Debates of Oct. 16th, 2023

Situation in Israel, Gaza and the West Bank

[Peter Julian, NDP, New Westminster—Burnaby, BC]

Mr. Chair, I welcome the member to the House.

There is no doubt that Hamas is the enemy of the Israeli people and the Palestinian people. The human rights violations have been widespread. The killing of 1,400 innocent people attests to that. They are brothers, sisters, parents and children who died. I know if any member in this House could have done anything to stop the deaths of 1,400 people, they would have stepped forward.

That is the point the member for Edmonton Strathcona and the leader of the NDP made. At this sombre occasion, there is the collective punishment that is taking place and the bombing in Gaza right now. The death toll is rising to 3,000 people. There are 1,000 children dead so far and 10,000 wounded.

The question is if we could stop the killing of those innocent lives, those brothers, sisters, parents and children, through this bombing, would we not step up to do that? Is that not what is behind the important call for a ceasefire, to have that humanitarian corridor so that food and water can get to the people who have no food, no medicine and no water? Ensuring that the hostages are released is absolutely fundamental as well.

Is that not our role? Should it be Canada's role to ensure there is no further loss of life?

[Ben Carr, Liberal, Winnipeg South Centre, MB]

Mr. Chair, the collective punishment is the collective punishment that Hamas is creating. The conditions that Hamas is creating is collective punishment on its own people and the people of Israel.

I would ask my hon. colleague to reflect throughout this debate and afterward on what would happen should there be a ceasefire. Of course we want an end to the conflict. Of course we want to end the loss of innocent lives. If Hamas were able to continue, it would rebuild and it would rebuild stronger. It would attack again because its objective is the eradication of the Jewish people from the face of the earth.

Although I have a deep appreciation for the moral objective that members from the NDP feel they bring to the conversation, it is not a pragmatic, practical or realistic way to deal with a terrorist organization hell-bent on genocide.

[Pierre Paul-Hus, Conservative, Charlesbourg—Haute-Saint-Charles, QC]

Mr. Chair, I will be sharing my time with the member for Charleswood—St. James—Assiniboia—Headingley.

First of all, we are having a lot of trouble clearly identifying who we are dealing with when it comes to Hamas. Last week, for example, I was flabbergasted to hear that CBC/Radio-Canada had asked its news anchors not to use the word “terrorist” to refer to Hamas. Last night, on the program Tout le monde en parle, news anchor Céline Galipeau answered a question from Guy A. Lepage by saying, “Out of concern for remaining neutral, we prefer to use more specific and neutral language, but we can speak of combatants, armed men or hostage-takers. That's what we prefer.”

I am going to use the time I have left to talk about Hamas in more detail, because I think some people may not understand exactly who we are dealing with.

Hamas emerged in late 1987, at the beginning of the first Palestinian intifada. The group's charter calls for the establishment of a Palestinian state in the place of Israel and rejects all agreements between the Palestinian Authority and Israel. Hamas has a military branch that has led many anti-Israeli attacks in Israel and in Palestinian territories since the 1990s. Hamas continues to refuse to recognize Israel or to abandon its violent resistance against Israel. It proactively encourages and leads terrorist attacks and does everything it can to sow hatred against Jews. As a result, the American government designated Hamas as a terrorist organization in 1997, and Canada followed suit in 2002.

Hamas's explicit mission is to murder Jews and to eradicate Israel and replace it with a Taliban-type theocracy. Videos distributed primarily by Hamas and posted on social media document acts of torture, sexual violence, violence against children and desecration of corpses. Even Palestinian officials have recognized that the missiles fired by Hamas constituted war crimes. A Palestinian envoy to the Human Rights Council said that every missile launched against Israel constitutes a crime against humanity, whether or not it hits its target, because it was directed at civilian targets.

On October 7, 2023, over 1,500 Hamas terrorists attacked the Israeli border around the Gaza Strip and went on a murderous rampage in the southern regions. Over 1,300 people were killed and thousands more were wounded in this bloody attack, which was accompanied by a barrage of 5,000 rockets launched indiscriminately on Israeli towns and villages.

Why deny reality? The members of Hamas are terrorists. There is ample evidence of that. It is time to tell the whole truth about these violent criminals. This is not merely a conflict between two peoples. These are acts of terrorism and war crimes. What is more, I think it is despicable that anyone in Canada can express support for Hamas knowing that at least five Canadians are among the victims, including Alexandre Look of Montreal.

