Debates of Feb. 29th, 2024

Motion That Debate Be Not Further Adjourned

[Andréanne Larouche, Bloc, Shefford, QC]

Mr. Speaker, I would like to thank my colleague for her speech and for her nod to Quebec and its child care system. However, I would like her to return to the debate at hand. She did not answer the question asked earlier by my colleague. Only yesterday, the Liberals wanted to add hours of debate. Suddenly, today, they want closure, limiting debate.

This morning, I met with people from the Fédération des communautés francophones et acadienne du Canada. I can say that francophone women are especially worried. Yes, the bill's intention is to ensure francophone children can have access to French-language day care services. According to these women, however, that is just a veneer.

I would have liked to have the opportunity to debate a bit more with my colleague. I would have liked to have been able to confirm that the government will do what it takes to ensure children from French communities outside Quebec will have day care services in their language. I would have liked to debate with her, but closure has just been invoked.

[Jenna Sudds, Liberal, Kanata—Carleton, ON]

Mr. Speaker, I would like to thank my colleague for her question. This bill is very important for every family and every child across the country.

We are doing critical work here, and this is really important to families and children across the country.

As I mentioned earlier, this law was studied at length here at committee and also in the other place in its committees. There have been many days of debate, and frankly, we need to move forward to give certainty to parents, children and our partners that we continue to do the hard work to move this legislation forward.

I want my colleague to be assured that, with the amendments that have been put forward by the Senate, which are now incorporated into the legislation, families in official language minority communities will be able to access child care no matter where they are, in English or in French. This is a core piece of what we are doing here. It is an important point to pause on and to emphasize that we are ensuring that, no matter where one is, no matter one's economic status, we are providing early learning and child care that is accessible, inclusive, high-quality, and affordable, in French or English.

[Lori Idlout, NDP, Nunavut, NU]

Uqaqtittiji, I would like to thank the member for her important responses.

It really is quite unfortunate that the Conservatives are using tactics to avoid important debate on Bill C-35. What I very much appreciate about Bill C-35 is that it takes a rights-based approach. I wonder if the member could share with us why the Conservatives would avoid ensuring that the bill passes so that rights could be respected.

[Jenna Sudds, Liberal, Kanata—Carleton, ON]

Mr. Speaker, as we entered into agreements, and as we worked to build this nationwide system, it was incredibly important that we took a rights-based approach and that we worked alongside indigenous partners across the country, along with our provincial and territorial counterparts. I can tell members that, on the ground, it is really translating.

I had the opportunity, just last week, to be in the Northwest Territories to meet with a number of operators, parents and various groups in the territory. It was really phenomenal to see the impact, and to see culturally appropriate early learning and child care that is accessible to families, which is a reality that will be building out, of course, over the next few years across the country. I have to underscore how important and impactful that work is.

This law means that it would not just for the kids today or over the next two years, but in perpetuity. It is a critical piece of legislation that I think all of us in the House should be supportive of. Again, I have to say that it is very disheartening to hear the Conservatives refer to the situation as “chaos”, when we see it is really quite the opposite, and it is really quite impactful work.

[Jeremy Patzer, Conservative, Cypress Hills—Grasslands, SK]

Mr. Speaker, we are hearing over and over again about the issues of the cost of living and what that means for day care providers. For example, there is the cost of food, and we have heard about issues in accessing formula. We have heard about lots of supply chain issues that are still happening today.

The government can no longer blame COVID for those issues, yet we have a program here today that is putting day care operators in a spot where they are operating at a constant loss, and it is forcing people to close. They are going bankrupt because they cannot afford to buy the food, pay the wages and buy the supplies that are needed for their system. Right now, we have a bill that would do nothing to address those particular issues.

What does the government have to say about those kinds of flaws in its system? It is great to say that it only costs $10 a day, but the reality is that these places can no longer afford to stay open.

[Jenna Sudds, Liberal, Kanata—Carleton, ON]

Mr. Speaker, let us be clear. Today we are passing into legislation the early learning and child care act, and it is a framework based on the principles of high-quality, inclusive, accessible and affordable child care. My colleague is referring to the mechanics of our agreements with the provinces and territories through which funding flows. We have made a $30-billion investment with the provinces and territories to roll out this program across the country. As we make those investments, and as the provinces and territories have signed those agreements, they have done so with eyes wide open, realizing the expectations and the commitments they are making, not only to us, the federal government, but also to the families within their province or territory.

There have absolutely been challenges along the way. This is a brand new system, and we are all doing this with the best of intentions and the best of efforts. Of course, there have been some challenges, and inflation is one point, of course, to recognize. However, the provinces and territories are well aware of the expectations of the commitments and the importance of what we are doing together.

