Crucial Fact

  • His favourite word was provinces.

Last in Parliament May 2004, as Liberal MP for Vaudreuil—Soulanges (Québec)

Lost his last election, in 2004, with 39% of the vote.

Statements in the House

Viclas June 5th, 1998

Mr. Speaker, I am glad that the hon. member realizes and has admitted that ViCLAS is an instrumental tool in helping to solve crime.

As a matter of fact the real problem with ViCLAS is not the system itself but that the data which have to be entered is the responsibility of individual provinces.

To that end the solicitor general is reviewing, especially with the province of British Columbia, ways that we can co-operate with the various provinces. That is where the bottleneck seems to be.

I am led to believe also that the province of British Columbia has already hired four extra data entry clerks to catch up with the volume.

Supply May 26th, 1998

Mr. Speaker, this is a good question. Our government is concerned by this issue. We have been consulting the various stakeholders for two years now.

I can assure the House and the hon. member that, by this fall, the solicitor general will introduce a bill providing for various controls over money laundering, as well as other appropriate measures.

Colleagues in other departments—and I am referring to the likes of the Minister of Citizenship and Immigration—will try to review the legislation to stop or prevent organized crime from committing crimes in our country.

It should also be pointed out that Canada and the United States share the longest undefended border in the world, which makes it easy to enter our country. We are nonetheless addressing the issue, and I can assure the hon. member that the minister does understand the issue and will soon be introducing legislation.

Supply May 26th, 1998

Mr. Speaker, I have been here for five years. I guess it is inherent in our democratic system or a tradition for the opposition to criticize the government and for the government to try to advance legislation and ideas. It would be refreshing from time to time to hear concrete ideas from all opposition members.

Far too often we hear criticism, criticism, criticism and never any concrete suggestions whatsoever to improve the system. We are constantly striving to improve the system. I recall several attempts by the government to improve the system. We are always confronted by Reform Party members in particular who vote against us. They have had a fixation on trying to solve a particular problem. They always invoke the memory of the Bernardos or Olsons of the world when we try to enact legislation. Section 745 legislation was a clear example of that.

Had we had the co-operation of the parties—and I know the Reform Party agreed but the Bloc reneged on its commitment—Clifford Olson would never have been able to have a section 745 hearing. The member knows full well that the amendments and changes we have put in place will prevent serial killers such as Clifford Olson from even applying under section 745.

There are other initiatives like DNA, for example. I wish we could evolve to a point where opposition and government members would work more closely together but I do not think that will happen. It is the duty of opposition to criticize and I guess it is our duty as government members to advance and to take the criticism.

In direct answer to the member's question, just because the administration of justice is the responsibility of the provinces does not mean that legislation is bad. The member has identified a problem in the area of funding. I reassure him that the Minister of Justice and our government are currently negotiating with not just the two provinces mentioned but with my home province of Quebec to make sure the provinces have the right tools to ensure the administration of the YOA act and other acts is adequate. I believe also, though, that the provinces have a very important role in this regard. It is not just the federal government.

Supply May 26th, 1998

Mr. Speaker, I would first like to read the motion that we are debating today. It states “That this House condemn the government for the deplorable state of Canada's criminal justice system, and the government's lack of concern for public safety” and it cites three examples essentially in the areas of the Young Offenders Act, sentencing, and victims of crime.

In reading that motion I ask myself and more particularly I ask the opposition if it is arguing that everything in the justice system is in such a deplorable state as the motion says. Should everything this government has done in the criminal justice system be condemned? Is the opposition also condemning certain aspects or particular aspects of the correctional system? Is it condemning the system of policing, all our judges and the entire Criminal Code?

I believe the federal government is doing much more than the Reform Party gives it credit for and I would like to give some concrete examples. Rather than generalities and the sweeping denunciations by the Reform Party, let us give some facts and figures. Let us look at what is actually going on in criminal justice reform.

Let us start with the first fact that Canada along with the provinces spends in excess of $10 billion a year in the criminal justice system, not as the member who just spoke said, in the criminal justice industry, if I heard him correctly. It shows the difference between the opposition members and this government. As I said, it includes federal and provincial expenditures and it covers policing, prisons, penitentiaries and the courts.