Israel has the right to defend itself and to exist. We will always unequivocally the terrorist acts without mincing words. We will always stand by the Israeli people. Hamas must be destroyed. Hamas has provoked something irreparable, and it must pay the price.

[René Villemure, Bloc, Trois-Rivières, QC]

Mr. Chair, I thank my colleague for his speech. This does not happen often, but for once, we are in agreement. The members of Hamas are terrorists. Hamas is seeking the annihilation of Israel. Hamas is evil. We all agree on that.

However, does the fact that these terrorists want to cause harm and the annihilation of Israel justify any action that will affect the entire Palestinian people?

Is my colleague for or against the establishment of a humanitarian corridor?

[Pierre Paul-Hus, Conservative, Charlesbourg—Haute-Saint-Charles, QC]

Mr. Chair, as we have indicated today, we are in favour of establishing a humanitarian corridor and providing support in safe zones. We also support the evacuation.

As a priority, we obviously call on Hamas to release the three Canadians being held hostage and to allow the evacuation of other Canadians in the Gaza Strip or elsewhere in Israel who want to leave. Obviously, we support those calls.

[Anthony Housefather, Liberal, Mount Royal, QC]

Mr. Chair, I thank my hon. colleague for his excellent speech.

Unfortunately, the hon. member may not have heard that the bodies of two of the three Canadians we thought might have been taken hostage were found today. That means the Canadian dead now number seven. I believe it was an attack.

Does my hon. colleague agree with me that it was an attack not only on Israel but on Canada, on the United States and on humanity?

[Pierre Paul-Hus, Conservative, Charlesbourg—Haute-Saint-Charles, QC]

Mr. Chair, sadly, my colleague just informed me that two more Canadians died as a result of Hamas's unspeakable attacks. That is why I took the time in my speech to describe Hamas. I think that is worth repeated reminders.

We often tend to hear people say they are against Hamas, but there is always a “but”. There should be no “buts”. We must be 100%, unequivocally, behind Israel in fighting Hamas and destroying every last one of its members.

[Luc Berthold, Conservative, Mégantic—L'Érable, QC]

Mr. Chair, I never thought that one day I would have to rise in the House to speak about such tragic events.

There is something that I have found surprising all evening: Some have tried to dehumanize what happened on October 7 by talking about an attack on Israel, forgetting that it was an attack on women and children who were subjected to unspeakable acts, on fathers who fought to the death to protect their families, on elderly people who asked for nothing more than to go on living, and on people who were going to celebrate peace nearby. The attack on Israel is first and foremost a terrorist attack on people and on civilians.

Does my colleague agree with me that Hamas, which is behind this despicable, sadistic, and unspeakable attack, needs to be completely eliminated, and that Israel has the right to hunt it down to ensure the safety of Israeli civilians, whatever the cost?

[Pierre Paul-Hus, Conservative, Charlesbourg—Haute-Saint-Charles, QC]

Mr. Chair, quite obviously, my colleague is absolutely right.

There has been a lot of talk about an attack on Israel. Now, it is true that some people are trying to downplay the reality of what happened and the disgusting way Hamas attacked Israeli citizens. Canadians died. Some victims were from the United States. There were people at a concert. Young people were there to have fun and listen to music. Paratroopers came in from all sides and started shooting. It does not make any sense at all.

That is why we always have to think of the act that was committed, whether it was against Israel or against people from any other country who were there that day and were attacked by 1,500 Hamas commandos. These terrorists did this simply to spread terror. That is what terrorism is. It is about spreading terror and scaring people.

[Marty Morantz, Conservative, Charleswood—St. James—Assiniboia—Headingley, MB]

Mr. Chair, on October 7 we woke up to an unspeakable horror. Hamas terrorists brutally invaded Israel, invaded homes, intentionally killing 1,400 Israeli civilians and taking hostage over 100 more.

We must stand shoulder to shoulder with Israel as it defends itself from the criminal and barbarous acts of Hamas. Among the dead are seven Canadians. May their memories be a blessing. At least one Canadian is still missing and presumed held hostage. All hostages must be released.

