Debates of May 29th, 2023

Department of Finance—Main Estimates, 2023-24

[Chrystia Freeland, Liberal, University—Rosedale, ON]

Mr. Chair, sure, I absolutely recognize that very many different types of spending can be inflationary or not, depending on the overall macroenvironment in a country and in the world and depending on how that spending is structured.

[Daniel Blaikie, NDP, Elmwood—Transcona, MB]

Mr. Chair, the government has been spending over $30 billion on the TMX pipeline. It has a $15-billion growth fund. Does the minister share concern that the $30 billion being spent on a pipeline is going to bid up the cost of projects that the growth fund would invest in?

[Chrystia Freeland, Liberal, University—Rosedale, ON]

Mr. Chair, here the member for Elmwood—Transcona and I probably disagree.

I am very glad that our government made the decision to get the TMX pipeline built. I think it is very important for Canada's national sovereignty that we have a pipeline that goes to the west coast and that the U.S. is not the only destination for our natural resources.

[Daniel Blaikie, NDP, Elmwood—Transcona, MB]

Mr. Chair, is the nature of the disagreement on the fact that $30 billion on the TMX pipeline might bid up the cost of jobs for the growth fund?

[Chrystia Freeland, Liberal, University—Rosedale, ON]

Mr. Chair, I think that when it comes to the TMX pipeline, we probably have many points of disagreement, although I suspect Rachel Notley and I have fewer points of disagreement on the TMX pipeline.

[Daniel Blaikie, NDP, Elmwood—Transcona, MB]

Mr. Chair, I am concerned to know if the minister thinks that the spending on TMX may well bid up the cost of other large infrastructure projects, like those foreseen for the growth fund.

[Chrystia Freeland, Liberal, University—Rosedale, ON]

Mr. Chair, I think the important point on TMX is that the pipeline is very close to completion. We expect that it will be finished by the end of this year. This is an important contribution to Canada's economic sovereignty, and I think all members are aware of this.

[Daniel Blaikie, NDP, Elmwood—Transcona, MB]

Mr. Chair, how much does the government anticipate selling the TMX pipeline for?

[Chrystia Freeland, Liberal, University—Rosedale, ON]

Mr. Chair, our government, once the pipeline is built, does not intend to be the long-term owner of the asset, and we are going to get good value for Canadians. The other aspect that is important—

[The Chair, Conservative, Chris d'Entremont]

The hon. member.

[Daniel Blaikie, NDP, Elmwood—Transcona, MB]

Mr. Chair, does the government canvass prospective buyers?

[Chrystia Freeland, Liberal, University—Rosedale, ON]

Mr. Chair, the government is very aware of market interest in the pipeline.

[Daniel Blaikie, NDP, Elmwood—Transcona, MB]

Mr. Chair, how much does that market interest likely dictate it will get for the pipeline?

[Chrystia Freeland, Liberal, University—Rosedale, ON]

Mr. Chair, I want to point to one very important aspect, at least for me when it comes to TMX, and that is indigenous participation, which is something we are working on very energetically with indigenous groups.

[Daniel Blaikie, NDP, Elmwood—Transcona, MB]

Mr. Chair, the government is spending more than double on the TMX pipeline than it is putting into the growth fund. How much does it expect to get for the pipeline?

[Chrystia Freeland, Liberal, University—Rosedale, ON]

Mr. Chair, as I said, the government will get good value for Canadians from the pipeline. In the world, it is a very valuable, very rare asset and, as I said, contributes essentially to Canada's economic sovereignty.

[Daniel Blaikie, NDP, Elmwood—Transcona, MB]

Mr. Chair, we understand that the terms and conditions of the Stellantis deal are changing. Is that because the government did that initial deal on a handshake, or did it have a written agreement?

[Chrystia Freeland, Liberal, University—Rosedale, ON]

Mr. Chair, the initial conversations with Stellantis happened before the IRA was passed into law. I think it is very clear that the situation in the world has changed, and so naturally there—

[The Chair, Conservative, Chris d'Entremont]

The hon. member.

[Daniel Blaikie, NDP, Elmwood—Transcona, MB]

Mr. Chair, did the government have a written agreement with Stellantis before the IRA was passed into law?

[Chrystia Freeland, Liberal, University—Rosedale, ON]

Mr. Chair, obviously the federal and provincial governments had agreements with Stellantis. It is also the case that the IRA has changed the playing field for the whole world. However, the member opposite is right in that the fact that this investment predates the IRA is an important factor.

[Daniel Blaikie, NDP, Elmwood—Transcona, MB]

Mr. Chair, was the agreement with Stellantis in writing?

[Chrystia Freeland, Liberal, University—Rosedale, ON]

Mr. Chair, as I said, the member is quite right to point out, as I point out as well, that the fact that this agreement predates the IRA—

[The Chair, Conservative, Chris d'Entremont]

The hon. member for Elmwood—Transcona.

[Daniel Blaikie, NDP, Elmwood—Transcona, MB]

Mr. Chair, was the agreement in writing?