Philip Mayfield

[Petitions, June 9th, 1999]

Mr. Speaker, pursuant to Standing Order 36, I am honoured to present petitions from the citizens of Cariboo—Chilcotin, primarily from the city of Williams Lake.

The first petition expresses concerns about effects of the drug RU-486 on unborn babies and the danger to mothers. It calls upon parliament to act to prevent the introduction of the drug RU-486 in Canada.

[Cariboo—Chilcotin, June 7th, 1999]

Mr. Speaker, this summer I invite all Canadians to come and meet the friendly people of beautiful Cariboo—Chilcotin in central British Columbia.

Why not follow the Cariboo gold rush train up the Fraser Canyon and then head west through the Chilcotin for the ferry ride past dolphins and whales to Vancouver Island? While driving through this spectacular part of Canada, you will be looking for something to do. Drop in and see the good people of Lillooet. Then check out the Bo Beep Ladies Golf Tournament as well as the Only in Lillooet Days, the Begbie Revue and the Lillooet Gold Trail Triathlon. Then mosey into Ashcroft for the Ashcroft Hog Run or the 12th Annual B.C. Old Time Drags and Rod Run.

Stop by 100 Mile House and check out the Bridge Lake Cattle Drive and Rodeo and the Square Dance Jamboree or take part in the Magoo Memorial Funball Tournament.

While in Quesnel take in the B.C. Old Time Fiddling Contest, the Quesnel Club Horseshow and the Bill Barker Days Festival and then go into the historic Barkerville gold rush town site.

On the way to Bella Coola for the ferry, make sure to squeeze in the Williams Lake and Anahim Lake rodeos.

Once you have tasted Cariboo hospitality I promise you will be back for more. See you in the Cariboo.

[Endangered Species, June 4th, 1999]

Mr. Speaker, we hear the government is drafting new endangered species legislation. Let us hope it gets it right this time. Rural Canadians are insisting that the bill include three fundamental principles: First, there must be equity. All Canadians must bear an equal cost of protection, not just rural Canadians.

Second, it must be incentive based. Landowners should be compensated not punished for compliance.

Third, there must be consultation. Rural Canadians must have a say in how the legislation impacts on their lives.

Will the environment minister and the Government of Canada commit today to these principles, yes or no?

[Ontario Election, June 4th, 1999]

Mr. Speaker, common sense prevails. Last night Mike Harris and his team held their heads high and claimed the first back-to-back Conservative majority in Ontario in 30 years.

What makes this victory all the sweeter is knowing that the federal health minister declared all-out war against Mike Harris and proved to be as influential in provincial politics as he is at the cabinet table. Unfortunately for Dalton McGuinty, his greatest handicap was neither himself nor his platform, but the high tax, soft on crime, unethical spending and health care gutting policies of the federal Liberals.

Not only were the hapless Liberals soundly rejected, but more importantly from a B.C. perspective, the socialist, protectionist NDP was relegated to non-party status. History does repeat itself. Its meagre nine seats is a carbon copy of its 1993 federal failure.

The people of Ontario have spoken. They want lower taxes, safer streets and a sound commitment to education and health care spending. They want Mike Harris.

[Pensions, April 29th, 1999]

Mr. Speaker, the government has some gall in saying its $30 billion C-78 pension raid is in the best interest of Canadians. Its idea of protecting the taxpayer is to spend the money now and have future generations pick up the tab.

If we spend the entire $30 billion pension surplus today, who will cover any shortfall in the future? How can we deny that taxpayers will be paying the price for government mistakes again, again and again?

[Public Sector Pension Investment Board, April 22nd, 1999]

Mr. Speaker, I am pleased to rise this morning to take part in this initial debate on Bill C-78, an act to establish the public sector pension investment board, to amend the Public Service Superannuation Act, the Canadian Forces Superannuation Act, the Royal Canadian Mounted Police Superannuation Act, the Defence Services Pension Continuation Act, the Royal Canadian Mounted Police Pension Continuation Act, the Members of Parliament Retiring Allowances Act and the Canada Post Corporation Act, and to make a consequential amendment to another act.

I listened to the minister's comments with some interest. In his concluding remarks he mentioned that he felt this legislation was fair. I suspect it would be most fair for the government in its administration of the affairs of Canada, and perhaps least fair for the Canadian taxpayers. On that basis I would like to focus the majority of my time today speaking to several of the technical aspects of the bill before us. I am sure that a number of my Reform colleagues later today will focus on other specific aspects of the legislation.