More Jews were killed in Saturday's attack than on any single day since the Holocaust. They were children, babies, men and women intentionally slaughtered in their homes. They were young people, just out listening to music at a dance party. This was an unprecedented, brutal, intentional attack.

As we speak, Hamas is threatening to execute innocent hostages. This outrage cannot and must not stand. Do not let anyone say that Hamas is the legitimate voice of the Palestinian people. It is not a government. Its members are not activists or freedom fighters. They are not a resistance movement. They are a genocidal, murderous and evil death cult, and they must be defeated.

Hamas has demonstrated, in an especially depraved manner, why it is listed as a terrorist entity by Canada and its western allies. There is broad consensus that the war on Hamas is a just one. Hamas is a sworn enemy of Israel, intent on its annihilation, but it has also betrayed the Palestinian population it claims to represent. Its goal is to maximize the suffering of both Israelis and Palestinians. It serves as a fundamental impediment to peace and the goal of reconciliation between Israel and the Palestinian people.

Make no mistake: Hamas is a direct proxy of Iran, and that is why Canada must list the IRGC as a terrorist entity. I have to say that all celebrations on Canadian soil of the evil, sadistic Hamas terrorist attacks on Israeli citizens are abhorrent. Shame on all those who participated.

Conservatives unequivocally condemn the invasion of Israel by Hamas terrorists and the sadistic violence that Hamas has carried out against innocent civilians. Now is the time for moral clarity. There is no moral equivalency between democratic Israel and the butchers of Hamas. There is no response within the boundaries of international law that would be disproportionate to the crimes Hamas has committed.

Israel has the right to defend itself against these attacks and respond against the attackers, just as any other country would. Theodor Herzl, the father of modern Zionism, was famous for saying, “If you will it, it is no dream.”

In 1948, that dream became a reality, a homeland in Israel, the promised land. Working together, Israelis turned a desert into an oasis, an island of democracy surrounded by a sea of autocracy, a Jewish state where Jews could live in peace, free from fear and persecution.

Let there be no doubt: Israel is the ancient and indigenous homeland of the Jewish people.

Many politicians will stand with Israel when it is easy, but listen to what they say when it is hard. They will talk about both sides. I am here to say that there is only one side: the side of morality, the side of democracy, the side that Israel is on.

Too often we see politicians at the United Nations unfairly single out Israel for criticism. I will always stand against the unfair singling out of the Middle East's only democracy.

We call on the government to conduct an immediate review of all aid going to Gaza, to ensure it does not go to funding Hamas in its campaign of terror but rather to aid innocent civilians. Already there are calls for Israel to de-escalate. I cannot believe I am hearing this, even from the NDP. I ask, would any country de-escalate after having its people slaughtered in cold blood and still held hostage? No, they would not.

I wish the people of Israel and its brave soldiers Godspeed on their mission to defend the promised land from pure evil. As then prime minister Stephen Harper said, “Through fire and water, Canada will stand with you.”

Am Yisrael Chai.

[Anthony Housefather, Liberal, Mount Royal, QC]

Mr. Chair, I thank my hon. colleague, a good friend who delivered an excellent speech.

At the United Nations and at international organizations there is frequently something that happens, which is Israel being treated differently from everyone else in the community of nations. At the UN Human Rights Council, Israel is the only regular item on their agenda. Israel is disproportionately singled out for condemnation in every UN agency.

It seems, with this war, there are some who would treat Israel differently from every other country in terms of its right to self-defence under international law. I am wondering if the hon. member might comment on that issue.

[Marty Morantz, Conservative, Charleswood—St. James—Assiniboia—Headingley, MB]

Mr. Chair, I want to thank my colleague for pointing out that Israel is perpetually singled out. It seems there is a unique obsession, not only in the United Nations but particularly in the United Nations, to hold Israel to a different standard and to say that Israel is not a supporter of human rights or even Palestinian rights. We see countries in the region, autocracies, that do not treat their populations with the same rights, and they cannot be allowed to stand.

[Alexis Brunelle-Duceppe, Bloc, Lac-Saint-Jean, QC]

Mr. Chair, I think that there is a pretty clear consensus tonight that what happened on October 7 is unimaginable. It was a terrorist attack that must be condemned in the strongest possible terms. We also agree that Hamas must be eradicated from the Gaza Strip.

