Debates of Oct. 17th, 2023

International Trade

[Mary Ng, Liberal, Minister of Export Promotion]

Mr. Speaker, pursuant to Standing Order 32(2) and consistent with the policy on the tabling of treaties in Parliament, I have the honour to table, in both official languages, the treaty entitled “Canada-Ukraine Free Trade Agreement”, done at Ottawa on September 22, 2023.

Canada-Ukraine Free Trade Agreement Implementation Act, 2023

[Mary Ng, Liberal, Minister of Export Promotion]

moved for leave to introduce Bill C-57, An Act to implement the 2023 Free Trade Agreement between Canada and Ukraine.

(Motions deemed adopted, bill read the first time and printed)

Climate Change

[Elizabeth May, Green, Saanich—Gulf Islands, BC]

Mr. Speaker, it is an honour to rise virtually today to present a petition of deep concern to residents of Saanich—Gulf Islands. The petitioners note that the Paris Agreement, which Canada negotiated back in 2015, calls for, in its language, a “just transition” for workers in the fossil fuel sector in the transition to end the addiction to fossil fuels.

The petitioners go on to point out that the workforce of oil and gas workers is highly skilled, with many skills transferable to the renewable energy sector, and they call on the government to bring forward a plan for a just transition for fossil fuel workers. They specifically reference an existing strong piece of work, which was a task force on just transition for Canadian coal sector workers. The 10 recommendations from that extremely important piece of work are recommended to this House as the basis for work in this area.

Women's Shelters

[Karen Vecchio, Conservative, Elgin—Middlesex—London, ON]

Mr. Speaker, I am proud to present this petition.

Whereas women's shelters are sadly seeing an increase in demand, the high cost of living and the housing crisis have made it harder for women and children fleeing a violent home to find a place to live. At a time when the Liberal government is dramatically increasing spending on bureaucracy and consultants, it is cutting $145 million from women's shelters.

I am hoping the government will understand that women's shelters are in crisis right now, as we are seeing an economic crisis carry on that is causing a lot of problems for many Canadians. Hopefully the government will do something about it.

Climate Change

[Mark Gerretsen, Liberal, Kingston and the Islands, ON]

Mr. Speaker, I rise today to present a petition on behalf of Canadians who are calling the attention of the government to the most recent Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change report. It has warned repeatedly that rising temperatures over the next two decades will bring widespread devastation and extreme weather.

The petitioners are calling on the Government of Canada to move forward immediately with bold emissions caps for the oil and gas sector that are comprehensive in scope and realistic in achieving the necessary targets that Canada has set to reduce emissions by 2030.

Questions on the Order Paper

[Kevin Lamoureux, Liberal, Parliamentary Secretary to the Leader of the Government in the House of Commons]

Mr. Speaker, I would ask that all questions be allowed to stand.

[The Speaker]

Is that agreed?

[Some hon. members]

Agreed.

Opposition Motion—Fiscal Plan

[Pierre Poilievre, Conservative, Leader of the Opposition]

moved:

That, given that,

(i) after eight years of this Liberal government, this prime minister has added more to the national debt than all previous prime minister’s combined,

(ii) a half-trillion dollars of inflationary deficits has directly led to 40-year inflation highs,

(iii) prior to budget 2023, the Minister of Finance said, “What Canadians want right now is for inflation to come down and for interest rates to fall […] and that is one of our primary goals in this year’s budget: not to pour fuel on the fire of inflation," and then proceed to usher in $60 billion in new spending,

(iv) in order to combat inflation, the Bank of Canada has been forced to increase interest rates 10 times in just 19 months,

(v) interest rate increases have increased mortgage payments, and since this prime minister took office, monthly mortgage payments have increased 150% and now cost $3,500 on a typical family home,

(vi) the Liberal-NDP government must exercise fiscal discipline, end their inflation driving deficits so that interest rates can be lowered,

in order to avoid a mortgage default crisis, as warned by the International Monetary Fund, and to ensure Canadians do not lose their homes, the House call on the government to introduce a fiscal plan that includes a pathway back to balanced budgets, in order to decrease inflation and interest rates, and to introduce this in the House of Commons prior to the Bank of Canada’s next policy interest rate decision on October 25, 2023.