I would point to Alberta, which just most recently acknowledged the need to sit back down with operators, review their funding formula and provide cash advances to address some of the cashflow issues operators were having in that province. It is at the discretion of provinces and territories how they roll this out. The mechanics are with them, as to how they fund their operators.

I encourage ongoing dialogue, and the federal government is here to support those conversations and that work, but it is ultimately their responsibility, as they choose it to be and as they want it to be, to then move that forward with the operators in their province or territory.

[Leah Gazan, NDP, Winnipeg Centre, MB]

Mr. Speaker, we talk about how a national child care strategy benefits women. I totally agree, and I find it troubling how the Conservatives are trying to stall the legislation. However, I ask where the worker strategy is. If we want to talk about being a feminist government, we know that the majority of ECE workers are women, primarily from immigrant and other BIPOC communities, but we also know a national child care strategy will never work without a worker strategy, so I am wondering why her government continues to fail care workers, who are primarily women. We should ensure that they have livable wages, pensions and benefits so that it is financially feasible for others to want to pursue a career in early childhood education.

It is one thing to talk about being a feminist government. It is another thing to be a feminist government through supporting a workforce that is primarily being housed by women.

[Jenna Sudds, Liberal, Kanata—Carleton, ON]

Mr. Speaker, my colleague and I have had some great discussions about this bill over the last number of months. I appreciate her commitment to the workforce, and we are also very committed to the early childhood educator workforce. In saying that, we are working with the provinces and territories at our federal-provincial-territorial table to bring forward a workforce strategy to better support the ECEs. Of course, this work needs to come through the provinces. Again, we have made a $30-billion commitment, but it is on the provinces and territories to then implement this within their jurisdictions.

We are seeing some success, of course, to date. I was in Nova Scotia a few weeks ago, and we are seeing in Nova Scotia's most recent action plan, which we just finished negotiating and signing, a commitment to a wage grid increase in wages and a first-ever pension and benefits plan in that province. We are seeing other provinces do similar efforts. There is absolutely more that needs to be done.

A caveat of course is that we are roughly two years into these agreements, and it is our expectation that the provinces do the work to make sure they make the investments in the workforce so that we have these talented, caring and passionate individuals continue to do the important work of caring for our little ones.

[Chandra Arya, Liberal, Nepean, ON]

Mr. Speaker, for the last eight and a half years, we have introduced programs such as the Canada child benefit and the dental care program. We have reformed the Canada pension plan, brought in the Canada workers benefit and reduced the retirement age from 67 to 65.

I would ask the minister how this legislation joins the other things we have done in creating a very stable and healthy Canadian society and why this stable Canadian society is required so we can achieve the economic growth that is needed for our country.

[Jenna Sudds, Liberal, Kanata—Carleton, ON]

Mr. Speaker, undoubtedly, this government has done more for families and women than any other government in history, and I am incredibly proud to be part of that government and that work. This legislation, Bill C-35, is, rightly put, just one piece of the hard work we have done to support women and families.

I look to the Canada child benefit, a program that families can rely on each and every month, like clockwork, to support them and deposit funds into their bank accounts for whatever their families may need that month, whether it be additional shoes for Johnny, extracurricular activities or saving for their post-secondary education. We have been there for families and have demonstrated that, not only with legislation but also with others, such as the Canada child benefit, which was pointed out, and many other programs. I would point to the most recent Canada dental benefit and pharmacare, which was just recently announced.

We continue to do the hard work to introduce incredible social policy that is also really smart economic policy, enabling parents to get into the workforce by supporting them in their day-to-day challenges because we all know that raising kids is not easy work.

[Michelle Ferreri, Conservative, Peterborough—Kawartha, ON]

Mr. Speaker, we have heard a lot today from the minister, and it is unfortunate that, after our pointing out the hardships and chaos that has ensued, she wants to just look at the toxic positivity or gaslight the operators and families that are truly suffering.

People are benefiting from this program, but there are more people not benefiting. It is interesting that the minister says Rome was not built in a day, but the reality is based on the sustainability of the $10-a-day child care that has been set up by the Liberals. This will be destroyed within five years because the sustainability is not in place. Infant care programs are shutting down, and centres are robbing Peter to pay Paul because they cannot afford it. Their fees have been capped for people at home. Any business owner knows this. Their fees have been capped, and now they cannot increase their fees, but the costs have gone up.

When is the funding coming to fund this? Every province and territory says they need more money. Where are they going to get that money from?

[Jenna Sudds, Liberal, Kanata—Carleton, ON]

Mr. Speaker, I am really glad to sit on this side of the House, where we invest in families and continue to do the hard work. We recognize that, from day one, it is not going to be perfect and not everyone is going to access it, but that does not mean we would abandon it. It does not mean we would stop. It means we would work harder. This is important work. With rose-coloured glasses, I hope the member can see the light in the work that is happening here.