The Gaza Strip is now blockaded and, under international law, humanitarian corridors must be put in place. Currently, this is not the case.

In my colleague's opinion, what is currently preventing Israel from setting up humanitarian corridors?

[Marty Morantz, Conservative, Charleswood—St. James—Assiniboia—Headingley, MB]

Mr. Chair, Conservatives have called for and support the idea of a safe zone in southern Gaza, humanitarian corridors to provide needed supplies of food, water and medical supplies in Gaza and of course to enable foreign nationals who are in Gaza to be safely removed and taken back home.

At the end of the day, Israel has a right to defend itself, and its mission is to eradicate Hamas. At the end of the day, that will be a good thing for not only Israelis but Palestinian citizens.

[Heather McPherson, NDP, Edmonton Strathcona, AB]

Mr. Chair, I want to send my heartfelt sympathy to my colleague. As a Jewish Canadian, I know he is experiencing such incredible heartbreak right now.

While I am not Jewish, I empathize with every Jewish Canadian and with Jewish people around the world for the horrific things that have happened in Israel over the last several days.

Because I am not Jewish, I am going to quote from somebody who is a survivor of the massacre at the Kibbutz Be'eri, who asked, “How am I supposed to wake up every morning and know that 4.5 kilometres from me, from my home in Kibbutz Be'eri, in Gaza there are people for whom this is not over? If you hear my words, look deep, deep inside and ask yourselves what your values are. I know what I want. I want a just peace.”

Do the children in Gaza not deserve the same peace that we are all hoping for, for the Israeli people?

[Marty Morantz, Conservative, Charleswood—St. James—Assiniboia—Headingley, MB]

Mr. Chair, I know the NDP likes to do it, but it is important not to conflate Hamas with the plight of the Palestinian people. With regard to the plight of the Palestinian people, all I can really say to the member is that if she truly wants peace for the Palestinian people, she will get behind international calls for the eradication of Hamas.

[Salma Zahid, Liberal, Scarborough Centre, ON]

Mr. Chair, let me begin by saying that, like all Canadians, I have watched with horror the events unfolding in Israel and Gaza. Violence and acts of terror are never the way to lasting peace and justice. Hamas is an illegal terrorist group that does not represent or advance the cause of the Palestinian or Muslim people. I condemn the intentional targeting of innocent civilians regardless of their political views or affiliations. I worry for the safety of the innocent civilians caught in the middle of this escalating conflict, especially the children.

I want to say that I will be sharing my time with the member for Outremont.

I am also concerned about the rising incidence of Islamophobia and anti-Semitism here in Canada where we live in peace with our neighbours. While we worry for our friends and loved ones overseas, we must treat each other with patience, kindness and understanding. My prayers are with all of those who are deeply worried and traumatized by the events in Israel and Palestine.

As a mother, I worry about the trauma so many children must be experiencing. I know everyone has been traumatized by the news of the attack on a Muslim family in Chicago and the death of a six-year-old boy who were targeted because they are Muslim. As a mother, I worry for the safety of my own children when they go out to eat, play basketball or go to work. We are all worried.

I came to Canada to live a peaceful life. I condemn all incidents of anti-Semitism and Islamophobia. I urge any incidents of hateful violence to be investigated by the proper authorities. There is no place for any hatred in Canada.

I have heard from many in the Scarborough community who are deeply concerned about Israel's order to one million innocent civilians to flee Gaza under an unrealistic deadline. International law is clear: Civilians must be protected and must not be targets.

It is painfully clear that a humanitarian crisis is under way in Gaza. The situation is dire. There are serious shortages of water and food. Hospitals have run out of vital supplies. Electricity is not available. Casualties are mounting by the day. The siege of Gaza must end. The innocent civilians of Gaza must not be victims of this conflict. The World Health Organization and the United Nations have urged that this order be rescinded. There needs to be a humanitarian corridor and support for these innocent civilians including food, water and electricity. The United Nations and other humanitarian agencies are ready to help and do that work. Canada must do all it can to ensure the safe and unimpeded access of relief via a humanitarian corridor. I urge Canada to be a voice for an immediate ceasefire, the end of all violence and the return of all hostages home to their families.