The governments in Canada are not exactly starving the justice system. As an example, the federal government itself spends approximately $1 billion a year to support the efforts of the Royal Canadian Mounted Police and it spends a similar amount on penitentiaries.

Perhaps the opposition is saying that the federal government is not spending this money strategically, that is, not targeting the big challenges to public safety. Let us take spending on penitentiaries as just one example because I know the official opposition is concerned about the state of our prisons.

Several weeks ago the solicitor general and the commissioner of the Correctional Service of Canada announced that 1,000 new correctional officers will be hired in order to strengthen the safety and security of our penitentiary system. Does the opposition disagree with the hiring of 1,000 new staff to make our correctional system better? It is not cheap but it is one example of setting priorities and then funding them.

The motion by the opposition seems to imply that the government is ignoring the allegedly deplorable state of the justice system. In this regard I believe it would be worthwhile to examine the criminal justice agenda of the government both now and in the recent past.

In the previous session of parliament the government introduced over a dozen major bills amending the Criminal Code and related statutes. For example the agenda encompassed new measures targeting high risk offenders, bills dealing with prostitution and child sex tourism, safeguards to protect the privacy of complainants and witnesses in sexual offence proceedings, and anti-gang legislation. There were reforms to the Young Offenders Act and more changes to that act are going to be launched very shortly by the Minister of Justice. In total over 250 changes were made to the Criminal Code in just the last session.

I would like to address the main proposals in the strategy for renewing the justice system for minors in order to address juvenile delinquency.

First of all, replacing the Young Offenders Act by the Youth Criminal Justice Act, which gives priority to the protection of society, fosters such values as the sense of responsibility, and calls for heavy sanctions for wrongful acts.

Second, the aim of the initiative is to expand the category of offences for which a young offender may be brought before a regular court, which will include, in addition to murder, attempted murder, manslaughter and violent sexual assault, the reiteration of the facts of the crime and will lower from 16 to 14 the age at which young offenders may be transferred to an ordinary court.

Furthermore, the legislation authorizes the publication of the names of all minors found guilty in regular court and eventually the publication of the names of minors between the ages of 14 and 17 found guilty by a juvenile court of murder, attempted murder, manslaughter, violent sexual assault and other stated crimes.

One of the proposals is for the potential establishment of criminal sanctions for the most dangerous and violent young offenders and the application of intensive resocialization and treatment programs and of a longer testing period.

Finally, we want to encourage the establishment of a broad range of sanctions and effective control mechanisms, other than legal ones, for small time delinquents, which encourage respect, promote responsibility toward victims and the community, help minors measure the consequences of their action and enable them to grasp the cause and effect relationship between their crime and its consequences.

As the government, we are aware that prevention is society's best protection against juvenile delinquents. This is why our strategy promotes prevention by linking reform of juvenile justice to other government initiatives involving childhood and adolescence.

I would like to give you a few examples. In the 1998 budget, the government allocated $32 million annually to fight delinquency. A new initiative to this end will soon be implemented. It is aimed at developing short term solutions and concerns mainly minors.

We are developing, in partnership with the provinces and territories, a national action plan for children to address a fair number of the underlying causes of delinquency, namely child poverty, childhood development problems, lack of structure provided by parents, unemployment and scarce family resources.

In 1997 we spent $850 million to create a more generous child tax benefit that will have a direct impact on the health and well-being of children. The 1998 budget provided for this benefit to be increased by another $850 million by the year 2000.

In 1997 we increased funding for the community action program for children. This program supports the implementation of hundreds of local projects promoting the development of children at risk.

The 1997 budget increased funding for the Canada prenatal nutrition program designed to help pregnant women in precarious situations, such as teens and women who abuse alcohol or other substances, so that they can give birth to healthy babies.

In 1994 the government launched a strategy against family violence, which provided for major changes to the criminal justice system in order to prevent family violence and for an extensive long term effort to co-ordinate policies and programs at all levels of government.

Also, the government announced its Youth Employment Strategy, endowed with $2 billion, offering school to work transition services and programs for young Canadians.

In the 1998 budget the government more than doubled its assistance to help young people at risk make the transition from school to work and this money will be used to fund company training, career counselling, coaching and literacy programs.

