Debates of Nov. 5th, 2020

Income Tax Act

[Navdeep Bains, Liberal, Minister of Innovation]

Mr. Chair, I want to thank my hon. colleague for asking this question, because it enables me to talk about the effort that Canadians undertook across the country. When we had a call to action, over 6,700 Canadians stepped up to help us produce personal protective equipment for frontline health care workers. We are very proud of these efforts. We are very proud of the fact that these Canadians have delivered for our frontline health care workers across the country.

[Michael Barrett, Conservative, Leeds—Grenville—Thousand Islands and Rideau Lakes, ON]

Mr. Chair, why pay more for a ventilator that had no regulatory approval anywhere in the world, except if the reason is that they were a Liberal?

[Navdeep Bains, Liberal, Mississauga—Malton, ON]

Mr. Chair, I would like to remind the hon. colleague that in March and April, when we were dealing with the early stages of this pandemic, we made a call to action to all businesses. We did not look at which party they voted for or their political affiliation. Canadians stepped up in a big way to support frontline health care workers, and we are very proud of that.

[Cathy McLeod, Conservative, Kamloops—Thompson—Cariboo, BC]

Mr. Chair, the rent program was introduced in May. When did the minister realize that there were serious design flaws?

[Chrystia Freeland, Liberal, Deputy Prime Minister and Minister of Finance]

Mr. Chair, what we are here to talk about tonight are the new programs that our government is putting in place.

[Cathy McLeod, Conservative, Kamloops—Thompson—Cariboo, BC]

Mr. Chair, the minister is also a member of Parliament who, I expect, supports many small businesses in her riding. If she is like anyone else in the House, they learned very quickly in May and June that this program was not adequate.

When was the decision made to redesign this rent assistance program?

[Chrystia Freeland, Liberal, University—Rosedale, ON]

Mr. Chair, in the spring when COVID struck our country, there was no playbook.

[Cathy McLeod, Conservative, Kamloops—Thompson—Cariboo, BC]

Mr. Chair, the Liberals knew there were flaws with the program. There was obviously a decision made to redesign it as we have a redesigned program. When the Liberals prorogued for six weeks, they said it was because they needed to focus on a COVID response. It was not about the WE Charity they insisted.

Immediately after the Speech from the Throne, if this was about a COVID response, why have we been debating the Judges Act and other legislation and not this important bill for people who need assistance?

[Chrystia Freeland, Liberal, University—Rosedale, ON]

Mr. Chair, I am glad we are debating this important bill now and I am glad we have been able to include some really innovative measures, particularly the lockdown support. This is a new program. I have not seen one like it anywhere in the world. It will provide targeted support to businesses subject to local lockdowns. It is going to get us through the winter.

[Cathy McLeod, Conservative, Kamloops—Thompson—Cariboo, BC]

Mr. Chair, we had six weeks of prorogation. We have had six weeks of sitting in the House. The Liberals have now finally introduced a bill and they insist it has to be passed by Friday.

When the minister was an opposition member, did she not believe that taking a few hours to hear from expert witnesses at committee did provide valuable input, especially if they had legislation that would spend $5 billion or more?

[Chrystia Freeland, Liberal, University—Rosedale, ON]

Mr. Chair, the member opposite said that we, the government, believe this has to be passed by Friday. I would like to respectfully say I do not think that is some kind of peculiar conviction of ours. All Canadian businesses, all Canadian provinces and territories need this legislation.

[Cathy McLeod, Conservative, Kamloops—Thompson—Cariboo, BC]

Mr. Chair, if they needed this legislation, why was it not introduced right after the Speech from the Throne and why did the government prorogue for six weeks? Businesses have been sitting with no support and they have been closing their doors. How many businesses had to close their doors in July, August and September, while those guys dithered with their legislation?

[Chrystia Freeland, Liberal, University—Rosedale, ON]

Mr. Chair, businesses do need this support and that is why we are debating this legislation late into tonight. I would like to remind members, as I know they well know, that the support will be retroactive to September 27, so people will be covered for October. This is support our businesses need and support I hope together we can get for them.

[Cathy McLeod, Conservative, Kamloops—Thompson—Cariboo, BC]

Mr. Chair, I have always found that having a few hours and a few panels of expert witnesses actually improves legislation. The minister insists that we have to move fast because Liberals moved so slow. Why are they so reluctant to hear from a few people who really understand what is happening and who might actually improve the legislation, by refusing throughout this pandemic to have a reasonable process for billions in spending?

