Lorne Nystrom

[Agriculture, March 14th, 2001]

Mr. Speaker, at noon today I was among many people at the farm demonstration in Ottawa. There were also thousands of farmers demonstrating in Regina, Saskatoon, Winnipeg, Swift Current, the Toronto area and right across the country.

They are doing so because farmers are in the biggest crisis they have seen since the 1930s and many are going bankrupt and being forced to leave the land. In the prairies alone, between the fall of 1999 and the fall of 2000, 22,500 farmers left the land. It is hard to believe that so many have left the land. The reason is that our federal government has not been supporting our farmers like governments have in other parts of the world.

In Europe grain farmers get about 56 cents on the dollar from the European Community. In the United States they get about 38 cents on the dollar. In this country it is only 11 cents on the dollar.

We need more money from the federal government. Five hundred million dollars is not enough. It has to be doubled to around $1 billion in the short term, and in the long term we need a long term farm program based on the costs of production.

[Sales Tax And Excise Tax Amendments Act, 2001, March 2nd, 2001]

Madam Speaker, I wish to respond to the hon. member from the time warp who was talking about the CCF. That was about 40 years ago. However, I realize he is a bit behind the times.

It is the policy of the Alliance Party to have a flat tax, a single tax rate. The former Reform Party and now the Alliance Party both have this idea of a flat tax. Even the great socialist in the United States, George W. Bush, has rejected that as being unfair and unjust and yet the Alliance Party is advocating a single tax rate so that a wealthy person making $300,000, $400,000 or $500,000 a year or a millionaire making over $1 million a year would pay the same tax rate as a high school teacher making $40,000 or $50,000 a year. That is not fair and it is not just. It is not equality of condition.

I am glad that party is saying that because I now know where that party stands. It is a party of the past. It is a throwback to the forties and fifties when the rich would get richer and the poor would get poorer and be grateful for it. That is the Alliance philosophy. Thank God about 90% of Canadians reject that philosophy and that attitude.

I am sure that the more Canadians hear about it, the smaller and smaller the Alliance Party will get because it represents a very small point of view. Even the leader of the Alliance Party has put that member so far back on the backbenches that he is always hiding behind the curtain because of his points of view.

I am glad this issue has been raised today. I am glad the people are now seeing where the Alliance Party stands. It stands for wealthy people. It stands against public institutions such as the wheat board. It stands against a one tier health care system. It wants two tier health. It wants private clinics. It wants whatever is good for capital and whatever is good for the wealthy people. It does not want pensions for senior citizens. It wants to get rid of the Canada pension plan. It wants big RRSPs, which will help the wealthy, and to hell with the poor, the ordinary citizen of Canada. That is exactly where it stands. Before long, it will become an historic artifact in the history of Canadian parliamentary annals, just like the Social Credit Party so many years ago. Its hero was Bill Vander Zalm in British Columbia. We can see what has happened to Mr. Vander Zalm and the Social Credit Party.

Now the member from Vernon is getting up on his feet. He was a member of the Social Credit Party. He is a worshipper of Bill Vander Zalm. That is the kind of politics that was rejected by the people of B.C., and it will be rejected by the people of Canada.

[Sales Tax And Excise Tax Amendments Act, 2001, March 2nd, 2001]

Madam Speaker, the member over there is the author of the hidden agenda.

During the election campaign, do members not remember when he made the great statement about privatizing old age security and the Canada pension plan? He said that if the Alliance Party was elected it would privatize those things, that people would have monster RRSPs. He said that would be the panacea to get the government off the backs of Canadians, that everyone would be in the private sector investing in the stock market. Do members remember that in the campaign?

I remember picking up the Globe and Mail and reading a big headline about privatizing pensions and getting rid of old age security and the CPP. The member for Elk Island was the author of that hidden agenda. He even took his own leader by surprise.

That is the kind of member we are dealing with here. When he talks about these kinds of issues he fails once again to mention the tax policy of the Alliance Party. It is a flat tax policy. It wants a single tax rate. With a single tax rate, someone who is making $300,000 or $400,000 a year will get a bigger break then the ordinary citizen who is making $30,000 or $40,000 a year teaching at an elementary school in Churchill, Manitoba. Those are the facts.