Mr. Speaker, I want to begin by saying that I will be sharing my time with the hon. member for Tobique—Mactaquac.

Inflation is the cost of the spending that the government said would be free. We know that the Liberal-NDP government promised a utopia and it said that it would deliver results for free. It said that the cost of this spending would never hit Canadians because the budget would balance itself. It also suggested that because interest rates were so low, the government could magically keep increasing spending faster than the cost of living and the population grew, without any consequences.

Today, after eight years of this government and this Liberal-NDP Prime Minister, it is time to pay the bills. Canadians are seeing that reality in their mortgage payments, which have more than doubled, increasing by an average of 150%.

I talked to a worker in British Columbia who is now spending $7,500 a month on mortgage payments. I repeat: $7,500 a month. He is a middle-class worker with three kids. Of that amount, $4,000 is just for interest, not even to pay down the principal. This worker's family is losing nearly $50,000 a year in interest alone on their mortgage. It is an impossible situation for the average family, but it is the reality after eight years of this Prime Minister.

Ironically, this is the same Prime Minister who promised to help the middle class and those working hard to join it. He no longer says much about the so-called middle class, does he? We never hear him talk about the middle class. It has been forgotten, because he does not want to remind anyone of the suffering his policies have caused this so-called middle class. We now have middle-class Canadians who are homeless. Yes, it is true that, unfortunately, homelessness has always existed in all countries, including Canada. However, we have not seen homelessness amongst middle-class Canadians since the Great Depression. Now, it is becoming more and more common.

Across the country, we find people like nurses and carpenters living in their cars because mortgage payments went up so much, which also pushed up the cost of rent. The Prime Minister promised to bring down the cost of housing eight years ago, but since then, the cost has doubled. Rents have doubled, mortgage payments have doubled, and the down payment required to buy a home has doubled. In fact, when I was the minister responsible for housing, it cost half of what it costs today to pay the rent, the mortgage and the down payment.

The government's decisions have consequences. The government caused the amount of money in the economy to grow by $600 billion, increasing from $1.8 trillion to $2.4 trillion. This 32% increase meant the money supply grew eight times faster than real economic growth. In other words, the money to buy stuff grew eight times faster than the stuff money buys. This is why we have inflation.

The Bank of Canada has to respond by raising interest rates, again hitting the same people who are struggling to buy food and pay their rent or mortgage.

What is the government doing? It is still forcing the Bank of Canada to keep interest rates high. According to former finance minister John Manley, the government is stepping on the inflationary gas pedal by running deficits, which is forcing the Bank of Canada to slam on the brakes by raising interest rates. One might have expected the government to try to rein in deficits and work toward balancing the budget, but it did the opposite.

Six months ago, the government said it wanted to balance the budget by 2028. When budget time came, it suddenly changed its mind and said it would never balance the budget.

Last week, the Parliamentary Budget Officer told us that the deficit is 15% higher than the government promised in its budget. Things are completely out of control, and Canadians are paying the price, not to mention the price our children will have to pay in the future.

That is why we put forward common-sense solutions, including a “dollar-for-dollar” law, which would force the government to find a dollar's worth of savings for every new dollar spent, and the elimination of wasteful spending on things like the ArriveCAN app, the Canada Infrastructure Bank and other ideas that have jacked up the cost of government.

The goal should be to balance the budget in order to bring down interest rates and tame inflation so Canadians can keep their homes and feed their families. That is common sense.

After eight years of the Prime Minister and his NDP-Liberal government, we are starting to see the hard reality that inflation is the price one pays for all of the programs the government told us were free. We will remember that the Prime Minister said he could double the debt, but not to worry, because the budget would balance itself. He said that interest rates were low, so not only were deficits permanently affordable, but also we could not afford not to spend. Here we are, with the devastating human consequences not so long after that because, as Pythagoras says, numbers rule the universe. No matter how many words are spoken, no matter how many soft lullabies are sung, the reality is that when we spend what we do not have, we drive up the cost for everyone else.