The purpose of this bill is to establish an independent public sector pension investment board with a mandate to invest employee and employer pension contributions that were made under the public service, the Canadian forces and the Royal Canadian Mounted Police pension plans.

This bill, if passed, will become effective on April 1, 2000. It would also allow the Canada Post Corporation to establish an independent pension plan by October of next year.

This bill would amend these present plans so that the employee contribution rate under each is set independently from those under the Canada pension plan. It would de-link the CPP from these plans, as it was originally linked when the CPP was established. Employee rates under each plan would be frozen until the year 2003, but would rise from 10% to 40% of the cost of the plans in the year 2000.

While the government would pay 60% of the cost, it would also claim all of the surpluses. While the government would be responsible for all actuarial deficits, and we can expect that there will be actuarial deficits in the years ahead, the main benefit to the government would be the ability to claim the present $30 billion surplus. I will talk about that a bit later.

The three existing pension advisory committees would be changed so that employees would have some say in the design, administration and funding of the plans, and there would be employee representatives on these committees. I try to give credit where credit is due, but unfortunately this bill does not go far enough. In the balance of priorities it falls short. Employee representation is a far cry from the employees administering the funds, and that is not what we are calling for. Would the advice they offer be accepted or rejected? What influence would they really have? Is this mere window dressing?

Other proposed changes include improvements to life insurance components of the public service plan and the extension of survivor benefits. This is again on the plus side. This includes the extension of benefits to same sex partners, but it does so without any reference to gender. The convoluted wording and the ambiguity in the bill in this respect is unacceptable. When reading this section of the bill we do not really know what the government means at all with respect to who is entitled to benefits.

The cost of extending survivor benefits is not large, but rather small, amounting to a quarter of one per cent or approximately $5 million a year. However, as I am sure members are aware, these changes have been anticipated for some time now and like many of my colleagues I have received correspondence on this issue from concerned pensioners who are worried about the proposed changes. There has also been a significant amount of press coverage on this issue. I am sure that as we debate this issue over the next few weeks we will hear even more from people who are concerned about the proposed changes in Bill C-78. I invite Canadians to continue to raise their concerns with their members of parliament and with the government itself.

For those who are unaware of why this is such a volatile issue, I can sum it up in one word, “surplus”. There is a $30 billion surplus on which the government is itching to get its hands.

I recently read Paul Polango's book, The Last Guardians: The Crisis of the RCMP and Canada . He makes an interesting point. In the funding he shows that in the years 1996-97 the budgeted costs for the RCMP were $1,925,700,000. The receipts, though, which do not go to the RCMP but into general revenues, come to almost three-quarters of a billion dollars. Therefore, instead of $1.9 billion it comes out to $1.2 billion as the net cost of the RCMP to the government. This is not really reflected in the costs of the RCMP because revenue to the RCMP is not balanced off against its account but goes into general revenues.

In a sense that is what is happening here too. It is estimated that the surplus for this pension plan hovers at about $30 billion. With the way in which this pension is structured the money is more like a paper IOU rather than ready cash, but it still accounts for approximately one-fifth of the government's massive $6 billion debt.

Over the past decade the government has already raided approximately $10 billion of the surplus and used that money to help to reduce some of the huge deficit racked up during the high spending eighties and nineties while still allowing for the wasteful spending of taxpayer money on programs such as the great Canadian flag giveaway.

Like they are doing with the massive employment insurance surplus that has built up in recent years, government members are saying this money is theirs and they have a legitimate claim to take from this fund whenever they need a little extra cash because they would be responsible for shortcomings in the future. They fail to take into account, however, the burden the taxpayers have carried in helping the government overcome the difficulties it had resulting from its shortsighted and cynical attempts to decide for Canadians what is best for them.

Organized labour representatives, on the other hand, state that this is their money as their members have contributed to the plan in the past and will need the funds in the future. The money should be theirs, they say. They are calling what the Liberal government is doing legalized robbery. Some have even taken legal action or have threatened to take legal action to stop the government from taking these surplus funds. At this time I note that the existing legislation Bill C-78 would amend does not address who has any right to any surplus.

