Allan Rock

[Justice, April 10th, 1997]

Mr. Speaker, the fact is that the case is before the British Columbia Court of Appeal. The argument before that appeal court is that such sentences should never be given in such cases. If the appeal court should see fit to make such a disposition of course it will be binding on lower courts.

The reality is that my friend speaks of victims. All week long the Reform Party has made much of the plight of victims. As I have already said this afternoon there is in Canada a no more credible, hardworking organization in favour of victims and their rights than CAVEAT. There are few more respected outspoken spokespersons for victims than Priscilla de Villiers.

As I have read to the House today, Priscilla de Villiers on behalf of CAVEAT has said that the government listens, has made meaningful change and has acted to change the law to make the plight of victims better. That is the record of the government.

[Justice, April 10th, 1997]

Mr. Speaker, as the hon. member knows, the provision in Bill C-41 to which he refers requires the court to assess the safety of the community before determining that a conditional sentence is appropriate. One would have thought it was

clear that someone who had committed a serious violent crime would not be granted a conditional sentence.

The cases in some of the appellate courts of the provinces have been unclear. It is for that reason that I proposed-and the hon. member was good enough to agree-that there ought to be an amendment to Bill C-41 to make clear that the courts must have regard to the traditional principles of sentencing, including deterrence, denunciation and protection of society when deciding on whether a conditional sentence should be given.

The case to which the hon. member refers, which is so shamelessly exploited by the hon. member for-

[Organized Crime, April 10th, 1997]

Mr. Speaker, I fully share the hon. member's concern. We disagree on how we should proceed to meet these challenges.

Both I personally and the Government of Canada prefer to use constitutional and valid measures. We believe it is possible to meet these challenges with constitutional measures.

Mr. Bégin, the Quebec minister, suggested another, unconstitutional approach. I would prefer to have laws with staying power, not laws that would be challenged in the courts in the months to come. So next week I intend to table proposals that are valid, constitutional and effective as well.

[Organized Crime, April 10th, 1997]

Mr. Speaker, I would ask the hon. member to wait until next week when I intend to announce concrete, specific and practical measures to deal with a situation we find not only in Quebec but wherever such gangs and individuals are involved in organized crime.

It is true that Monday night I received a proposal drafted by Mr. Bégin, the attorney general for Quebec. I examined the proposal, and my officials are now preparing our replies. Personally, I was a little surprised and disappointed because, according to Mr. Bégin's proposal, membership alone in an organization would constitute a crime. I think this is against the Quebec and Canadian charters.

It is possible to find acceptable, permanent and effective ways to deal with this. I am now preparing proposals for next week.

[Rights Of Victims, April 10th, 1997]

I told the hon. member that he does not have to take our word for it. He can take the word of the president of the most well respected and most credible organization of victims. That is the truth.

[Rights Of Victims, April 10th, 1997]

Mr. Speaker, I say the government has acted. I do not ask the hon. member or the House simply to take my word for it. Why do we not ask someone who knows about being a victim and about what rights victims need?

In answer to the hon. member's question, let me read from a letter I received today:

Three years ago a petition was presented to Allan Rock on behalf of 2.5 million Canadians. It called for far-reaching measures to improve public safety and the treatment of victims.

Since then significant steps have been taken to address some of these concerns. Although much still needs to be done, this government has shown a willingness to listen and to act.

We look forward to continuing to work with the justice committee during its comprehensive review of victims issues in Canada.

It was signed by Priscilla de Villiers, president of CAVEAT, Canadians Against Violence Everywhere Advocating its Termination.

[Rights Of Victims, April 10th, 1997]

Mr. Speaker, all of us believe that anyone who commits a serious violent crime should be imprisoned as a penalty for that kind of crime.

The case to which the hon. member refers is before the appeal court and he knows that. Let the courts deal with that decision.

Last Monday, because of our concern about the way courts are interpreting some of the provisions of the bill, we asked the House to agree to amendments to the conditional sentence provision in Bill C-41. The hon. member and his party agreed, and those amendments will be adopted and enacted by this Parliament.

I said in answer to the hon. member's questions earlier this week, and I will say it again today, the government has acted to make significant improvements in the criminal law for the interests of victims. My hon. friend knows that. The legislation speaks for itself. We have acted.

[Rights Of Victims, April 10th, 1997]

Mr. Speaker, two years ago this month a man from Montreal came to see me explaining that his 15-year old daughter had been sexually assaulted and strangled. He asked me to help him. He asked the government to help him. He asked us to see if we could change the law to provide the police with investigative tools that might help in the prosecution of that offence.

As a result, the Solicitor General and I met with the caucus, discussed the policies of the government, worked very hard and brought forward legislation which added to the criminal law powers for the police to search and to take bodily substances after they get a warrant to test for DNA substances.

That legislation was put into effect in July 1995. The investigation was concluded. A sample was taken. Charges were laid and that case is now before the courts.

That is the way the government responds to the needs of victims.

[Cruise Ship Gambling, April 9th, 1997]

Mr. Speaker, I know of the hon. member's interest in this subject. There are many members on this side of the House who are just as interested who see in cruise ship gambling the opportunity for employment and for economic activity in a variety of places throughout Canada.

I want to assure the hon. member and all members of the House that we are looking seriously at the prospect. We have a consultation document that is about to be published to go to the industry, to the governments involved and to other stakeholders to see their views.

We believe, unlike the Reform Party, that we should take into account the views of others before acting. That is exactly what we are going to do.

I assure the member that we are treating it seriously and I will keep him abreast of developments as consultations go forward.

[Cruise Ship Gambling, April 9th, 1997]

No, Mr. Speaker. Consultations are continuing. We have to consult everyone affected by the issue, that is, the provinces, the industry and business people in order to establish the merits of such a program. We have a consultation document that we will soon be releasing and we intend to look at the whole issue in order to determine the best approach to take.