Here we are. The cost of government has driven up the cost of living. Half a trillion dollars of inflationary debt has bid up the goods we buy and the interest we pay. According to former Liberal finance minister John Manley, government spending is pressing its foot on the inflationary gas pedal, which forces the Bank of Canada to press on the brakes with higher interest rates. Now, I bump into people across Canada who are living in financial terror. A shipyard worker in Vancouver told me that his monthly mortgage payment is now $7,500. He is a shipyard worker. Of the $7,500, $4,000 is just for interest. His family is basically spending $50,000 a year on interest for their mortgage. This is after the Prime Minister, his budget documents and his bank governor told that man that rates would stay low.

One would think the government would reverse its policies, but it is doing the opposite. A year ago, it said it would balance the budget by 2028. Six months ago, it changed its mind and said it would never balance the budget. Last week, we found out from the Parliamentary Budget Officer that the deficit is 15% bigger than the government claimed only six months ago. It has totally lost control of the spending.

Our common sense plan is to cap spending and cut waste in order to balance the budget and bring down interest rates and inflation. Let us do it before the hundreds of billions of dollars of mortgages renew into these higher rates. Let us save people's homes and our future. It is common sense. My colleagues will work to bring home this common sense here in Canada. It is your home, my home, our home. Let us bring it home.

[Kevin Lamoureux, Liberal, Parliamentary Secretary to the Leader of the Government in the House of Commons]

Mr. Speaker, it is disappointing to hear the leader of the Conservative Party try to simplify it to the degree he has, saying that it is because we spend too much. Yes, we spent money to protect small businesses, the backbone of Canada's economy, during the pandemic. Yes, we spent money in order to support millions of Canadians during the pandemic.

For much of that, the Conservative Party voted in favour of our borrowing money in order to do that, but its members have easily forgotten that. Now they say it is all about the inflation. Yes, inflation is hurting, but the reality check is to take a look at the inflation rates around the world. I am wondering whether the leader of the Conservative Party could be more honest and straightforward with Canadians in regard to the reality of the situation. In comparison to other areas of the world, Canada is doing well.

[Pierre Poilievre, Conservative, Carleton, ON]

Mr. Speaker, boy does he ever need to get out of this place and talk to real people if he thinks Canada is doing well. Holy smokes. Maybe he has not been to the tent cities that have formed right across the country, which never existed eight years ago. Perfectly pristine and safe neighbourhoods are now overtaken by misery and pain from people who can no longer afford to pay their rent.

Maybe he needs to go door to door and ask people what they are paying on their monthly mortgage payments. Maybe he needs to talk to the one in five households skipping meals because they cannot afford the food. Maybe he needs to go to the bread lines that go block after block and street after street next to food banks. Those kinds of bread lines we do not see outside of either the Great Depression or the Soviet Union. If he thinks things are going well in Canada, he needs to get out and talk to the real people who are suffering from coast to coast.

[Mario Simard, Bloc, Jonquière, QC]

Mr. Speaker, if we want to eliminate waste and return to a balanced budget, would it not be common sense to cut the $83 billion that will go to the oil and gas sector between now and 2034?

If we want to help low-income earners, seniors and people struggling to put food on the table and pay their mortgages, should we not be redirecting that money to them instead of supporting the greedy oil and gas sector, which has made $200 billion in profits?

Yesterday, at the Standing Committee on Natural Resources, the Conservative Party's response was to apologize to Suncor on behalf of Canadians.

Is the leader of the opposition defending big oil or low-income earners?

[Pierre Poilievre, Conservative, Carleton, ON]

Mr. Speaker, we are defending consumers against the Bloc Québécois, which wants to radically increase taxes at the pump for ordinary Canadians.