Undoubtedly, creating a national child care system is about families. It is about investing in our children. She speaks of the funding formulas. I have shared that this is a $30-billion investment on our part. The funding formulas are the responsibility of the provinces and territories. We can see where there are challenges, as we most recently saw in Alberta. It sat down with operators, figured it out and made advances in recognizing their cash flow issues. It is renegotiating its funding formula. This is the work of the provinces. We are there to support them and help fund them with $30 billion, but ultimately, they need to do that work.

It is so incredibly unbelievable to me that there are folks in the House, like those on the Conservative benches, who continue to throw shade and discourage those doing the hard work, such as the operators and the families dropping their children off day in and day out, when we need to focus on getting the work done together.

[Michelle Ferreri, Conservative, Peterborough—Kawartha, ON]

Mr. Speaker, I rise on a point of order. I ask, in response to the minister, for unanimous consent to table the documents to show that there are not more women entering the workforce—

[Some hon. members]

No.

[The Deputy Speaker, Conservative, Chris d'Entremont]

It is my duty to interrupt the proceedings and put forthwith the question necessary to dispose of the motion now before the House.

The question is on the motion.

If a member participating in person wishes that the motion be carried or carried on division, or if a member of a recognized party participating in person wishes to request a recorded division, I would invite them to rise and indicate it to the Chair.

[Marilyn Gladu, Conservative, Sarnia—Lambton, ON]

Mr. Speaker, I would request a recorded division.

[The Deputy Speaker, Conservative, Chris d'Entremont]

Call in the members.

(The House divided on the motion, which was agreed to on the following division:)

Vote #656

Canada Early Learning and Child Care Act

[The Deputy Speaker, Conservative, Chris d'Entremont]

I declare the motion carried.

The House resumed from February 16 consideration of the motion for second reading of, and concurrence in, amendments made by the Senate to Bill C-35, An Act respecting early learning and child care in Canada.

Second reading and concurrence in Senate amendments

[Philip Lawrence, Conservative, Northumberland—Peterborough South, ON]

Mr. Speaker, today, I am continuing my speech on child care, and in the earlier part of it, I went through some of the challenges with the child care system and outlined them.

I would like to go through some proof points, which are actual emails I received from constituents. I will try to read these as clearly and as unredacted as possible, but obviously, for personal reasons, for names and other things, I will skip over those parts.

The first one says, “Good evening. I'm hoping you can assist us with daycare funding. My daughter is a mother of 3 year old twins. She has...children in [a day care provider right now] and was told [that] funding would be available by October. [However] She has had no further information and unfortunately the employees are unaware of when the funding [will] be available. As you can imagine having children in daycare is costly. My daughter pays $100.00 a day. Is there someone...I can reach out to for answers?”

They tried very hard, working through the government, to get this $10-a-day day care spot, but to no avail, still, to this day.

The next letter reads, “I'm writing to you [today] as a concerned mother of an 8 month old baby. I have been a [RN]...for [over] 10 years. The state of availability of licensed day care spaces in Ontario is appalling.”

I will read this unredacted, good and bad. She wrote, “It is fantastic...the government is working towards $10...daycare to improve [the] financial accessibility for all. However, the planning behind this rollout has been abysmal. Did the government not consider the immense increase in demand that could not be met with the already lacking spaces in the licensed childcare industry prior to [the] rollout?! The wait lists were already lengthy. We added our child to multiple wait lists at 20 weeks pregnant, being told [that]...we might...already [be] too late to secure a spot for him at one year for me to return to work”.

Just to clarify, she put herself on the list at 20 weeks pregnant so that she could have a spot when the child, who was not born yet, was a year old, and she was told that she was too late.

She went on to write, “I am now less than four months away from my return to work and have no idea when I can return to work due to the lack of day care spaces for my child. As a registered nurse, I am eager to return to work to support [people in my important work], but may be delayed due to being unable to access appropriate...child care for my infant. The plan for $10..daycare requires significant infrastructure...for years prior to being able to achieve it.” I paraphrased a little because I did not want to give away the specifics.

That is an insightful comment. In order to achieve something, one has to plan. My father used to tell me all the time, when I was a youngster, that if one fails to plan, one plans to fails. I think that this is borne out here.