[Chrystia Freeland, Liberal, University—Rosedale, ON]

Mr. Chair, I am a little puzzled by the contradictions embedded in that question. On the one hand, the member opposite is quite rightly pointing out that businesses need support now. I could not agree more. On the other hand, the member opposite is asking why we want to pass this legislation with alacrity. The first half of the question answers the second half.

[Cathy McLeod, Conservative, Kamloops—Thompson—Cariboo, BC]

Mr. Chair, let me go back.

We had six weeks' prorogation so that the Liberals could plan for COVID and have proper legislation in place. We have come back to this House. We have been in this House for six weeks, and what have we been discussing? We have been discussing legislation about judges. As important as that is, and the other legislation, it is nothing compared to the business owners' needs.

When I talk about a couple of hours to hear from experts, I am talking about three months ago, and they would have improved this minister's programs. Why are the Liberals so reluctant to allow proper process in this House to scrutinize billions and billions in spending?

[Chrystia Freeland, Liberal, University—Rosedale, ON]

As I said, Mr. Chair, we need to decide what matters most. I am firmly convinced, and I actually believe that in their hearts of hearts everyone in this House shares the conviction, that at the end of the day what matters the most is getting support to our business owners now, and getting support to them with alacrity. That is what we are committed to doing. These programs are good programs that would provide essential support as we fight the second wave of COVID. I hope the members opposite will join us in supporting them.

[Monique Pauzé, Bloc, Repentigny, QC]

Mr. Chair, the Canada emergency wage subsidy is still available to political parties under the Bill C-9. The Liberal government puts forward programs, and then the Liberal Party takes advantage of them.

A poll conducted in June found that almost half of the population was against the practice. Even Liberal voters were against it. There is a real uneasiness at seeing all the federal parties, except the Bloc, taking advantage of a measure voted for by elected officials. The wage subsidy is there for the economy and for businesses, not for political parties.

Does the Deputy Prime Minister and Minister of Finance not think that what the Liberals have done is unjustifiable?

[Chrystia Freeland, Liberal, Deputy Prime Minister and Minister of Finance]

Mr. Chair, I thank my colleague for her question.

The Canada emergency wage subsidy is designed to help employers protect the jobs that Canadians depend on and to rehire employees who have already been laid off. The support applies to employers of all sizes in all sectors, including not-for-profit organizations that have been hard hit by COVID-19.

To date, more than 3.8 million employees across the country are being supported by the wage subsidy. It is a good program.

[Monique Pauzé, Bloc, Repentigny, QC]

Mr. Chair, in the poll, 57% of respondents called for the amounts to be paid back.

Will they pay it back?

[Chrystia Freeland, Liberal, University—Rosedale, ON]

Mr. Chair, I would once again like to note the importance of the wage subsidy program for the 3.8 million Canadians.

[Monique Pauzé, Bloc, Repentigny, QC]

Mr. Chair, we agree on Bill C-9 because for months, SMEs have needed urgent assistance.

On April 11, the Bloc Québécois started calling for support for fixed costs. Let's talk about the Canada emergency commercial rent assistance program. That program was poorly designed. It was too restrictive and too rigid. For example, chiropractors in Repentigny could not receive that assistance because the property owner did not apply.

Why did the government wait until November to support our businesses and their employees when help was and still is urgently needed?

[Chrystia Freeland, Liberal, University—Rosedale, ON]

Mr. Chair, I obviously agree that we must now provide assistance directly to the businesses to help with fixed costs and rent. That is why are introducing a bill that does exactly that. I am pleased that the hon. member agrees that this is a good step to take. I hope we can do this quickly.

[Monique Pauzé, Bloc, Repentigny, QC]

Mr. Chair, I thank the minister for her reply.

The government has a record of announcing programs well before they are voted on and implemented. Bill C-9 was introduced one month after it was announced. That said, better late than never.

However, businesses need predictability, and several hard-hit sectors, including the aerospace industry, hotels in urban areas, culture, festivals and even sugar shacks, need targeted programs.

How will the government ensure that no sector falls through the cracks?

[Chrystia Freeland, Liberal, University—Rosedale, ON]

Mr. Chair, that is another good and important question.

I will start with the rent subsidy because I want to point out a new component that is really important for Quebec, and that is targeted support for businesses subject to new lockdowns. I am very supportive of the measures that the Province of Quebec has taken to combat the coronavirus, and this additional assistance will help the province make the right decisions. This is an innovative component that I am very pleased with.