The unions are also upset that the government is not only raiding the surplus but is at the same time raising premiums. Under the bill the employee contribution would rise to 40% of the total contributions to the pension fund. The unions are supportive of their members paying their fair share of pension contributions. These changes will bring it more in line with other pension plans. They are in agreement that with more benefits the rise in their members' share of the contribution is acceptable. However, with the government's decision to take the surplus in the pension fund, the unions feel that the government has crossed the line of what is acceptable.

It is the position of the official opposition that these surpluses belong to neither the government nor outright to the unions. It is the taxpayers who are the forgotten partner in this debate. It is the taxes they have paid over the years that give the government the money it has to satisfy its 70% obligation to these pension contributions. Taxpayers have also over the past few years helped pay down the federal deficit and now the debt, with the enormous taxes the government has forced upon them. In the past taxpayers have covered $13 billion shortfalls in the pension plans and are on the hook for any future shortfalls.

The government is wrong to raid this money from the pensioners who have contributed to this fund over the years, as have Canadian taxpayers contributed to this fund. We believe that the fair and smart thing to do with the pension surplus is to leave it inside the pension plans, not only to guarantee the solvency of the plans for the members but to cushion taxpayers from any potential shortfalls in the future.

Although the current surplus is quite substantial, there still exists a strong possibility that it will be eroded so far that the pension fund will go into a deficit position. It has happened before and it will very likely happen again given the volatility of the global economic environment.

The bill would establish the public sector pension investment board, a 12 member board situated in the national capital region. It would be mandated to manage the funds in the best interest of the recipients, ensuring a maximum rate of return on the money that would be transferred to the fund, as stated in the bill, from the Canadian Forces Superannuation Act, the Public Service Superannuation Act and the Royal Canadian Mounted Police Superannuation Act. That varies from the current way plans are managed. They are currently in long term government bonds, which in reality provide very little return.

The board would manage or supervise the management of the business and affairs of the funds administrators including an annual written statement of investment policies, standards and procedures for each fund they manage; monitor the officers of the board to ensure that they meet these standards; prepare both quarterly and annual financial statements for each fund they manage; set up conflict management procedures; establish a code of conduct for officers and employees of the board; and have someone monitor both the application of this code and any conflict of interest procedures. These are all described in considerable detail in the bill.

Members of the board and the officers who are delegated by the board would have the obligation to act honestly and in good faith with a view for the best interest of the funds and to act with care and diligence. They are to bring with them any outside related knowledge, skill or education that they have and employ that in the best interest of the board in the application of their duties. The directors and officers are to abide by all the bylaws and guidelines that have been established by the board.

If a director, agent, officer, employee or auditor of the board or subsidiary makes a false statement or gives deceptive information, he or she would be guilty of an offence and could be liable on summary conviction for a jail term of less than a year and/or a fine of $100,000.

Bylaws may be made by the board if they are consistent with the act in assisting or guiding the conduct and management of the board's business and affairs. They can deal with the board's administration, management or control of their property holdings; the calling of meetings; the functions or duties of directors, employees or officers; and the establishment of committees.

Bylaws will be in effect when passed unless otherwise stated and are to be given to the respective ministers and will then be forwarded to parliament.

The act also sets up the power to delegate certain powers or duties of the board of directors. However, there are specific limits as to what cannot be amended such as the adoption, amendment or repeal of bylaws; the establishment of investment policies and standards; any vacancy; the remuneration of board members; or the approval of any financial statements of the board.

The nominating committee would be established by the President of the Treasury Board after consulting with the Minister of National Defence and the Solicitor General of Canada. It would be chaired by an independent chairperson who has not or is not entitled to pensions from either the Canadian Forces Superannuation Act, the Royal Canadian Mounted Police Superannuation Act or the Public Service Superannuation Act.

Other members of the nominating committee are to be chosen as representatives from the public service, the Canadian forces or the RCMP. Nominating committee members could be reappointed after their five year term expires and removed at any time by the minister who appointed them. Nominating committee members would have a variety of influences which would aid in the guidance of their decision including the disqualifying factors they should look for in directors.

The act also sets out a formula for the selection of directors who would be appointed by governor in council on the recommendation of the minister from a short list submitted by the nominating committee. Directors would hold their office for a renewable term of three years and could be removed by an order in council. There would be staggered terms of office so that no more than one-third of the board's term would expire in the same year.

