Debates of Dec. 7th, 2021

Supplementary Estimates (B), 2021-22

[Daniel Blaikie, NDP, Elmwood—Transcona, MB]

Mr. Speaker, I will begin by indicating that I will be using my entire time for questions and answers, and I will not be restricting my questions to any one minister in particular. I find it hard enough to get an answer around here, and I would hate to unduly restrict the possibility that I might get one.

We have already talked in this Parliament about the fact that Canadians are not going to be safe from COVID-19 variants until everyone in the world is properly vaccinated. We know that wealthy countries such as Canada have had some success in rolling out the vaccine, but in the rest of the world the vaccination rate is just unacceptably low. We also know that for some time now there has been an effort at the WTO to get what is called TRIPS waiver, which would release the intellectual property rights to vaccine production and allow others to expedite production of the vaccine in their own place.

Could someone on the government bench tell me what it would cost the Government of Canada to support the TRIPS waiver at the WTO?

[Jean-Yves Duclos, Liberal, Minister of Health]

Mr. Speaker, my colleague, the Minister of Foreign Affairs, would be more than capable of answering that question and could probably do a better job of it than I can.

First of all, I will say that it is an extremely important question.

We know that ending this pandemic anywhere means ending it everywhere. That is why we have been working so hard with our international partners since the very beginning of COVID-19. We did not wait until Canadians were almost all fully vaccinated to do this. We were one of the early major contributors in and agents for setting up COVAX, with 200 million doses promised to the rest of the world with a $2.5 billion investment, which I may come back to in a moment.

[Daniel Blaikie, NDP, Elmwood—Transcona, MB]

Mr. Speaker, I did not hear a dollar amount in there, so how much would it cost the government to support the TRIPS waiver?

[Jean-Yves Duclos, Liberal, Québec, QC]

Mr. Speaker, the $2.5 billion is not for vaccines. It is for additional investments to help other countries not only receive and manage, but also administer those vaccines.

[Daniel Blaikie, NDP, Elmwood—Transcona, MB]

Mr. Speaker, what would be the dollar cost of supporting the TRIPS waiver at the WTO?

[Jean-Yves Duclos, Liberal, Québec, QC]

Mr. Speaker, there is obviously value in working internationally together to set up these efforts, and that includes working with the WTO, including on the TRIPS waiver. With this, something has been done for a large number of months now.

[Daniel Blaikie, NDP, Elmwood—Transcona, MB]

Mr. Speaker, I think the minister meant to say zero dollars. The good news is that there is that much requested for the TRIPS waiver in the estimates, so it is a fully funded initiative. I look forward to the announcement.

There is $1.8 billion requested, or stated, in the statutory expenditures for the Canada recovery benefit, but we know very well that in fact a lot of what was paid out under CERB and the CRB is now being clawed back from some of the most financially vulnerable people in Canada: our seniors on the GIS and low-income families that depend on the Canada child benefit.

I wonder if this is an adjusted amount to reflect that the government is clawing back so many of those payments from our most vulnerable.

[Randy Boissonnault, Liberal, Minister of Tourism and Associate Minister of Finance]

Mr. Speaker, as I have said before, and as the Minister of Seniors has said, this is a complex issue. We are working this issue. We understand the situation seniors are facing with a clawback from their GIS for those who received CERB.

It is an important question. We are going to continue to work on this question. We have heard from seniors. The Minister of Seniors and our whole government are working on this issue. We will get it done.

[Daniel Blaikie, NDP, Elmwood—Transcona, MB]

Mr. Speaker, in fact, it is not complicated. It is just a matter of excluding the pandemic benefit income from the eligibility calculation for these income-tested programs. I will ask this again: Is the amount of the clawback represented in the figure presented in the estimates?

[Randy Boissonnault, Liberal, Edmonton Centre, AB]

Mr. Speaker, as I stated, and as I will continue to state in answer to the same question, this is a matter that we are taking very seriously. We have heard from seniors. It is a question that is active inside our government. The Minister of Seniors and the whole of government is working on this very important issue.

[Daniel Blaikie, NDP, Elmwood—Transcona, MB]

Mr. Speaker, the people who take it seriously are the seniors who are being evicted right now, those who have already been evicted, and the people who are advocating for them here in the House. We know that the government has stated there is another $1.8 billion under the Canada recovery benefit. What we do not know is if this represents the amount they are saving by clawing back the benefits of vulnerable seniors and low-income families.

[Randy Boissonnault, Liberal, Edmonton Centre, AB]

Mr. Speaker, I think our government has proven its mettle in the face of the worst global pandemic in 100 years. This is a progressive government full of compassion. We invested over $380 billion into the livelihoods and lives of Canadians, businesses, seniors and people of all ages. We will continue to do the right thing by Canadians.

