our veterans.

I would like to thank our Minister of Veterans Affairs, the parliamentary secretary and all members of the committee for making this the Year of Korea in Canada and also the Year of the Korean War Veteran. I would like to thank all of our ex-pats.

In closing, we had the privilege of playing a hockey game on the Rideau Canal this year. A bunch of Canadian ex-pats, through a picture, saw that the various divisions of the Canadian Armed Forces in Korea played hockey on the Imjin River. They have reconstituted this Imjin River Cup. I would like to thank Andrew Monteith and all the Geckos over there.

Whether it is through playing hockey or through other types of events that we commemorate, all of these things remind us of our past and past sacrifices, but also the good things that have come from those sacrifices, such as the freedom to do something simple, like engaging in a hockey game, without fear of any type of repression or oppression. It is just one little way that we can commemorate the great deeds done by the 26,000 members of the Canadian Forces who served in the Korea War.

I hope we can pass this bill at third reading today and do what should have been done so long ago, which is to have a national day commemorating the tremendous sacrifices and the absolute heroics of the Canadians who served during the Korean War.

[The Acting Speaker, Conservative, Barry Devolin]

The question is on the motion. Is it the pleasure of the House to adopt the motion?

[Some hon. members]

Agreed.

[The Acting Speaker, Conservative, Barry Devolin]

I declare the motion carried.

(Motion agreed to, bill read the third time and passed)

Suspension of Sitting

[The Acting Speaker, Conservative, Barry Devolin]

The House will stand suspended until 12 o'clock.

(The sitting of the House was suspended at 11:40 a.m.)

(The House resumed at 12:00 noon)

Bourassa

[The Acting Speaker, Conservative, Barry Devolin]

It is my duty to inform the House that a vacancy has occurred in the representation, namely Mr. Coderre, member for the electoral district of Bourassa, by resignation effective Sunday, June 2, 2013.

Pursuant to subsection 25(1)(b) of the Parliament of Canada Act, I have addressed my warrant to the Chief Electoral Officer for the issue of a writ for the election of a member to fill this vacancy.

Bill C-60--Time Allocation Motion

[Tony Clement, Conservative, President of the Treasury Board and Minister for the Federal Economic Development Initiative for Northern Ontario]

moved:

That, in relation to Bill C-60, An Act to implement certain provisions of the budget tabled in Parliament on March 21, 2013 and other measures, not more than one further sitting day shall be allotted to the consideration at report stage of the Bill and one sitting day shall be allotted to the consideration at third reading stage of the said Bill; and

That, 15 minutes before the expiry of the time provided for Government Orders on the day allotted to the consideration at report stage and on the day allotted to the consideration at third reading stage of the said Bill, any proceedings before the House shall be interrupted, if required for the purpose of this Order, and in turn every question necessary for the disposal of the stage of the Bill then under consideration shall be put forthwith and successively without further debate or amendment.

[The Acting Speaker, Conservative, Barry Devolin]

Pursuant to Standing Order 67.1, there will now be a 30-minute question period. I invite hon. members who wish to ask questions to rise in their places at this point so I can get an assessment of how many members would like to participate.

Typically, questions and comments are about a minute long each. I think that today we can probably go a minute and a half. However, I would encourage all hon. members to pay attention to the Chair for a signal when the member's time is drawing to a close.

Questions and comments.

The hon. member for Parkdale—High Park.

[Peggy Nash, NDP, Parkdale—High Park, ON]

Mr. Speaker, today we have a record in this Parliament: 39 times this government has brought time allocation in to end debate, stifle debate, on parliamentary discussion of parliamentary bills.

Its previous own record stood at 31, which in itself is outrageous, but it has brought in time allocation now on 23 different bills since the election, for a total of 39 times.

The bill on which it is now bringing in time allocation is the budget implementation act, another omnibus budget bill, Bill C-60. In this bill, there are changes that would affect dozens of laws. Different parliamentary committees that should have had the opportunity to debate and question and pass some of this bill as separate individual bills have not had that chance.

This bill would affect the collective bargaining process in our crown corporations, would undermine the journalistic independence of the CBC and could undermine the independence of the Bank of Canada. We called for more study on this measure; the government shut that down.

This is a bill that would tinker with the temporary foreign workers program and the Investment Canada Act, which should themselves have separate debates, and it would raise taxes for Canadians across this country.

My question for the hon. minister is this: what is he and his government so afraid of that they have had to bring in time allocation 39 times?

[Tony Clement, Conservative, Parry Sound—Muskoka, ON]

Mr. Speaker, in each of those cases there were very good reasons, mostly involving the fact that there had been quite considerable debate in this chamber or in various parliamentary committees before time allocation proceeded, which sets the rules for further debate in the House of Commons.

In this case, the budget bill has been a matter of discussion, both inside and outside the House, since March, almost 70 days ago. The bill has been before the finance committee, the industry committee, the veterans affairs committee, the human resources committee, the citizenship and immigration committee and the foreign affairs committee.

Many parliamentarians have participated in the debate, either in this chamber or in our House of Commons committees. That debate has been quite extensive and it is now time we have a motion to deal with further debate in the House and reach its logical conclusion.

[Scott Brison, Liberal, Kings—Hants, NS]

Mr. Speaker, we have heard from a number of witnesses, including Friends of Canadian Broadcasting, at committee. Also members of the finance committee received a letter from Hubert Lacroix, the president of CBC, who took what was almost an unprecedented step of writing to member and essentially threatening a court case if Bill C-60 passed without amendment. He said, “this legislation threatens the independence of the CBC and Radio Canada”. He said:

We believe that the proposed amendments to the Financial Administration Act...may conflict with key parts of the Broadcasting Act, our Corporation's governing legislation, and as a result, would reduce the independence that is critical to our operation.

He also said, “may give rise to conflicts with the Broadcasting Act and the Charter” and could ultimately lead to significant challenges in legal challenges with the corporation. He simply said that we could avoid all of this with an amendment that would protect the independence of the CBC.

Why is the government so hell-bent on driving this legislation through with closure? Why is the government not considering constructive amendments to avoid this kind of conflict with the CBC and this threat to the independence of public broadcasting?

[Tony Clement, Conservative, Parry Sound—Muskoka, ON]

Mr. Speaker, I thank the hon. member for further debate that had already occurred in the House of Commons committee on this item. There is no reason why there should not be further debate on it in this chamber as well.

However, the position of the government is that our bill does nothing of the sort in terms of journalistic integrity or independence when it comes to the journalism that is a portion of what the CBC does. Our concern, on behalf of the taxpayer, is that we have these crown corporations, not only the one the hon. member referenced, but dozens of others that go about their business in collective bargaining. At the end of the day, if their collective bargaining means massive changes in liability and in costs to that crown corporation, they turn to the bank of last resort, which is the Government of Canada.

Surely to goodness we should have some say in those collective bargaining arrangements, not in terms of journalistic integrity but in terms of the business affairs of these crown corporations, including, but not limited to the CBC, to ensure taxpayers are protected.