While our focus is on the immediate crisis and the protection of the innocent civilians of Gaza, the West Bank and Israel, we must not lose sight of the need to end the cycle of violence. The only way to do that is through dialogue. History has shown us that war and violence are never the way to peace and justice. Canada has long been a proponent for a two-state solution: A free and democratic state of Israel and a free and democratic state of Palestine, living side by side in peace. Sadly, that dream seems to slip further away every day, yet I do not know what other option for a better future there could be.

Canadian policy is also clear: Israeli settlements in the occupied territories are a violation of the fourth Geneva convention and constitute a serious obstacle to achieving a comprehensive, just and lasting peace. Again, I call for Canada to recognize the jurisdiction of the International Criminal Court. All those guilty of war crimes must face international justice.

When I speak to members of the Palestinian community, they are tired. They are in pain. They feel their future has been on hold for generations. They feel their freedom has been denied.

They just want what all of us want, what all of us take for granted: to be able to work, to walk their children to school and to be able to give the next generation a better future without security checkpoints and constant worry. They yearn for hope but so many, too many, are without hope. They cannot see a better future for their children.

Let Canada be a voice for hope.

[Garnett Genuis, Conservative, Sherwood Park—Fort Saskatchewan, AB]

Mr. Speaker, I know my hon. colleague is very sincere in her convictions on these matters.

I wanted to pick up on the issue of the importance of establishing a humanitarian corridor and safe zones for the distribution of essential humanitarian assistance. Our party supports that and has called for that.

I want to note that the last time there was conflict between Gaza and Israel, there was one instance that we heard about at the foreign affairs committee where Hamas intentionally targeted a humanitarian crossing point.

I asked Canadian officials why Hamas would intentionally target a humanitarian crossing. Canadian officials at the time said:

In terms of the reason...obviously the intention and the pressure on all parties Hamas may not have wanted alleviated instantly, to keep the pressure on and keep sending the message.

I wonder if the member would agree that as vitally important as establishing these humanitarian corridors are, one of the challenges has been, historically, that Hamas has shown capricious disregard for the lives of Palestinians and has, in fact, used their pain and the prevention of access for humanitarian aid as a tool to try to exert more pressure on the international community.

[Salma Zahid, Liberal, Scarborough Centre, ON]

Mr. Speaker, as I said in my speech, it is really important that all parties to a conflict have the responsibility to abide by international law. International law is very clear. Civilians must be protected and must not be the targets.

The situation right now is very dire. There are serious shortages of food and water. If there is no water, there is is no life in Gaza. Hospitals have run out of vital supplies, so it is very important that all efforts are made.

As the Minister of International Development has cited this morning, all of the humanitarian aid should be directed toward the civilians who do not have any food or water.

The innocent civilians of Gaza must not be the victims of this conflict.

[Ben Carr, Liberal, Winnipeg South Centre, MB]

Mr. Speaker, I want to thank my colleague for her sincerity, her conviction and her articulation of support for the pursuit of peace.

I understand the pain she is feeling and the fear she is feeling as a leader both in her religious and faith-based community and also in her responsibilities as a parliamentarian, broadly speaking. I think that all of us are feeling that way right now.

We will have differences in terms of the way in which we approach solutions to this very difficult conflict. On this side of the House, of course, there will be difficult conversations, as I imagine there will be on that side of the House.

In what ways can we, both within these walls and outside these walls, as colleagues and as parliamentary leaders, start to bring the temperature down in the country and work together, despite these differences, in order to restore a sense of security and safety for all Canadians?

[Salma Zahid, Liberal, Scarborough Centre, ON]

Mr. Speaker, I am also really concerned about what is happening domestically, these increasing incidents of Islamophobia and anti-Semitism. While we worry about our friends and loved ones overseas, I think it is really important that we must treat each other with patience, kindness and understanding. This is what Canadians are known for.

Canadians, I know, are worried. I heard it while I was in my riding last week but I think it is really important that we all come together to make sure that we fight anti-Semitism and Islamophobia right here in Canada, so that everyone feels safe.

[René Villemure, Bloc, Trois-Rivières, QC]

Mr. Speaker, I thank my colleague for her speech, which I really appreciated. I thank her for her sensitivity. I would like to ask her the following question. We have heard a lot of good intentions this evening, but beyond good intentions, what specifically can be done?

