House of Commons Hansard #356 of the 44th Parliament, 1st Session. (The original version is on Parliament's site.) The word of the day was documents.

Topics

Reference to Standing Committee on Procedure and House AffairsPrivilegeOrders of the Day

10:55 a.m.

Liberal

The Speaker Liberal Greg Fergus

I thank the hon. member for Timmins—James Bay. I would like to refer him once again to the long-standing tradition of this place. Withdrawal is what was asked, and withdrawal and apology are equal. I usually only ask for an apology when the Chair feels that the member is not following through on the original request. I have asked the hon. member to withdraw. He has said that he is withdrawing—

Reference to Standing Committee on Procedure and House AffairsPrivilegeOrders of the Day

10:55 a.m.

NDP

Leah Gazan NDP Winnipeg Centre, MB

I have a point of order, Mr. Speaker.

Reference to Standing Committee on Procedure and House AffairsPrivilegeOrders of the Day

10:55 a.m.

Liberal

The Speaker Liberal Greg Fergus

I will finish this point before I recognize the hon. member for Winnipeg Centre.

I have asked the hon. member to withdraw. The withdrawal was not clear. There were some other points of order that were brought up. I have asked the hon. member to withdraw, and he has said that he is withdrawing the comment. That is where we are at.

The hon. member for Winnipeg Centre.

Reference to Standing Committee on Procedure and House AffairsPrivilegeOrders of the Day

10:55 a.m.

NDP

Leah Gazan NDP Winnipeg Centre, MB

Mr. Speaker, on a point of order, I do not think that a withdrawal with qualification is a withdrawal. In fact, the member went into another tirade of denigrating an individual, which is not a withdrawal. I would ask, through you, Mr. Speaker, for the member to withdraw his comment without qualification.

Reference to Standing Committee on Procedure and House AffairsPrivilegeOrders of the Day

10:55 a.m.

Liberal

The Speaker Liberal Greg Fergus

I thank the hon. member for Winnipeg Centre.

I will offer the hon. member for Huron—Bruce to withdraw the comment without qualification.

Reference to Standing Committee on Procedure and House AffairsPrivilegeOrders of the Day

10:55 a.m.

Conservative

Ben Lobb Conservative Huron—Bruce, ON

Mr. Speaker, if the member had been listening, in my fourth withdrawal, I withdrew those comments, so there is no point because the record will show that I made an unqualified withdrawal.

Reference to Standing Committee on Procedure and House AffairsPrivilegeOrders of the Day

10:55 a.m.

Liberal

The Speaker Liberal Greg Fergus

I thank the hon. member. The Chair has now heard an unqualified withdrawal.

Reference to Standing Committee on Procedure and House AffairsPrivilegeOrders of the Day

10:55 a.m.

NDP

Leah Gazan NDP Winnipeg Centre, MB

I have a point of order, Mr. Speaker.

Reference to Standing Committee on Procedure and House AffairsPrivilegeOrders of the Day

10:55 a.m.

An hon. member

That is a challenge to the Chair.

Reference to Standing Committee on Procedure and House AffairsPrivilegeOrders of the Day

10:55 a.m.

Liberal

The Speaker Liberal Greg Fergus

This is not a challenge to the Chair. Can we please allow the member to speak?

The hon. member for Winnipeg Centre.

Reference to Standing Committee on Procedure and House AffairsPrivilegeOrders of the Day

10:55 a.m.

NDP

Leah Gazan NDP Winnipeg Centre, MB

Mr. Speaker, the member has now accused me of not listening, and I was listening very carefully to him denigrating members of the House. Again, that is a withdrawal with a qualification.

I would like the member to just withdraw the comment without any qualification. This is another example of including a qualification, a behaviour that is totally unacceptable. Now he is saying that I am not listening, which is unacceptable. Unfortunately, I have had to listen to these Conservatives denigrate members of the House for three weeks at $15 million. I would like him to withdraw without qualification.

Reference to Standing Committee on Procedure and House AffairsPrivilegeOrders of the Day

10:55 a.m.

Liberal

The Speaker Liberal Greg Fergus

I thank the hon. member for her thoughtful comments. The Chair considers the matter withdrawn and closed.

I am going to invite the hon. member for Huron—Bruce to continue with his speech.

Reference to Standing Committee on Procedure and House AffairsPrivilegeOrders of the Day

October 22nd, 2024 / 11 a.m.