The act also sets out the guidelines for the resignation, vacancy and remuneration of board members, as well as the structure for the appointment, duties and removal of the chairperson who is to be chosen by the responsible minister.

The act is very specific in stating who cannot be considered as board members, listing several instances in which individuals are considered disqualified persons. They include individuals who are under 18 years of age, those found to be of unsound mind by the court, an agent or employee of the government, an MP, senator or provincial politician, an individual who may receive or has received pension benefits that are covered by this act or from the consolidated revenue fund, an employee or agent of a foreign country, or a non-resident of Canada.

As we have seen so many times since the government began its mandate, the opportunity exists with this legislation for the government to use the board as a patronage reward for those who have supported the party in one way or another.

The government insists that the board is to be independent and at arm's length from the government. However, like we have seen time and again with the government, it does not always honour its word in this respect. I am hoping that I am being a bit cynical. However the Liberal past practice in this regard has been most disappointing. The high degree of cabinet and ministerial discretion this act allows makes it hard for me to believe that they will not take advantage of this as another patronage opportunity.

The fiscal year of this board would be the same date as that for the government. Bill C-78 would establish the procedures and parameters for the financial books and systems of the board. They are to have quarterly and annual financial statements that are to be approved by the board. There is also to be an auditor chosen annually by the board of directors to audit the financial statements of the board in accordance with acceptable accounting procedures. One wonders what the definition for acceptable accountable procedures would be considering the debate now going on between the government and the Auditor General of Canada.

The auditor of the funds could be removed at any time by the board. The bylaws are to be made public and are available at the board office. The auditor has access to any documents from current or former board directors, officers, employees or the like in the preparation of the audit.

The ease with which the board could change or dismiss auditors is a concern for me. I am concerned that the board holds the power to change auditors at its whim, which may not be in the best interest of pensioners. The manner in which it can appoint and change auditors also does little to ease my concerns about the accountability both to parliament and to the pensioners to whom the board should be ultimately responsible.

The quarterly financial statements are to go to the responsible minister, as well as to the minister of defence and the solicitor general, within 45 days of the end of that quarter. Annual reports are also to go to these ministers within 90 days after the end of that fiscal year and are to be tabled in parliament no later than 15 days thereafter.

This annual report is to include the financial statements, the auditors reports as well as the objectives of the board for the past year and for the foreseeable future. A summary of its policies, standards and procedures; its code of conduct for officers and employees; and the report of any special audit is also to be included in the annual report.

Other than the annual report there is little reporting to parliament. I have some difficulties with this especially considering the high degree of power the minister and the cabinet have with relation to the establishment and the operation of the board.

The board in effect is entrusted with the pension funds of some 300,000 retirees and 345,000 members of the federal public service. I would have liked to have seen more accountability to parliamentarians in the bill so that we could ensure the best interest of pensioners affected are indeed being looked after. With the government priority to raid surplus funds, what is the government's priority for its retirees? As I mentioned throughout my speech today I have serious concerns about the overall lack of accountability to the pensioners covered by the legislation.

Another area I would like to briefly highlight today and will elaborate on during later stages of the debate is the exemption of the legislation from the information sought through the Access to Information Act. Why is the government so afraid of public scrutiny? What is being hidden?

What is intended to be kept from public scrutiny? This secrecy is very disturbing. This does not ensure us that the board members are totally accountable. By not having access to this very important tool, the Access to Information Act, this legislation is not as transparent as it must be. I believe the government should seriously reconsider this omission and make the Access to Information Act available through this legislation.

Also in this bill, the minister may appoint an auditor to do a special audit on the board or subsidiary, or may also cause a special examination to be carried out to ensure that it has met the requirements of the act. This special examination must be carried out at least every six years, and before this takes place, the minister must consult with the minister of defence and the solicitor general. The cabinet may also make a variety of regulations respecting the application of the board and subsidiaries.

The Reform Party of Canada is opposing the bill. I would like to outline five significant reasons, among many, why I will be opposing the bill. I will summarize them.

First, the bill allows the government to raid the fund's surpluses beginning with the existing $30 billion surplus. This raid reminds me of the infamous national energy program where the federal government helped itself to an excess of $60 billion of petroleum revenues that belonged to the affected provinces, primarily the province of Alberta. Bill C-78 gives the federal government authority to claim pension money for its general revenues and, in effect, another surtax on public service employees and Canadian taxpayers who are contributing to these pension funds.