That is exactly where that party stands. It wants a big break for the wealthy. It believes that the free market will look after the poor. It believes in what is called the trickle down theory of economics, that if we feed enough oats to the horse, eventually enough will trickle through the horse to feed the sparrows. That is exactly the philosophy of the Alliance Party of Canada.

[Sales Tax And Excise Tax Amendments Act, 2001, March 2nd, 2001]

As my friend from Winnipeg said, squandering money on the poor. That is the position of the Alliance Party. My goodness, the Liberal Party is not too far behind in its shift to the right.

We need a tax system that is fair and just. We need a tax system that raises enough money to support public institutions and the infrastructure of the country. Infrastructure has been cut back over the last number of years, particularly in the 1995 budget, and it is time to reinvest in ordinary people. That is what the debate is all about.

[Sales Tax And Excise Tax Amendments Act, 2001, March 2nd, 2001]

Madam Speaker, you are absolutely accurate. The rules of the House say we should not do that. I just wanted to point out the truth to the Canadian people. I am sorry that is a violation of the House rules.

I can say that the only member in the House is hanging his head in shame because the promise on the GST was broken by his party. I remember that so well. There is a second Liberal over there and she is hanging her head in shame as well over the broken promise on the GST.

That is a promise they made. It was a solemn commitment to the Canadian people. I remember the leader of the opposition at the time, who is now the Prime Minister, getting up in the House and talking about getting rid of the GST.

He would say that it was is time to get rid of the GST, that it was not a fair tax at all and that if Canadians elected the Liberal Party the GST would disappear”. The GST is still here for Canadians.

The GST is still here. It is a very unfair tax. It is a tax that is really like a flat tax. No matter what one's wealth is one has to pay the same 7%. When we buy some hardware goods, or a car, or get a haircut or buy a new tie, there is a 7% tax that everybody pays. Even a really wealthy member like the member across the way from near Toronto has to pay 7%, the same as some poor guy in Kamsack, Saskatchewan. It is a very unfair and unjust tax.

Our party has said that we should start reducing the GST, starting with 1%, and take it off books and necessities. Eventually we should eliminate the GST because it is a very unfair tax. That used to be the position of the Liberal Party before it was influenced and terrified by the Alliance and the Reform, so it moved to the political right. That is the first point.

The second point I want to mention deals with the comments made by the finance critic from the Canadian Alliance. He stated that taxes are horrible, that taxation is an awesome power in the hands of parliament, said that taxes are much too high and that taxes should be reduced.

In some cases taxes are too high, and the GST is a good example of that, but instead of talking about a general across the board tax cut, we should be talking about a progressive tax system that is based on the ability to pay. It use to be that way but it was changed a number of years ago by the Mulroney government and continued on by the Liberal Party across the way.

A recent CBC poll released a few days ago asked Canadians what they felt was the most important issue in the country. Over 40% of them said that investment in social programs, in particular, health care, was the most important issue, whereas only 7% said lowering taxes was the most important issue.

Members of the Canadian Alliance have said time and time again that there should be a radical reduction in taxes across the board. Canadians do not want that.

The Alliance Party is really an anti-government party. It does not believe in government nor in public institutions. It wants to privatize almost everything. It probably even wants to privatize the post office and go to pony express or whatever. It does not believe in the Canadian Wheat Board, the CBC or a public one tier health system that is supported by the tax system of all Canadians. That is where the Canadian Alliance stands but it is not where the Canadian people stand.

It is important to point out in the debate today that we need a taxation system that is progressive and based on the ability to pay. We need a taxation system where wealthy people pay more taxes and ordinary people pay less taxes and get a decent tax break. The position of the New Democratic Party and an overwhelming majority of Canadians is that we should have a taxation system where the wealthy and the large corporations pay their fair share.

The Canadian Alliance stands up for the very wealthy and the large corporations. It is getting more and more of its money from those large corporations. It is no longer grassroots party of ordinary Canadians. People should realize that as we talk about this issue today.

The last point I want to make is in regard to household debt. Household debt is at an all time high. When big tax cuts are made they mainly go to the wealthy people not to the ordinary people who have huge household debts. The Vanier Institute recently stated that during the decade of the 1990s, the wealthiest 20% of Canadians saw their incomes go up by about 6.6% and the poorest 20% of Canadians saw their incomes shrink by some 5.2%.