The Liberals have a tax that applies to Quebec. They call it “regulations”. They can call it whatever they want, but it is a tax, and it increases the cost of gas by 17¢ a litre. The Bloc Québécois is against it, but only because they do not think it is high enough.

The Bloc said it wanted to radically increase taxes for Quebec consumers. That is crazy. Voting for the Bloc Québécois is costly. We Conservatives are the only party guided by the common sense of ordinary Quebeckers.

[Leah Gazan, NDP, Winnipeg Centre, MB]

Mr. Speaker, the member for Carleton has regularly made videos going after the poor and people with addictions, further dehumanizing people already left out. The member for Carleton says he stands with workers, but I have never seen him stand on the front lines on the picket line. In fact, he has voted for back-to-work legislation. At the national inquiry, he was at the cabinet table when former prime minister Harper said that we were not on his radar, so how does one like them apples?

My question is about seniors. Does the member for Carleton plan to stand with his Conservative colleague Danielle Smith and cut the CPP of seniors, sinking them further into poverty, seniors who are currently living in terror and becoming more poor? Is his common sense plan to take down people who are already down?

[Pierre Poilievre, Conservative, Carleton, ON]

Mr. Speaker, let us talk about the people living on the streets and in the tent cities. Where is it the worst? It is worst in NDP-controlled British Columbia. That is where the tent cities started, in the Downtown Eastside, where NDP policies were tried out like—

[Some hon. members]

Oh, oh!

[The Deputy Speaker, Conservative, Chris d'Entremont]

Order.

Let the hon. leader of the official opposition answer the question.

[Pierre Poilievre, Conservative, Carleton, ON]

Mr. Speaker, the experiment that the NDP tried on the people of the Downtown Eastside, to decriminalize and provide taxpayer-funded opioids, to the great profit of the pharmaceutical companies that caused the crisis in the first place, caused misery and despair, a 300% increase in drug overdose deaths.

They then took that experiment, under the NDP Prime Minister, and, yes, he is an NDP prime minister, and they spread it right across the country. We now have 30,000 people who have lost their lives. The working class has been devastated under this NDP-Liberal coalition. There is only one party that stands up for the hard-working people and their wages in a drug-free, growing economy that gives people a chance to get off the street and into homes and better lives. That is the Conservative Party.

[Richard Bragdon, Conservative, Tobique—Mactaquac, NB]

Mr. Speaker, it is an absolute honour to rise in the House today, and it is somewhat intimidating to follow the hon. member for Carleton, the leader of His Majesty's loyal opposition.

We heard a very compelling case for supporting this motion. The fact is that Canadians are hurting from coast to coast to coast. They are feeling the effects of the soaring cost of living, the ever-increasing cost at the fuel pumps, the ever-increasing heating costs and the soaring costs of having a place to live. That may be the mortgage rates, which have doubled over the last eight years, the rent doubling, seeing interest rates going up or seeing the dream of home ownership quickly falling away for so many of our young people.

It is something that all of us in this House see if we take the time to visit the communities we represent; I am sure many do. In my travels and in the conversations I have experienced recently, I have heard from Canadians back home in western New Brunswick. In recent visits, I engaged with people on the beautiful Island of Prince Edward; I heard it there as well. Throughout Atlantic Canada, Canadians are hurting. They are experiencing the pain of this ever-expansive cost of living that challenges them even when they go to get necessary supplies at the grocery store.

Perhaps some of the most heartbreaking stories I have heard have come from seniors. They have worked hard all their lives. They were counting on the pensions they have and what they paid in to be able to carry them through. However, they are honestly and sincerely worried about what they set aside and what they worked hard to save up. Will it be enough to sustain them as things continue to rise in cost?

Some seniors, especially in Atlantic Canada, have had to make tough decisions. They are facing another long winter, wondering if they have enough left over to pay their heat bill and make sure they have adequate groceries, let alone put a little fuel in their gas tanks. These challenges are very real. When we take the time to hear seniors' stories, we cannot help but be affected.