Second, the bill would give the government authority to provide new same sex benefits without debating family and same sex relationships that would be affected. I think this is a back door way of dealing with the issue, and it is not acceptable. Public policy must be changed in the open and not in the back door through a bill like this.

Third, the bill provides an open door for the government to make unchallenged patronage appointments.

Fourth, while the bill would provide parliament with after the fact reports from the minister responsible, altogether too much business will be conducted behind closed doors with no provision to use even the Access to Information Act. Such secrecy is not acceptable.

Fifth and last, why is the auditor general not the auditor given the mandate to annually audit this fund and the administration of these funds? Why is it not in the open for the auditor general to make his examination and report to parliament?

These are changes that I believe need to be made.

I would, therefore, like to move a motion at this time. I move:

That the motion be amended by deleting all the words after the word “That” and substituting the following therefor:

Bill C-78, an act to establish the Public Sector Pension Investment Board, to amend the Public Service Superannuation Act, the Canadian Forces Superannuation Act, the Royal Canadian Mounted Police Superannuation Act, the Defence Services Pension Continuation Act, the Royal Canadian Mounted Police Pension Continuation Act, the Members of Parliament Retiring Allowances Act and the Canada Post Corporation Act and to make a consequential amendment to another act, be not now read a second time but that it be read a second time this day six months hence.

[Royal Canadian Mounted Police, March 25th, 1999]

Mr. Speaker, there is a serious situation developing within the Royal Canadian Mounted Police.

The plan to eliminate some 1,000 RCMP positions is very disturbing. What is even more disturbing is that half of these positions are to be left vacant in British Columbia.

To open up the Regina training centre for four groups of 25 trainees each, for a total of 100 new officers a year, is an inadequate token.

RCMP detachments in rural British Columbia are seriously understaffed and overworked. Investigations per member are at record numbers. The personal and health consequences for them is frightening. What happens when a violent situation erupts and there is no backup available?

This is a serious problem with long term implications. The Mounties are unable to provide Canadians with basic services, yet they are still expected to target long term organized crime and to support the new gun control implementation.

We need our Mounties in full force. I call upon the government to act now to restore staffing and funding so that Canadians from coast to coast can have the police—

[Government Services Act, 1999, March 23rd, 1999]

Madam Speaker, it has been some time since I have been able to address the Chair and this chamber. I hope that my cough and my voice will allow me to conclude my speech.

Here we are again to debate Motion No. 21 tonight. Between 11 o'clock and midnight after we vote on this we will begin debating Bill C-76, an act to provide for the resumption and continuation of government services. We will go all night, until the wee small hours, until we have finally concluded with the vote on third reading of the bill. We will probably be here until about the time that most people will be thinking about getting up to go to work tomorrow morning.

Why are we doing this? Why are we pushing the bill through the House in this manner tonight? Why is the government's closure motion being debated right now? It is largely because of the slipshod, shoddy mediocre thinking that characterizes the Liberal government. This need not be the case tonight. There has been plenty of time for the government to meet with its employees, to negotiate a settlement that is fair and which is agreed to by all parties concerned, but that is not the case.

This government has allowed the process to go on and on without taking its employees seriously, without giving them the respect that is due to them. These employees have their backs against the wall and have said “We have to do something to force a settlement so we will begin rotating strikes”. We have been pushed into what is an emergency for thousands and thousands of Canadians.

The bill will force over 14,000 members of the Public Service Alliance of Canada back to work. They have been on rotating strikes this past month. The bill pretty much forces all PSAC workers back to work, regardless of whether or not they are on strike. Some of them are not on strike right now. The legislation intends to close the loophole for those correctional officers who will not be in a strike position until Friday. The government has allowed itself the slack to have cabinet proclaim this if it is needed. What kind of legislation is this where nobody really knows what is going on?

It is not unusual for this government. When the government was first elected in 1993 it came in with a promise to cancel the Pearson airport contract. By golly it did and it is still a mess. The Pearson airport is in such a mess that Air Canada is suing the corporation for hundreds of millions of dollars.

Think of the cancellation of the helicopters. Helicopters are needed by the emergency workers. Helicopters have still not been provided and the government is still debating about which machines to purchase.

