Ian McClelland

[Quebec Referendum, September 26th, 1995]

Mr. Speaker, a no vote does not mean status quo. A no vote means that Quebec will co-operate with all the other provinces to give a better federation to Canadians from every region.

Just like a good chess player plans his moves, we urge Quebecers to look at their situation before the referendum and to give serious thought to what will happen after they have voted no.

We give Quebecers the best possible reason to vote no, that is a combination of all the benefits of Canadian unity, along with a mandate to reduce the federal government's powers. We believe that these powers should rest more closely with Canadians and that Ottawa must stop monopolizing them.

Again, Mr. Speaker, a no vote does not mean the status quo.

[Federal-Provincial Fiscal Arrangements, September 22nd, 1995]

Mr. Speaker, the reality of the situation is he who pays the piper calls the tune.

At the recently concluded conference of health ministers, all of the provinces and their health ministers were on one side of the issue and the federal Minister of Health was on the other side. The provinces and all Canadians want to resolve this issue. The only consultation taking place between the federal government and the provinces has been a letter stating that October 15 is the deadline.

Will the Prime Minister instruct the Minister of Health to be flexible on the deadline so that the provinces and all of the stakeholders involved in health care and the delivery of health care, which is under serious pressure, are able to come around the table and solve the problem without artificially imposed deadlines?

[Federal-Provincial Fiscal Arrangements, September 22nd, 1995]

Mr. Speaker, yesterday the Prime Minister made passing reference to Albertans as being the fortunate fat cats of confederation; an attitude which led to the hated national energy program.

The Prime Minister should know that Albertans have contributed around $140 billion to confederation over the last 30 years. Last year alone they contributed $2 billion. Next year the government will transfer approximately $475 million less to Alberta.

My question is for the Prime Minister. Is it right for the Government of Canada to significantly reduce funding for pro-

grams that are the constitutional responsibility of the provinces, at the same time insisting on setting all the rules for the delivery of those programs?

[Business Development Bank Of Canada Act, June 22nd, 1995]

Mr. Speaker, I want to make it very clear at the outset that our party opposes the bill in principle. We feel that it does not make a whole lot of sense for the government to be establishing another crown corporation to compete with the private financial sector at the very time we are desperately trying to get CN, another crown corporation, into the private sector.

To those Canadians watching, I would like to put the magnitude of the new Federal Business Development Bank into context. The lending authority of the bank will go to $18 billion. The combined total of all of the outstanding loans of all of the chartered banks in Canada is less than double that. It is something like $26 billion. We have created one huge entity in the financial marketplace.

This is a government bill and we knew it was going to pass. I want to tell the House that the industry committee worked very hard to make the bill better. That was the purpose of our amendments.

I think we should also recognize the fact that members of the Department of Industry were most co-operative, very helpful, and worked very hard to put this legislation through. As well, Mr. François Beaudoin and members of the bank have worked very hard.

I do not wish to cast any aspersions whatsoever on the role of the Federal Business Development Bank as a complementary lender and as a mentor to incubating entrepreneurship in Canada. That is where the bank should restrict its activities. In our view, there is a necessity of having that kind of mentoring in our country. They do great work through the CASE program.

We feel that we should not be getting ourselves involved in the private sector. We did great work in the Small Businesses Loans Act working with the banks. This summer the industry committee will be working once again with the banks to keep their feet to the fire, to make sure they are lending money to small business. If the banks do their job, the crown does not have to do it. In my view, and in the view of many people on this side of the House, the correct approach would be to keep the bank's feet to the fire, not exposing more taxpayers' money to small business or any business. The business of business is business. We should not as taxpayers be throwing money at businesses.

Having said that, Mr. Speaker, I want to say through you to the House and to people of the Federal Business Development Bank that they do have the support of the House. It is a democratic institution. It is going to be continued, and we expect them to be a complementary lender, not a competitive lender.

[Business Development Bank Of Canada Act, June 21st, 1995]

moved:

Motion No. 25

That Bill C-91 be amended by adding after line 5, on page 17, the following new Clause:

"39. The Governor in Council may, by regulation, define "hybrid capital instrument"."

[Business Development Bank Of Canada Act, June 21st, 1995]

moved:

Motion No. 21

That Bill C-91, in Clause 32, be amended by replacing lines 30 to 34, on page 14 and lines 1 to 29, on page 15, with the following:

"32. The Bank shall not grant any assistance, whether in the form of a loan, investment, guarantee, purchase or lease, to an applicant who is an interested person or, if the applicant is a firm or corporation, to a firm or corporation where a partner of the firm or a shareholder, director or officer of the corporation is an interested person."

Motion No. 22

That Bill C-91, in Clause 35, be amended by replacing lines 38 and 39, on page 15, with the following:

"35. (1) Five years after this Act comes into force, and every five years afterward, the".

[Business Development Bank Of Canada Act, June 21st, 1995]

moved:

Motion No. 15

That Bill C-91, in Clause 22, be amended by replacing line 29, on page 10, with the following:

"any entity by any means, except an entity that is a trust company, insurance company or dealer in investments or securities;".

[Business Development Bank Of Canada Act, June 21st, 1995]

moved:

Motion No. 10

That Bill C-91, in Clause 16, be amended by replacing line 22, on page 8, with the following:

"made or given by another person, other than a Crown corporation, if".

Motion No. 11

That Bill C-91, in Clause 17, be amended by replacing lines 31 to 35, on page 8, with the following: a ) business planning services; and b ) management counselling and training, including seminars, conferences and meetings.''

[Business Development Bank Of Canada Act, June 21st, 1995]

moved:

Motion No. 8

That Bill C-91, in Clause 14, be amended by adding after line 23, on page 6, the following:

"(1.1) The total amount of all loans made by the Bank shall not exceed $18 billion."

[Business Development Bank Of Canada Act, June 21st, 1995]

moved:

Motion No. 16

That Bill C-91, in Clause 23, be amended by replacing lines 40 to 42, on page 10, with the following:

"shares with a par value of $100 each, but the paid-in capital of the Bank,".

Motion No. 17

That Bill C-91, in Clause 24, be amended a ) by replacing lines 18 and 19, on page 11, with the following:

"24. The rights conferred by shares include"; and b ) by deleting lines 26 to 38, on page 11.

Motion No. 18

That Bill C-91, in Clause 27, be amended by replacing lines 28 to 42, on page 12 and lines 1 to 23, on page 13, with the following: a ) authorizing the issue of shares in one or more series and authorizing the Board to fix, by resolution, the maximum number of shares in each series and to determine the designation, rights, privileges, restrictions and conditions attaching to the shares of each series, subject to any limitation set out in the by-law; b ) changing authorized shares without par value, whether issued or not, into shares with a par value and changing authorized shares with a par value, whether issued or not, into shares without par value; and c ) consolidating or subdividing shares.''