It is our job as their representatives in this House, which is the people's House, to bring those concerns here. Our job, as His Majesty's loyal opposition, is to make sure that the Liberals are held to account, that they are responsible in the legislation they bring forward and that this legislation has a positive impact on the lives of the people we all represent.

I believe that it behooves this House and that it would be the responsible thing for the government, and this entire House, to move and bring forward motions and legislation representing the concerns that we are hearing right now. The top-of-mind concern for Canadians from across this country, bar none, is the soaring cost of living and inflation. I am hearing it everywhere I go.

I believe it would be good for us to all consider what is happening right now to cause Canadians this kind of angst and concern. What is leading to the increased levels of anxiety and despair we are seeing? There are desperate situations happening not only in our inner cities but also in our rural communities. What is causing this?

After eight years, we have seen things that have led to the current circumstance we are in. There has been a multiplicity of factors. One of them that cannot be discounted is the fact that the Prime Minister has added more national debt than all other previous prime ministers combined. That is a staggering fact.

When we double the debt in under eight years, we are doing something that will have devastating consequences in the long term. I am talking not about the deficit but about the debt of this country. We have half a trillion dollars of inflationary deficits that have led directly to inflation rates that are at a 40-year high.

We saw that, prior to the budget in 2023, even our own Minister of Finance said that what Canadians want right now is for inflation to come down and interest rates to fall. That was one of the primary goals of this year's budget. It was not to pour more fuel on the fire and then proceed to usher in $60 billion in new spending. The government did not hear what was being said, or if it did, it is certainly applying the wrong fix to the problem. We cannot stop inflation and soaring interest rates by spending increasing amounts of money. That is adding fuel to the fire. As has been previously stated, the former Liberal finance minister John Manley said that we cannot keep doing that and expect to be successful.

We have seen this all throughout history, any time governments have gone down this road. In order to increase the revenues to pay for their ever-expanding debt and deficits, they inevitably increase taxes. If we ask the citizens of this country if they can afford more tax; I think the answer would be a resounding no. They have more bills than they have paycheques. When they get to the end of their paycheques and all they have is another bill waiting, then the government suggests that it is going to quadruple the carbon tax, because it will make them feel better and somehow cause the weather to change and the climate to improve.

A short time ago, when we asked the environment commissioner at the natural resources committee if there is yet in place in Canada a metric that can tell us how much the carbon tax has reduced the amount of carbon in Canada's atmosphere, he responded by saying that there is no such metric in place as of yet. The carbon tax is one of the major factors of inflation in this country. Therefore, the landmark signature piece of environmental legislation that has led to huge inflation in this country does not even have a metric by which we can tell Canadians its impact on the overall environment of Canada. That is a disgrace, and it is impossible to justify to the Canadian population. At a time of economic duress, when people are feeling the heat economically and their finances are depleting, we as a government are going to tell them yet again that we are going to keep augmenting the carbon tax. However, we really cannot tell them why, because we cannot demonstrate its effect on the environment. That is unjustifiable.

It is time for a course correction. It is time for the government to rearrange its priorities and get back to what it needs to be doing, which is to develop the incredible potential that Canada has. If we want to tackle the inflationary problem that we have in this country, let us get our economy growing and our people working. Let us get off their backs and start removing the hindrances to their prosperity and growth.

Do members know what the definition of “frustration” is? It is impeding progress, feeling that we have all this potential we cannot touch and that we can never attain what we want, because of the weight that is currently on our backs. That is why there is an increasing sense of frustration among Canadians; they are crying out for change. They want the government to get out of the way, stand by their side, say it will unleash their potential and let them do what they do best. That is to grow, develop, work, make money and, yes, make a profit so that they can better their future and the lives of their children and families.

I hope the government will do the right thing and support our motion today.