Think of the immigration situation. People who would be a credit to our country are being denied entry at the borders. Instead, outlaws and criminals are allowed in.

Think of the Royal Canadian Mounted Police. They are concerned that in the near future they could have a shortage of as many as 1,000 members across the country, with a shortage of 500 RCMP officers in British Columbia alone.

Tell me what kind of government that is. Tell me that it is not mediocre thinking by a slipshod government that allows our country to be served so poorly.

In my constituency of Cariboo—Chilcotin the trade agreements have been a problem for the producers of softwood. I think of the quota agreement, a quota which I spoke so vehemently against. Why could we not use the dispute settlement mechanisms that are available? No, we have a quota agreement. The best this agreement could do is close down the small mills and the new producers and have their quotas go to the large mills and the established producers. The worst it could do would be to have the large mills not find this an acceptable agreement. The worst is what we got. More mediocre thinking.

It occurs right across the country and it has been so detrimental, so harmful and so hurtful to our citizens. It is the people who go to work every day, the people who will get up tomorrow morning at about the time we pass this bill with the Liberal majority. It is those people who are hurt by these government policies. I hope they understand the seriousness of this kind of mediocre leadership.

I do not think we will find many people in the country who are surprised with what is happening here. They are not surprised about the dispute between PSAC and the federal government. They are not surprised by the rotating strikes by PSAC members.

They are not surprised by the number of federal services affected by this labour disruption. We are very sympathetic with those people. I am very sad to say that this has become such an emergency that we need some kind of resolution, so I will be voting for the bill but with deep regret.

We should think of our constituents who are in need of a resolution and think of the mediocrity that has brought us to this position. Canadian taxpayers are seriously affected by it. The Minister of National Revenue stood and said that they were about 1.2 million claims behind this time last year in terms of processing.

We should also think of grain farmers who have been suffering over past years with low grain prices and now have their backs against the wall. They desperately need to get their grain loaded on to ships and delivered to overseas customers.

This is undoubtedly the busiest time of the year for Revenue Canada. Many Canadians have already filed their income taxes and are anxiously awaiting a little bit of the money the government has taxed out of their hides. We should think of the rotating strikes that have caused the processing of these returns to be so slow and of farmers, many of whom have already gone bankrupt and many others who are threatened with bankruptcy. Are we to ignore them?

Even though this could be explained as a major inconvenience for Canadian taxpayers, there is a growing number of citizens who will be more than inconvenienced. They will be seriously hurt by the long term effects of the strike. The sad part of this strike is that it need never have happened.

Without the money from the sale of their grain many farmers will be unable to plant their crops and will face the consequences of lack of income for long periods of time. Thank goodness there have been no picket lines and the weighing has been able to continue during the strike by some 70 grain handlers. Thank goodness strikers have understood the seriousness of this consideration, and I thank them for that.

The official opposition called for an emergency debate on the issue last week. We called on the government to act. Farmers and taxpayers are depending upon a resolution of this problem. It is with real disappointment and reluctance that I have to support the legislation.

My colleagues and I strongly believe that this heavy handed approach, an approach I will talk about a bit later, is only a short term fix. It merely adds to the problems in the long term.

The government has not looked at other means of settling this labour dispute. It has not looked at a third party resolution to it. It has not looked at final offer selection arbitration, which is what we would propose as a reasonable way of doing it.

What is final offer selection arbitration? It would allow both parties to negotiate until they reach a conclusion that is satisfactory to both, unless it is not possible. Both parties would be invited to present their final best offer. The final best offers would be received by a neutral arbitrator and in the mind of the arbitrator the fairest offer would be accepted. There would be no cherry-picking of what is good from one and what is good from the other. One final offer would be accepted. This would focus the mind on the very best offer possible.

As many of my colleagues have mentioned throughout the debate leading up to this point, final offer selection arbitration is official policy within our party. We will be pushing the government in this debate to adopt this policy.

My NDP colleagues talk about this being the end of negotiations. Forget it. This is simply a mechanism for dealing with an intractable solution that leads to hardship for many people who are not involved. There has to be a better way and Canada is one of the countries that has the most difficulty in settling its labour disputes.

My colleagues and I know that legislation such as the bill before us tonight should only be used for national emergencies. I do not believe that the dithering, the waiting, the delaying and the lack of taking this situation seriously are acceptable reasons for allowing it to become a national emergency. There is no need for that kind of emergency. This is simply as a result of dithering, a lack of concern and a lack of respect.