In response to the report of the Royal Commission on Aboriginal Peoples, the government is also developing initiatives that will strengthen the government strategy of promoting native justice with respect to minors, in close co-operation with native peoples.

In 1995 the Liberal government introduced the head start program. This is an early intervention program designed to provide a good start in life for aboriginal, Metis and Inuit children living in cities and major centres in the North by providing social assistance to their families and involving parents in initiatives to promote culture, health, education and nutrition. The budget also set aside additional funds to expand this programme to include children living on reserves.

I mention these facts and these examples, in essence this track record, not to encourage our government to rest on its laurels but rather to show that the government began with a major criminal law improvement agenda and it accomplished very much of it step by step.

This administration has not abandoned its criminal justice agenda. On the contrary, it has continued a sensible, well targeted agenda of selective law reform and program development.

I have already alluded to the major reform process of the Young Offenders Act. The Minister of Justice has also stated her commitment to the interests of victims of crime and has made announcements in this area. She has also indicated that crime prevention is a priority and over the past few years the National Crime Prevention Council laid the groundwork for a broad based crime prevention strategy and the government has indicated that it will spend $160 million over the next five years on crime prevention initiatives. Moreover, this crime prevention strategy will give priority to the needs of children and youth and they will be community targeted programs.

We all know the early years of a child's life hold the key to forming attitudes and to producing law-abiding citizens. Crime prevention strategies as promised by the government will link up to youth justice reform and will draw individual communities into the process of making our neighbourhoods much safer.

I said there were two reasons for referring to the legislative and program reforms from the last session. The second point is that the changes made to the Criminal Code over the last four years are starting to pay off. I use an example that I think shows the criminal justice system is not failing or falling, as the Reform Party would lead us to believe, into a deplorable state, but rather much improving.

I refer to Bill C-55, the high risk offender bill that came into force on August 1, 1997 as chapter 17 of the Statutes of Canada, 1997. The bill targeted three areas. It built on the success of the dangerous offender provisions in the Criminal Code, it created a new sentencing category for sex offenders called long term offender, and it created a new form of restraining order or peace bond designed as a means of deterring certain individuals from committing violent personal injury offences.

The dangerous offender law was changed to make an indeterminate sentence of detention mandatory in every case in which a dangerous offender finding was made. The initial parole review of dangerous offenders was also changed so that the review would occur four years later than previously in the law.

Than life sentences for murder and certain other offences, the dangerous offender measure is the only sentencing provision in the code that calls for indeterminate incarceration. Bill C-55 made this mandatory. It was already evident that the dangerous offender procedure worked. A study at the time indicated not only that prosecutors were using it to go after violent sex offenders but that use of the procedure overall was on the increase. Since Bill C-55 there has been an even greater increase in the use of dangerous offender applications.

Moreover, the early identification of potential dangerous offenders has been made easier by the creation of a national flagging system and by complementary efforts on the part of the provinces.

The flagging system which was launched two years ago involved a special Royal Canadian Mounted Police database that allows police and prosecutors to put a special flag on the file of a convicted offender so that any prosecutor in Canada can check the RCMP CPIC database to identify the most serious cases.

Some provinces, notably British Columbia and Ontario, have their own mechanisms in place to identify and investigate violent offenders with a view to a possible dangerous offender application. There is evidence that Bill C-55 and the national flagging system have made this task easier and, more important, a lot more effective.

Bill C-55 also created a new long term offender category. It resembles a dangerous offender category procedure in its operation but targets a slightly less serious category of sex offender. In fact, if the dangerous offender criteria are not met it is quite possible that he will be covered by the long term offender category in which case, having been declared a long term offender, he is still subject to up to 10 years of intensive supervision being added to his initial sentence.

There have only been two long term offender designations so far but the tool remains available to prosecutors and the courts and we can expect to see more of these designations as more experience is gained with the new procedure.

The other main component of Bill C-55 was a new peace bond as section 810.2 of the Criminal Code. Essentially it allows someone to seek a restraining order where there is evidence that an individual poses a significant risk of committing a serious personal injury offence. The court can impose a restraining order for up to 12 months with conditions attached to it such as a requirement that the individual report any change of address to the police or correctional authorities.