[Daniel Blaikie, NDP, Elmwood—Transcona, MB]

Mr. Speaker, let me put it another way. How much is the government budgeting to save on GIS and Canada child benefit costs this year as a result of people falling out of the program because they received pandemic benefits last year?

[Randy Boissonnault, Liberal, Edmonton Centre, AB]

Mr. Speaker, let me be very clear that the investments this government made in Canadians are exactly that: investments. We are not making any calculations that would even in anybody's wildest dreams be called “savings”. These are investments in Canadians, and we will continue to make them.

[Daniel Blaikie, NDP, Elmwood—Transcona, MB]

Mr. Speaker, we know that the government has written letters to, for example, foster kids who graduated out of foster care during the pandemic. They were told by the provincial government in Manitoba, for example, that they could not apply for social assistance in the summer of 2020, despite the fact that there were no jobs, and that they had to apply for the CERB first. Of course, there was a no-fail policy, so they got the CERB, and now the government is asking for that back.

Does the minister have a number on how much the government intends to get back from low-income Canadians who received CERB payments in good faith? How much is the government looking to save on the backs of those vulnerable Canadians?

[Randy Boissonnault, Liberal, Edmonton Centre, AB]

Mr. Speaker, our record speaks for itself. We supported millions of Canadians during the pandemic. We are continuing to support Canadians in the hardest-hit sectors as we come through this recovery period. I might say to my hon. colleague that if he wants to make sure some of the most vulnerable people are supported, I encourage him and his caucus members to support Bill C-2.

[Daniel Blaikie, NDP, Elmwood—Transcona, MB]

Mr. Speaker, I encourage the minister to read his bill, because the fact of the matter is that 900,000 people were kicked off the CERB in October with two days' warning, and the bill will not do a thing for any of those people. In fact, when I asked the minister in opening the debate how many regions and which regions of the country would be covered by the Canada worker lockdown benefit from October 23 to the present day, the answer was none, and we have not heard anything that would change our point of view about that.

I will ask again. When it comes to low-income Canadians from whom the government is demanding repayment of CERB benefits and who do not have the money, how much is the government anticipating that it is going to get back?

[Randy Boissonnault, Liberal, Edmonton Centre, AB]

Mr. Speaker, this is a government that has always supported people. It has been very clear that, as we get into what we hope are the final stages of this global pandemic, now is the time to pull back on some of the more generous benefits, because these once-in-a-hundred-year investments in our economy were always intended to be and always translated as exceptional measures for an exceptional time. Now that we are coming out of that time, we are making these adjustments. We will always be there for people. The proof is in our investments in Canadians, and that is what we will continue to do.

[Daniel Blaikie, NDP, Elmwood—Transcona, MB]

Mr. Speaker, when the minister says it is time to pull back on the benefits, is he referring to the clawbacks?

[Randy Boissonnault, Liberal, Edmonton Centre, AB]

Mr. Speaker, we are talking about making sure short-term measures are in place, like the lockdown, and should a jurisdiction in the country go into lockdown, Canadians will be able to access benefits.

[Daniel Blaikie, NDP, Elmwood—Transcona, MB]

Mr. Speaker, it is about time we had a CERB low-income repayment amnesty in Canada, and that would do a lot toward not leaving behind those financially vulnerable people I am talking about.

With respect to the 900,000 Canadians who were dropped like a brick from the CRB program with just two days' notice, what training resources does the government intend to provide in order to help them qualify for the jobs that are currently available in the market?

[Randy Boissonnault, Liberal, Edmonton Centre, AB]

Mr. Speaker, our government has proven itself, not only with investments during the pandemic, but also with retooling and reorganizing the entire way we fund skills development in this country. The minister has been very clear on that and so has our government.

[Daniel Blaikie, NDP, Elmwood—Transcona, MB]

Mr. Speaker, there is no question that we have a labour shortage here in Canada, yet we have a lot of workers who are seeking work and cannot find jobs, and 900,000 of them were on the CRB. What dollar amount is being requested here in order to provide training supports so they have the skills and education that employers are looking for to fill their positions?

[Randy Boissonnault, Liberal, Edmonton Centre, AB]

Mr. Speaker, I appreciate the hon. member's focusing on the issue of labour, because it allows me to remind all members that we have before this House a crucially important piece of legislation, Bill C-2. I would remind colleagues that Bill C-2 would extend the Canada recovery hiring program until May 7, 2022 for eligible employers and increase the subsidy rate to 50%. In short, this benefit will be good for Canadians. We hope the opposition will support it.

[Daniel Blaikie, NDP, Elmwood—Transcona, MB]

Mr. Speaker, employers cannot hire workers who are not qualified for the positions they need to fill. Instead of just trying to starve those workers back to work when they do not have the qualifications, what is the government doing to support them to get the education and training they need to fill the jobs that are available in the market?