The email continues to read, “New centres must be built. RECE's must be trained. Supplies must be purchased.” I will paraphrase here, because I do not want to give away the specific area. She wrote that her community is growing quickly, so that need is even more acute. She goes on to write, “Both of these issues combined are compounding the problem and creating disaster[s] for families who are planning...for their children so they can return to work. I can only imagine how...other health care workers or first responders are in the same situation. This is only compounding our health care and first responder shortages. [I'm asking] you to please advocate for the development of infrastructure to support this rollout. Also, consider creating area based...lists, rather than...[individual]”.

These are all relatively recent emails that were just quickly pulled up by my staff.

One person writes, “I am pleased to see the media is finally reporting on the disastrous roll out of the Canada Early Learning and Child Care Act. I am so tired of listening to [the Prime Minister] bragging about saving Canadian[s]...thousand[s] of dollars in child care expenses when I know [this to be] a fallacy.... This became an issue [and a] concern for me in 2022 with the birth of my third grandchild in St John's [Newfoundland]. This was about the same time as [Newfoundland] signed on...the federal program; $10...day care sounded so promising. Little did my daughter know how difficult it was going [to be] to find day care at any cost. At that...time my older daughter in Ontario was looking for day care for her 3 year old. She become [number] 90 on the wait[ing] list...at the local school's publicly funded [centre]”. She wrote that she would like to thank the member from Peterborough for advocating so strenuously on their behalf.

She went on to write, “I am a firm believer in the value of accessible day care for all Canadians but I also believe [that] parents should have the option of...private care for their children. I realize a number of Canadians do not support tax funded day care. Many of these are people who do not value women's work and don't connect the dots when their hip surgery is cancelled because there['s] no ER nurse available. My [Newfoundland] daughter became very active [in an organization]”, which I will not reveal, “[where she works for and advocates for child care].... There are so many Liberal missteps for the Conservatives to address but I think it is time to address child care. As well as an issue for young families it is [an issue for ] grandparents [as well]. It [is] also a federal issue as...provinces and territories are raising concerns.”

This person's daughter said, “I really wish [the member for Carleton] would come out on...attack [on] child care.” The email reads, “I can't agree more. I believe it is time for Conservatives to [take an even stronger stance, holding the Liberals to account].”

Those are just a couple of emails I received, and I could read many more emails on the state of child care. Like everything with the Liberal government, it is great with photo ops but poor on delivery.

I also had a meeting in the last constituency week with the Otonabee-South Monaghan Food Cupboard in Keene. The context is of course parents and grandparents being unable to find child care, but in some ways the crisis is even more serious for many Canadians as they are facing insecurity as never seen before. Numbers have already increased significantly year over year, but in just the last four months, the number of children now being fed by the Otonabee-South Monaghan Food Cupboard has gone from 19 to 30 to 31 and then to 37. That is in an extremely small catchment area. The number of children going to a food bank at the Otonabee-South Monaghan Food Cupboard has doubled, and this is the kind of story we are hearing across the country.

The Liberal government promised a strong and prosperous economy, and it has failed. It promised $10 day care, and it has failed. It is time for a common-sense Conservative government.

[Kevin Lamoureux, Liberal, Parliamentary Secretary to the Leader of the Government in the House of Commons]

Mr. Speaker, this is one issue on which we cannot trust the Conservative Party. This is a good example of a hidden agenda. All one needs to do is to look at the last federal election. The leader said that they were going to tear up the whole child care plan the Liberals brought forward. Then they say some nice things post-election about it, and I think they might have even voted once in favour of the legislation.

Canadians have a right to know exactly what the Conservative Party's position is, at least today, on child care. Do they support the federal program, or do they not?

[Philip Lawrence, Conservative, Northumberland—Peterborough South, ON]

Mr. Speaker, I would put that question directly back to them. Do they support child care? Clearly, they do not, actually. I already have the answer.

Did they not just hear the litany of emails I just read? Canadians are not only unable to afford child care, but also unable to access child care. There are many dads and moms in my riding who want to return to work but cannot because they cannot find accessible child care. In this economy, it is particularly difficult because it means their families may not have the opportunity to eat at the end of the month.

[Lori Idlout, NDP, Nunavut, NU]

Uqaqtittiji, I would like to start by saying that prioritizing is not eliminating.

The member mentioned a constituent email he received where they said that they were concerned about private care not being available. Can the member please point to where in the bill it specifically prohibits private care?

[Philip Lawrence, Conservative, Northumberland—Peterborough South, ON]

Mr. Speaker, the Senate has openly said that it does not want private child care.

We need to value all forms of child care, whether it is a wonderful, licensed facility, of which there are a ton in Northumberland—Peterborough South that try to do there best but do not have enough spots or whether it is a grandma in the neighbourhood who takes care of not only her grandchildren but also a couple of other children and provides incredible child care. We need to thank all child care providers, as they are doing an amazing job raising the next generation of Canadians.