Canadian police forces were already reporting success with a similar peace bond in the Criminal Code which targets potential pedophiles. Section 810.2 is not only an additional crime prevention tool but is now being used extensively across the country, particularly in Ontario. Parliament has given police, prosecutors and the courts one more useful tool to prevent crime.

I think the section 810.2 peace bond is worth mentioning because provinces are starting to use these restraining orders in conjunction with community notification orders. There is a growing trend in Canadian provinces to identify offenders who after released from prison still constitute a potential risk to the community but who can also be controlled by appropriate notice to the community and supportive programs for the ex-offender. We are finding that provinces are using section 810.2 orders as a complementary measure to ensure that ex-offenders stay on the straight and narrow.

I raise Bill C-55 as only one example of a measure that is having impact and responds to the trends in the administration of justice in the provinces and the public concerns regarding crime. It is a measure that demonstrates this government's concern for public safety.

I will list many of our initiatives to show that the Reform motion is totally out of bounds when it states our system is in a deplorable state.

The government has introduced legislation recently for the creation of a DNA databank which will certainly go a long way toward helping the police in their efforts to solve crime. We have introduced $32 million a year in funding for community crime prevention programs. Over 5 years that amounts to $160 million. We have also, through the solicitor general's office, undertaken nationwide consultations on the Corrections and Conditional Release Act in order to improve the overall effectiveness of Canada's correction system.

The government has introduced legislation for a comprehensive new extradition act in order to fight international crime more effectively. Let us not forget the strengthened gun control legislation we introduced as well as the amendments to the Criminal Code to prevent use of the drunkenness defence for general intent crimes of violence, including sexual assault.

We also introduced measures to deal more effectively with high risk offenders through Bill C-55. We passed legislation to improve public safety through changes in the parole and corrections system, including measures for easier detention of sex offenders in penitentiaries until the end of their sentences and measures to strengthen rehabilitation and treatment programs for sex offenders.

We amended the Criminal Code and the Young Offenders Act to make it easier for peace officers to obtain DNA samples from suspects. We passed equally tough anti-gang measures, including the creation of the new criminal offence of participation in a criminal organization. These tougher sentencing provisions and additional police powers to seize the proceeds of crime and organized crime and to conduct surveillance of gangs have been used very frequently lately, especially in my home province.

We amended the Criminal Code to toughen the laws on child prostitution and child sex tourisms. We amended the Criminal Code to tighten the faint hope clause, making it more difficult for offenders to obtain the right to apply for early parole and to prohibit persons who commit multiple murders from using section 745. We amended the Criminal Code to ensure that those who commit crimes of hate receive harsher sentences. I could go on and on with the list but I know time is running out.

I want to reassure Canadians that this government will certainly not sit on its laurels. We have a very heavy agenda for the next session of parliament and we will continue to ensure that the priority we have set, not only in our ministry of the solicitor general but also the ministry of justice, the safety of Canadians, is met with concrete action.

Royal Canadian Mounted Police May 25th, 1998

Mr. Speaker, 125 years ago this month the House of Commons adopted a law that created the North-West Mounted Police, the forerunner to the Royal Canadian Mounted Police.

Originally the RCMP was established as a frontier police force which went west to prepare the way for a peaceful development of the prairies. As the country grew in population and its communities became more established, the RCMP adapted and expanded its jurisdiction.

Today the Mounties and their proud record of service are recognized throughout the world.

I would like to take this opportunity to pay tribute to all those men and women who have dedicated their whole life with honour and pride to the protection of their fellow Canadians.

I am sure all members in the House will join me in congratulating the RCMP for having reached this turning point in the history of this country and in wishing its members all the best in keeping their commitment to the security of all Canadians.

Congratulations to all members of the RCMP.

Millennium Scholarships May 14th, 1998

Mr. Speaker, quite frankly, we are disappointed with the Quebec government's decision to end discussions on the millennium scholarships between its representatives and those of the federal government, discussions that had been initiated in a climate of cooperation.

The Quebec government should be proud to participate in a wonderful initiative that will mark Canada's entry into the new millennium.

The Canadian government's objective remains the same. For a period of 10 years, the Canadian Millennium Scholarship Foundation will give exceptional support to the provinces so that all young Canadians can have better access to teaching and training institutions throughout the country.