Those people who are being hurt by this situation will agree that there must be a better means of resolving such disputes than what the government has put forward. There has to be a better way than ramming it through late at night. Their livelihood depends upon it. They deserve better.

Given the current financial hardships of many Canadians, and I think especially of farmers and those people who are unemployed and are depending upon a little bit of money in their tax refunds, they do not need more obstacles in making their living.

The approach that the government is using tonight is not a new approach. Anyone who has followed the events in recent years may recall that the Liberal government used the same heavy handed tactics to end the dispute with Canada Post last year. What has been the result? Sixteen months later it is not even negotiating with the postal workers. How is that for credibility?

While the union is still waiting for the negotiations to begin the government would have us believe that the current situation is all PSAC's fault. That simply is not true. The government's various stalling tactics have not helped the situation in any way. The current legislation will do nothing to help mend any relationship between the union and the government when they head back to the negotiating table.

Why does the government not have a long term policy that would allow the opponents to deal peacefully in these negotiations and would allow employers to deal peacefully with their employees to settle serious disputes? Why is there no means of third party mediation or arbitration? Why is the government not using these? Why is it bringing these issues to a conclusion through heavy handed legislation?

We should have known that the government would use last minute tactics to dissolve the current labour dispute. It is really not resolving it. It is sweeping it under the carpet, trying to hide it or get rid of it. The consequences are still there. We see it all the time in the House of Commons with the government's use of time allocation and closure.

Is it not interesting that less than six years after the government was elected to power this is the 50th time allocation or closure motion in the House of Commons. This is a dark anniversary. We have seen the Liberal government invoke censure of debate. Citizens of Canada elect their representatives to come to the House of Commons to represent them and then find that representation is not possible because of closure and time allocation.

Is it not interesting that one debate lasted 30 minutes before the vote after time allocation? This is the 50th time tonight. It is shameful and a total disregard for the democratic process. We oppose this restriction on our right as members to represent our constituents.

We oppose the government's last ditch ineffective approach to force legally striking workers back to work. We also acknowledge the overwhelming need for a resolution. This is the government's responsibility. It is the government's fault that it has come to the situation with which we are faced tonight.

I would like to make a couple of points about the legislation. Part I of the legislation, once assented to, comes into force 12 hours later. Once this occurs, this part of the bill will order all striking workers back to work and will prohibit any further strike activity so that government operations can resume.

What will this do to the morale of employees? They will not have a say and will be told to do it. The government is saying that it is not concerned about their needs and that their negotiations do not mean anything. Further, this part of the bill provides for the enforcement of these orders. Failure to comply with the provisions outlined in the bill will result in financial penalties of up to $10,000 a day.

Part II of the legislation covers basically the same provisions as part I. However, part II deals with the few correctional service officers who will shortly be in a legal strike position. They are not even in strike position but they are included in the legislation. This part of the legislation will not come into force unless it is proclaimed by order in council. Here we have cabinet taking over from the House of Commons once again.

Once again I voice my reluctant support of the bill. I am sorry to have to do so. We should have never been forced into this situation in the first place. The government has forced us into a position where there must be a resolution, but because of government intransigence and government lack of responsibility we are left with a much less than satisfactory means of settling the dispute on behalf of the nation.

The government should be condemned for its ill thought, heavy handed approach in forcing ends to disputes. However we need to keep in mind the need for important government operations. Government has become so big and has intruded so deeply into the lives of people that without these services Canadians suffer. We simply cannot cut them off. These services must be maintained.

As we do this on behalf of all Canadians, on behalf of grain workers and on behalf of taxpayers, I am sorry we have come to this position. I beg the government to think about what it is doing to our country as it so carelessly administers the affairs of the nation.

[The Main Estimates, March 2nd, 1999]

Mr. Speaker, with the estimates out and this government back to big spending Canadians need to know where the tax cuts are coming.

Are the increases always going to be there? Is this $8 billion in new spending the reason Canadians will not get real tax relief now? We need to know.

[The Main Estimates, March 2nd, 1999]

Mr. Speaker, the Canadian television fund is getting its budget doubled from $50 million to $100 million. Is this why Canadians who are scratching for rent and groceries cannot get tax relief?