John Solomon

[Division No. 549, June 8th, 1999]

Mr. Speaker, members of the NDP present this evening vote yes to this motion.

[Division No. 546, June 8th, 1999]

Mr. Speaker, I would like to add to the New Democratic Party vote of nay to this motion, the member for Yukon who has just arrived.

(The House divided on the motion, which was negatived on the following division:)

[Main Estimates, 1999-2000, June 8th, 1999]

Mr. Speaker, the member for Brandon—Souris just stood in this House and gave a speech. The same leader of his party appointed a senator 20 years ago, the phantom senator from Regina, a fellow by the name of James Balfour who has not been seen in the city of Regina for 20 years.

I wonder whether he was giving this speech to get himself in the Senate or whether he actually believes that taxpayers' money should be invested in someone by the name of James Balfour, a senator who has not been to Regina in the 20 years I have been around. I have never met the guy. Regina is a small city with about 200,000 people. I have been in public office off and on and have been involved in community associations for about 26 years. I had never heard of this guy. He was appointed by former Prime Minister Joe Clark, a friend of James Balfour. I guess James Balfour disappeared at the same time Joe Clark did because we have not seen Joe Clark for about 10 or 20 years either.

I wonder whether the Conservative member for Brandon—Souris continues to support the Senate when Conservatives in Saskatchewan, 18 former elected Conservatives were jailed because of the corruption they were involved with. One was the former deputy premier, Eric Berntson, who is now a senator. After years of gouging Saskatchewan taxpayers he was appointed to the Senate. He was found guilty on a number of fraud charges and breach of trust and now he is being paid as a senator as a result of the wonderful Conservative Party.

How long does the hon. member for Brandon—Souris believe the taxpayers of Canada should be supporting convicted felons such as Senator Michel Cogger and Senator Eric Berntson to the tune of about $500,000 a year for them, their expenses and their offices each before we toss them out because of their convictions in the courts? How much longer will this member support the subsidy of these individuals who have gouged Canadians for far too long?

[Main Estimates, 1999-2000, June 8th, 1999]

No, not at all sir.

[Main Estimates, 1999-2000, June 8th, 1999]

Mr. Speaker, I rise on a point of order. I was wondering what relevance reference to Bill C-4 has to a vote on money for the Senate. I wonder if you could rule on that.

[Main Estimates, 1999-2000, June 8th, 1999]

It would be 99.

[Main Estimates, 1999-2000, June 8th, 1999]

That is a lot.

[Main Estimates, 1999-2000, June 8th, 1999]

Over 10 years.

[Main Estimates, 1999-2000, June 8th, 1999]

Mr. Speaker, I want to ask my Liberal colleague a question about the Senate. As he knows, the New Democratic Party supports the abolition of the Senate because it is unelected. As a matter of fact the people who occupy the Senate are friends of former prime ministers and the current Prime Minister.

Senators are appointed to age 75, and 104 of them and their staff spend about $55 million a year. They have no accountability to anyone. They do not have to go to constituencies to report on what they have been doing on their behalf. They do not do much of behalf of people unless it is a very wealthy family or a very large corporation.

Has my Liberal colleague ever heard of someone by the name of Jim Balfour? Perhaps he could nod his head yes or no.

He has never heard of Mr. Balfour. We have a senator by the name of James Balfour who was appointed 20 years ago by Joe Clark. He was a friend of the then prime minister. He is a Conservative who comes from my home town in Regina.

I have been involved in the public community of Regina for 26 years and I have never met this person. Nor have any of the 6,000 people to whom I have talked. They have never heard of this guy who is a senator representing Saskatchewan, let alone Regina. Over the years Mr. Balfour has an attendance record of maybe 18% or 23% depending on the year we are looking at.

Does the Liberal member opposite, who also supports the abolition of the Senate, believe that there should be more accountability for the people who are there now? Perhaps they should go back to their cities and provinces on occasion to meet one or two people, at least once or twice a year, so that people know they are alive and maybe doing something progressive for the country.

Would the Liberal member comment on Mr. Balfour, the phantom senator from Regina?

[Main Estimates, 1999-2000, June 8th, 1999]

Madam Speaker, I appreciate the co-operation of the government House leader in this regard.

When I was a candidate in the 1993 election I went door to door with a petition calling for the abolition of the Senate. At that time I received about 39% of the vote. Some 99% of the people to whom I spoke on doorsteps over a six month period signed the petition, even though most of them did not vote for the NDP at that time.

I want the government House leader to understand that this is a very serious issue with respect to the Senate and the supply of money to the Senate.

Part of this supply will go toward the pay expenses, travel expenses and benefits of two senators, Senator Bernston and Senator Cogger who are convicted felons. How long will the government support paying salaries and expenses to these two convicted felons?

Will it allow this happen for two years as in Mr. Cogger's case, or three, four or five more years? Or, will the government take some action to at least suspend them and suspend all pay and benefits until such time as the long appeals which could drag out for years and years take place?