The Quebec government should rethink its strategy in the interest of all young Quebeckers who want to pursue their education. After all, it is their future that is at stake.

Poverty May 13th, 1998

Mr. Speaker, to be sure, the content of the report on poverty released yesterday by the National Council on Welfare is cause for concern.

As a government and a political party, we are firmly committed to fight the threat of poverty. Indeed, during our most recent convention, the Quebec wing of the Liberal Party of Canada passed a resolution urging the Canadian government to make every effort to eliminate poverty as quickly as possible.

But let us not forget that this is a collective responsibility. All levels of government are directly involved in the process to improve Canadians' quality of life.

We, as a government and political party and as citizens, must support any measure aimed at eliminating poverty in Canada.

Dna Identification Act May 11th, 1998

Mr. Speaker, the government does not support this motion. We find it problematic because of the charter perspective. It calls for placing in the convicted offenders index the DNA profile of persons charged with an indictable offence who have provided DNA samples voluntarily. A person so charged is entitled to the presumption of innocence and may ultimately be acquitted. Therefore an innocent person's profile should not be part of the convicted offenders index.

There is another problem in that this motion has no provision for obtaining a person's informed consent to place the samples provided voluntarily in the convicted offenders index.

This motion applies to any indictable offence regardless of whether it is a designated offence and is therefore likely to provide DNA evidence that would be of assistance in a criminal investigation.

In light of these serious difficulties I urge hon. members to reject this motion.

Dna Identification Act May 11th, 1998

Mr. Speaker, I begin by thanking the member for Scarborough—Rouge River and the member for Scarborough East who have worked with me over the past several months to try, after I believe three attempts, to come up with a modification to the amendment ourselves but were unable to do so.

Motions Nos. 10 and 11 are essentially the crux of the legislation and the most contentious. Motions Nos. 10 and 11 would do two things. First, they would allow a police officer to take DNA samples for the DNA databank from a person charged with a designated offence who has a previous conviction for a designated offence. Second, they would expand the retroactive scheme of the bill to capture offenders serving a penitentiary sentence for one of those offences previously designated offence convictions. Both proposals, in my opinion and in the government's opinion, pose a very serious charter risk as has been debated in the House.

With regard to the timing of taking samples, I would also like to point out to hon. members that the Criminal Code already has a provision which allows police to take samples at any time from a person they suspect of having committed a serious offence, with one proviso, as long as they first obtain a warrant. That provision is in there.

The Standing Committee on Justice and Human Rights considered many of the proposals and amendments that are being debated today. To allow the police to take samples of the DNA at time of charge was rejected at that committee. Another recommendation was to expand the retroactive scheme. To that end some changes were implemented by the committee.

We have heard from expert witnesses. The members for Crowfoot and Pictou—Antigonish—Guysborough referred to various opinions. I point out for the benefit of the House, as committee members will remember, that officials from the Department of Justice gave us opinions on the charter challenge possibilities. We also heard officials from the ministries of justice and the attorney general of Ontario and the solicitor general of Ontario as well as officials from New Brunswick.

Members have claimed that they did not have ample time to question these officials. On the contrary, all these people testified before the committee on justice. Members had plenty of time to ask all their questions. They may not always have liked the answers or the opinions but they did have time to consult them. It was only after the justice committee presented its report to the Minister of Justice and the Solicitor General of Canada that the opinions of three highly respected judges were sought.

At that time the Reform Party and the chiefs of police decided they would exploit this stance on the part of the government and do everything in their power to make sure the government listened. For the second time in my political career I will be subjected to another billboard campaign. Again, for the second time in my career, I will explain to the citizens of my constituency who I am confident will understand that the federal government has acted with a very balanced approach.

I will respond to the member for Crowfoot because he quoted extensively from the comments of Mr. Newark who suggested that we had asked the wrong question of the three former justices. In actual fact the three former justices were asked to provide an appreciation of the risk of a successful charter challenge pertaining to the taking of DNA samples at the time of charge without prior judicial authorization. They were asked whether the legislation would likely be found to offend one or other charter provisions. They were also asked if it could be saved under section 1 of the charter. It seems to me those questions were very clear.