Conservative

Ben Lobb Conservative Huron—Bruce, ON

Mr. Speaker, I appreciate that.

The last point I want to make is about some of the hypocrisy we see with the Liberal government. It just goes on and on. In this House of Commons, I have listened many times to the Liberals saying we have to do something about fossil fuels, oil, gas, etc. I read an article this morning in The Globe and Mail. It was an update on the results of the Trans Mountain pipeline, which was an overspending debacle of $30 billion.

The point was, who is the king of oil in the House of Commons? It is the environment minister. Canada is now producing five million barrels a day and it is increasing every year under the Liberals. Why is that? Basically, the Liberals need the money to pay for everything else, so they are quite pleased to let the oil come out of the ground. I agree, it should come out of the ground and it should be shipped by pipeline. However, I find it ironic that the Liberals go on at length about fossil fuels, oil, etc., and the environment minister is the king of oil, for now.

The broader issue at play here is the government's integrity. The allegations of conflicts of interest within SDTC are particularly troubling because they suggest public funds may have been misused to benefit individuals with close ties to the government. This kind of behaviour undermines public trust in government institutions and erodes confidence in the government's ability to manage public resources in a fair and transparent way.

The audit found board members were voting on projects that directly benefited companies with which they had personal affiliations, which is a clear violation of conflict of interest laws. These laws are in place to ensure that public officials do not use their position for personal gain and that government decisions are made in the best interest of the public, not private individuals. When these laws are violated, it casts doubt on the integrity of the entire decision-making process. I am sure many people have heard of some of the carryings-on that went on, through the minutes of those meetings. It is pretty startling, really.

It is important to note for Canadians that this kind of self-enriching goes directly against the Governor in Council appointment process, which states that a person appointed by the government, entrusted to oversee taxpayer money, will not personally profit from their work on a committee as a Governor in Council appointee, and neither will any of their family members. However, this is exactly what happened.

In a five-year period where 405 transactions were approved by the board, the Auditor General sampled 226, only half of them, and found 186 of those 226 transactions had some sort of a conflict. It is too much. It is egregious. If the Auditor General looked at all 400 transactions, statistically, they would probably find the rest of them were conflicted as well. It is a lot of money and Canadians have a right to know. Parliamentarians have a right to make sure justice is carried out on behalf of all those hard-working people I mentioned at the beginning of my speech.

Canadians pay their taxes on each and every paycheque. They pay their CPP. They pay their OAS. They trust that the people they mark down on their ballots will do the right thing when they are in Ottawa and that these dollars will be respected. Far too many people in our country have worked so hard, paid so much in taxes and created so much economic activity only to have been disappointed time and time again over the nine years the Liberals have been in office.

To be honest, in the last few years, the NDP has been in on it, too, because it has been propping up the government. There needs to be something done. I am sure some of the members of Parliament on the other side feel the same way. Nobody comes to Ottawa to see what is happening with this scandal: people enriching themselves with millions and millions of dollars. A lot of the projects likely never went anywhere.

Then the people back in our ridings who have contracting, construction and landscaping firms, who are carpenters, electricians, plumbers and health care professionals, go to work each and every day and see this on the news. Hope and excitement in the country are not there as they used to be. People want to be hopeful, but when they see this time and time again, and the list is unbelievable now after nine and a half years, they are truly disappointed.

One director was particularly aggressive at this. Andrée-Lise Méthot was appointed in 2016 by the Prime Minister. She runs a venture capital firm called Cycle Capital. Her companies, before and during her time on the board, apparently received $250 million in grants, and $114 million went to green companies she had invested in.

I think it is safe to say, when we look at these programs, whether it is Cycle Capital or others, no company needs that much money from the federal government. Really, no company needs that much money. From a government standpoint, the dollars are there to deliver government services, not to enrich insiders who create little value.

Reference to Standing Committee on Procedure and House AffairsPrivilegeOrders of the Day

11:05 a.m.

Winnipeg North Manitoba

Liberal

Kevin Lamoureux LiberalParliamentary Secretary to the Leader of the Government in the House of Commons

Madam Speaker, yesterday, one of the members talked about past behaviour and why it was relevant. I have one report with 70 confirmations of Conservatives' abuses of power, corruption and so forth. I would be happy to name all 70 of them. However, it missed one of the most obvious ones, which was the ETS scandal of Stephen Harper. Why is that important? It is important because the parliamentary secretary to Stephen Harper was the current Conservative leader. As we fast-forward to today, foreign interference is a very serious issue and he is the only leader who refuses to get the necessary security clearance.