[Kevin Lamoureux, Liberal, Parliamentary Secretary to the Leader of the Government in the House of Commons]

Mr. Speaker, I want the House to focus on the word “hypocrisy” for just a moment and to think of what the member just finished saying. A major part of his speech was with respect to the price on pollution, the carbon tax, and condemning the government for it. Every one of the Conservative members across the way campaigned in favour of a price on pollution in the last election. It was in their platform. Now they are in denial and saying that their election platform meant nothing, when the reality is that every member of the caucus participated in saying to Canadians that they supported a carbon tax.

Could the member across the way explain why he supported a carbon tax, a price on pollution, in the last election?

[Richard Bragdon, Conservative, Tobique—Mactaquac, NB]

Mr. Speaker, I am glad to answer this member's question, absolutely. Personally, I never, ever supported a carbon tax.

I want the member to know something: I made those points very clear. Furthermore, I want to ask the member opposite to explain why a colleague of his, the hon. member for Avalon has come out this very week and supported our motion to axe the carbon tax. He said: “Everywhere I go people come up to me and say, ‘We’re losing faith in the Liberal Party.’”

He went on to say:

I’ve had people tell me they can’t afford to buy groceries. They can’t afford to heat their homes and that’s hard to hear from especially seniors who live alone and tell me that they go around their house in the spring and winter time with a blanket wrapped around them because they can't afford the home heating fuel and they can't afford to buy beef or chicken.

That is from the opposite side, the governing side. When will the member answer that question, and finally respond to the cries of Canadians who say, “Get off our backs and axe the carbon tax”?

[Julie Vignola, Bloc, Beauport—Limoilou, QC]

Mr. Speaker, inflation is caused by a variety of factors. Some people may include government spending in there, but the cost of housing is also part of it. According the Canada Mortgage and Housing Corporation, in Quebec alone, an estimated 1.6 million housing units will need to be built by 2030 to adequately accommodate all the people who are currently living in Quebec and those who will move there.

However, according to the most optimistic forecasts, only 500,000 housing units will be built by 2030 in Quebec, driving up rental costs by 102%. The Conservative Party of Canada supports population growth. I would like my colleague to explain how eliminating the federal deficit will solve the housing crisis and, by extension, address rising costs and inflation.

[Richard Bragdon, Conservative, Tobique—Mactaquac, NB]

Mr. Speaker, housing is absolutely a growing concern, and we are facing a housing crisis.

One of the best things we could do is what the Leader of the Opposition has been calling on the government to do, which is to get rid of some of the gatekeepers that are blocking development in and around our cities, in our urban centres. We could reward and incentivize those who do build, those who are going to make a difference, and those cities and municipalities that are going to step up to the plate and make sure that we do everything we can to provide more housing opportunities.

The other thing that is impeding housing development is the fact that the cost of everything is going up. One of the biggest factors in the cost going up of all those supplies, when everything is trucked and shipped, is the carbon tax. One of the greatest things we could do to help is eliminate the carbon tax.

[Daniel Blaikie, NDP, Elmwood—Transcona, MB]

Mr. Speaker, with all due respect to the member for Tobique—Mactaquac, his analysis of inflation is not worth the paper that his leader's office wrote on.

Not only does he not do justice to the role that corporate greed is playing in driving inflation in Canada, but he does not even mention it. It is not even part of the analysis. Oil and gas profits, between 2019 and 2022, went up by 1,000% in this country. There was no mention of the effect that that has on Canadians.

When oil and gas companies gouge the farmer who grows the food, the producer who makes the food and the trucker who ships the food, sure as shooting, Canadians are going to get gouged at the grocery store. Does the member not recognize that?

[Richard Bragdon, Conservative, Tobique—Mactaquac, NB]

Mr. Speaker, one of the biggest things that is affecting the cost of everything is the fact that the cost of doing business is going up. This is indisputable.

The wage earner cannot be lifted up, as has been famously said, by tearing down the wage payer. When they continually attack those who grow the economy and produce wealth, more wealth is not generated. It is better to go after a government that spends beyond its means and gets in the way of development. It is time we unleashed the potential that Canada has by saying, “Yes, we can do better. Yes, we can grow. We are going to stand on the side of our producers.” It is time we did that.