The Canadian Police Association is now advocating the creation of a new police power to take bodily samples from an accused person who has previously been convicted of a designated offence simply on the basis of a police officer's belief that the person has committed another designated offence, without first going before a judge to seek the authority to do so.

The claim that the judiciary of Canada impinges on the powers of parliament is not justified in fact or in law. The courts perform their constitutional responsibility in reviewing the legislation to ensure the constitutional requirements are respected and to supervise the actions of the police in the enforcement of the criminal law and in the collection of evidence.

Bill C-3 reflects clear statements from our highest court that the invasive nature of bodily searches which are an interference with bodily integrity and undermine human dignity demands high standards of justification. Taking a sample on the off chance that a sample might link a suspect to another offence and the mere speculation that the accused may abscond do not meet these standards.

The notion of recidivism must be respected especially with retroactive sampling. The notion of recidivism can be used for the purpose of justifying to some extent the retroactive scheme. However, where used, the taking of samples for crimes committed before the coming into force of the bill is always on the basis of prior judicial authorization. Possible recidivism is not a justification for excluding judicial supervision prior to the taking of the sample. On the basis of the authorities it is of fundamental importance that the seizure of bodily substances be judicially approved before it takes place.

Where there is an elevated risk of recidivism such as with dangerous offenders, repeat sex offenders and serial killers, the need for special measures to protect the public is justified. To go further and take DNA samples from individuals who pose a low risk of recidivism or may not even be suspected of having committed another offence would place the constitutionality of the scheme in serious jeopardy.

I would also like to state that in Motion No. 10 there seemed to be very little justification for taking the sample at the time of the charge because according to the motion it would only be analysed once the conviction were to take place. The rationale for taking the sample would seem to be one for mere administrative convenience as opposed to what some members have been speaking on, to solve outstanding crimes. It is my understanding that the sample would be taken and only when the person is convicted would it be analysed. Therefore I do not see how outstanding crimes would be solved unless the person was convicted. It is likely that a rationale of administrative convenience would not meet the court test of the highest standards of justification.

Let us look at the consequences if this motion were adopted. Let us say we did support the motion. It is virtually guaranteed that notwithstanding the opinions we have had here, if we did approve the motion the challenge to the constitutionality of this provision would ultimately be heard by the Supreme Court of Canada. Most members have spoken to that end. The difference between our approach and their approach is they are willing to let it go to the supreme court. Such a final hearing on the contrary would take several years. During that time the police would take samples and subsequently have them analysed and if consequential amendments were made would have the results placed in the convicted offenders index.

If the supreme court were ultimately to determine that the provision was contrary to the charter and could not be saved under section 1, it would logically follow that all samples taken pursuant to the provisions would be found to be illegal seizures. The major consequence of such a finding would be that the evidence resulting from such seizures would be found inadmissible in court also. This would mean that many individuals would have been wrongfully convicted. As well numerous prosecutions would have to be halted.

In addition the profiles in the convicted offenders index of the people whose samples were taken pursuant to this provision would have to be removed from the data bank.

Finally if the government were to adopt this motion notwithstanding that it has received overwhelming advice from the Department of Justice and eminent private sector counsel that it would be found to be contrary to the charter, such a fact could make the provision even less defensible in the eyes of the Supreme Court of Canada.

In conclusion I have given various reasons why we cannot support the motion. Members have mentioned that we should try to take into account the examples of Bernardo and Clifford Olson. I believe that laws should be made for the benefit of all Canadians and not to circumvent or to try to trap one particular individual. We had that experience in the section 745 hearings when the Bloc Quebecois members voted against that provision and allowed Clifford Olson to have a hearing.

If we try to enact all legislation in that respect we will never get anywhere. I believe that the government has come up with a very balanced approach which I ask all hon. members to approve.

Dna Identification Act May 11th, 1998

Mr. Speaker, Motion Nos. 9 and 14 are essentially very technical amendments of minor nature.

Motion No. 9 will correct the French version description of our offences in the secondary designated offence list to ensure consistency with the French criminal code references for the same offences.

Motion No. 14 will amend the incorrect French translation for permanently removed in section 47.09, subsection (3), so that it reads:

“rendus inaccessibles une fois pour toutes”.

Therefore both motions will correct oversights in the French wording to ensure consistency in terminology throughout the bill with the Criminal Code.