The Conservatives talk about hiding, but what is the leader of the Conservative Party hiding from? Is it because something in his past is going to disqualify him? Is that why he is not getting the security clearance? Canadians have a right to know exactly why.

Does the member not agree that the Conservative leader needs to come clean on foreign interference?

Reference to Standing Committee on Procedure and House AffairsPrivilegeOrders of the Day

11:05 a.m.

Conservative

Ben Lobb Conservative Huron—Bruce, ON

Madam Speaker, first of all, the Liberal government could just release all the documents and get on with it.

With regard to the Conservative leader, he has been clear that he wants the names released and we will see where it goes. He is very confident—

Reference to Standing Committee on Procedure and House AffairsPrivilegeOrders of the Day

11:05 a.m.

An hon. member

Oh, oh!

Reference to Standing Committee on Procedure and House AffairsPrivilegeOrders of the Day

11:05 a.m.

Conservative

Ben Lobb Conservative Huron—Bruce, ON

Madam Speaker, I find it interesting that when these points are made, the member for Winnipeg North always heckles. I have seen him do this for years. When a member is making a point, he will not let them make the point.

The point is, the leader of the Conservative Party has said to release the names. The Prime Minister has dangled it, so he should just release the names.

Reference to Standing Committee on Procedure and House AffairsPrivilegeOrders of the Day

11:05 a.m.

Liberal

Kevin Lamoureux Liberal Winnipeg North, MB

Madam Speaker, on a point of order, if the leader of the Conservative Party gets the clearance, he can see the names.

Reference to Standing Committee on Procedure and House AffairsPrivilegeOrders of the Day

11:05 a.m.

Liberal

The Assistant Deputy Speaker (Mrs. Alexandra Mendès) Liberal Alexandra Mendes

That is a point of clarification.

Questions and comments, the hon. member for Berthier—Maskinongé.

Reference to Standing Committee on Procedure and House AffairsPrivilegeOrders of the Day

11:10 a.m.

Bloc

Yves Perron Bloc Berthier—Maskinongé, QC

Madam Speaker, I would like people to stop saying that names have to be released. As we all know, in the context of the foreign interference commission, we were told that anyone who discloses names could face criminal charges. If the Conservative Party leader wants to know the names, he should get his security clearance.

I would like my colleague to respond to that.

Reference to Standing Committee on Procedure and House AffairsPrivilegeOrders of the Day

11:10 a.m.

Conservative

Ben Lobb Conservative Huron—Bruce, ON

Madam Speaker, I think the member is still on the agriculture committee. Regarding my private member's bill, the Bloc members voted for it at second reading, at committee and at third reading. Then it came back from the Senate amended. Can members believe the Bloc is now taking its orders from the Senate? Now it will not support Bill C-234, which deals with on-farm carbon tax on natural gas and propane. All of a sudden, the Bloc members are listening to the orders from their senators, which is puzzling.

The problem with the member's question, though, is that the Prime Minister dangled it last week. He said, “Hey, I have the list, and there are people from this party and that party on it.” He has opened Pandora's box. That is why the Conservative leader is saying, “Release it. Do the right thing.”

Reference to Standing Committee on Procedure and House AffairsPrivilegeOrders of the Day

11:10 a.m.

NDP

Charlie Angus NDP Timmins—James Bay, ON

Madam Speaker, we should always put the nation above our own partisan interests, but that is not the case with the Conservatives. They are shouting and heckling because of what they do not want on the record, and we are going to put it on the record. For every minute and hour the Conservatives obstruct the House, we will put on the record the political interference by foreign actors that allowed this—

Reference to Standing Committee on Procedure and House AffairsPrivilegeOrders of the Day

11:10 a.m.

Some hon. members

Oh, oh!

Reference to Standing Committee on Procedure and House AffairsPrivilegeOrders of the Day

11:10 a.m.

Liberal

The Assistant Deputy Speaker (Mrs. Alexandra Mendès) Liberal Alexandra Mendes

Order.

The hon. member for Kamloops—Thompson—Cariboo has a point of order.

Reference to Standing Committee on Procedure and House AffairsPrivilegeOrders of the Day

11:10 a.m.

Conservative

Frank Caputo Conservative Kamloops—Thompson—Cariboo, BC

Madam Speaker, speaking of putting something on the record, I wonder if the member will put on the record an apology for the tweet from last week. I would like unanimous—