[Salma Zahid, Liberal, Scarborough Centre, ON]

Mr. Speaker, as I said in my remarks, the only way to break out of this cycle of violence is for Israelis and Palestinians to work together for just peace that recognizes the rights of Israelis and Palestinians, who only want to live in peace, freedom and security.

We have a lot of work to do to get there. I hope that Canada plays its role in making sure of its call for lasting peace in that region.

[The Speaker, Liberal, Greg Fergus]

I would like to thank the members for the way they are behaving during this debate. This is a very important debate that touches on very sensitive issues, but members are showing restraint in the debates and questions. I thank all members for their patience.

The Parliamentary Secretary to the Deputy Prime Minister and member for Outremont.

[Rachel Bendayan, Liberal, Parliamentary Secretary to the Deputy Prime Minister and Minister of Finance]

Mr. Speaker, I would like to talk about Alexandre Look, a 33-year-old from Montreal.

His mother told RDI that her son had called, over video, at about 11:15 p.m., Quebec time. He said, “Mommy, we're in the middle of a terrorist attack.” His father added, “We witnessed our son's murder.”

Young Alexandre took refuge in a shelter with about 30 other people. According to reports, survivors who were with Alexandre Look in the shelter explained that he tried to block the entrance, which had no door. That is when he was fired upon by militants. One of the survivors had this to say about Alexandre: “I swear to you, he was our shield. If he hadn't been there, we'd all be dead.” This Montrealer gave his life to save others.

Shir Georgy, 22, Ben Mizrachi, 22, Adi Vital-Kaploun, 33, and Netta Epstein, 21, were all Canadians.

These are Canadians murdered in cold blood, each with a heartbreaking, terrifying story, Canadians taken hostage, each with a heartbroken and terrified family. I spoke to a father. His voice still rings in my ear. His daughter was kidnapped and he lays awake at night wondering if she is alive or dead.

There are Canadians in Gaza, hoping to come home, hoping to find safety. There are Canadians in Israel, hoping to come home, hoping to find safety.

There are families, many families from my community in Outremont, who found themselves in Israel for the Jewish holidays. As I am sure many members of Parliament understand, who have heard from families with loved ones, I have been immersed night and day, day and night, in one thing. That is the safe return of our Canadians. I cannot describe the calls with sirens in the background, babies screaming and parents asking for help; parents asking to get on a plane.

Our utmost priority has been the safe return of all Canadians whether they are from Gaza, the West Bank or Israel, whether they are Muslim, Jewish or Coptic Christians, like those who flew home on our military plane just a few days ago.

Our government will continue to devote itself to keeping all Canadians safe. For me that means two things: bringing our people home and keeping our country free from the hateful rhetoric and violence that flourishes anywhere and everywhere whenever we pit one community against another.

I have been horrified by the explosion of hate here in Canada and around the world; in Germany there are apartment buildings where Jewish people live that were marked with a star of David, a horrific echo of Nazi persecution; in Australia, a crowd of so-called protesters shouted “Gas the Jews” over and over again, and in the United States, a Palestinian boy, a boy just six years old, was fatally stabbed 26 times.

In Montreal, less than 48 hours after the massacre in Israel, a demonstration was held to celebrate the terrorist attack by Hamas as an act of resistance. A few days ago, some young people from the Université de Montréal shared their fear with me. Some are being harassed. Some begged me to appeal to the Service de police de la Ville de Montréal on their behalf. Worried parents fear for the safety of their children. That is happening here at home, in Montreal.

The position that Canada has taken is that of all western democracies. It is the only position that could allow the rules-based order to survive. It is to defend one's territory and defend one's people against terror. Should a terrorist organization enter our country's borders and attack Canadians, would we not respond? Yes, we would.

Do Palestinians in Gaza who had nothing to do with the massacre by Hamas have the right to access food, water and fuel? I want to be crystal clear: Without a doubt, they absolutely do. Should there be a humanitarian corridor? There absolutely should. Should there be safe passage to neighbouring countries such as Egypt? Of course there should be. However, as a Canadian government, our priority is to defend Canadians, and we too were attacked.

Canadians have been taken hostage by this terrorist organization; Canadians have died at the hands of this terrorist organization. Those responsible need to be stopped, because if anyone in this House of Commons aspires to peace, hopes for a just and lasting resolution and dreams of a two-state solution and of a Palestinian state living side by side with an Israeli state, then Hamas must be destroyed.