For a number of years, throughout the fifties, sixties and into the seventies, there was a gradual reduction in the gap between the rich and the poor. In the 1990s, at the end of the Mulroney years and into the years of this government, the gap between the rich and poor has widened once again. The rich are getting richer and the poor are getting poorer. The Canadian Alliance wants to spread it even wider by having a flat tax where everybody would pay the same rate. This would mean that the rich would get richer and the poor would get poorer. That is exactly the way the Alliance Party wants to go.

We need a progressive tax system with five or six different tax brackets based on the ability to pay. We have to eliminate flat taxes like the GST. We have to phase them out because it discriminates against the poor. That is exactly what Canadians want.

Canadians want a progressive tax system based on the ability to pay. They also want to make sure that there are enough taxes in the country in order to invest in infrastructure, social programs and into the institutions that are important to them. They want enough money raised through taxes to make sure that we have not just $500 million for farmers but a couple of billion dollars to help farmers. That is what taxes are all about.

However, we get the Alliance Party saying that there is spending madness going on by the Government of Canada. What is that? Is it too much money for the old age pensioners, the poor, the farmers, the fishermen and the health care system?

[Sales Tax And Excise Tax Amendments Act, 2001, March 2nd, 2001]

Madam Speaker, I want to say a few words on Bill C-13 which is before the House today. It deals with a whole number of taxation issues. I only want to make about three different points to facilitate this bill going before the committee.

First, the tax bill deals with the GST. It is rather ironic that between 1990 and 1992 the party across the way, and I remember it so well, promised to get rid of the GST. I remember the Minister of Canadian Heritage even resigned her seat to go back and get a mandate from the people in Hamilton East because of the promise to scrap the GST, the goods and services tax. Now we have a government that is bringing in amendments to the GST and a taxation regime that includes the GST. No wonder people are cynical of this institution.

If elected, the Liberal Party promised to get rid of the GST. I notice almost every Liberal has left the Chamber in shame. There is only one Liberal left in the House and he is hanging his head because of the embarrassment.

[Agriculture, March 2nd, 2001]

Mr. Speaker, Saskatchewan grain and oilseed farmers have seen a drop in their income by $500 million over the last five year average. Yet under this new program they only get $100 million from the federal government, $2.38 an acre.

Why does the minister not face the reality and inject more money into the western economy for the farmers of this country? Saskatchewan has 60% of the arable acres and a small tax base. Why is there not more federal money, which is where the money should be coming from?

[Agriculture, March 2nd, 2001]

Mr. Speaker, my question is for the Minister of Agriculture and Agri-Food.

As the minister knows, the farmers are furious and very disappointed with the announcement made yesterday on the farm aid program. He also knows the government has a budgetary surplus. It is a matter now of priorities for the government.

Can he explain to us why the federal government is ignoring the biggest farm crisis in the history of Canada, at least since the 1930s? The government has the money. Why is there not more money for farmers when they are going bankrupt and being forced to leave the land?

[Sales Tax And Excise Tax Amendments Act, 2001, March 2nd, 2001]

Windows 98.

[Points Of Order, March 1st, 2001]

Mr. Speaker, I also want to associate our party with the remarks of the right hon. gentleman from Calgary Centre. As a westerner I see how important it is that we have the absolute equality of the two languages in the House.

I remember the great debate over the Official Languages Act in 1969 when I was a member of parliament, and I remember the commitment made by all three parties in the House at that time that the two languages would be absolutely equal here in the House of Commons. I think that is a fundamental principle and it is a principle we must continue. What happened the other day in the House of Commons runs the risk of deviating from that principle. I hope that the minister will come back and amend what he said in the House a short time ago.

It is extremely important that we have the absolute equality of the two languages in the institution of parliament, indeed in all other institutions in the country. We have the Official Languages Act and the principles of that act are extremely important. People tend to forget the long battle toward achieving that act in 1969.

There was a time not long before that when there was no instantaneous translation, for example, in the Cabinet of Canada. It was not long before that when there was no translation in the House of Commons. That was quite the achievement by the parliament of the day.

Later on we had the patriation of the constitution, once again enshrining the equality of the two languages in the constitution of the country.

It is very important that we make sure to continue those principles in the House in every way possible. I support the point of order raised by my friend of the Conservative Party from the province of Quebec.