Veterans Affairs committee  Peers.

Veterans Affairs committee  Peers bring more of us out of basements than anybody else. It's peers who get us to understand that we can go somewhere and seek help. The service offered here, if it connects people to another peer or makes them aware of other peer services, could become a potential referral that eventually leads to a referral to seek professional help.

Veterans Affairs committee  If you like, I could add something. You talked about transition and the loss of identity, but I think it's important to also, perhaps, reframe that. It's the loss of sense of purpose that puts people like me in crisis. If you want to compound that with the stresses Mr. Kitchen referred to, all you have to do is break our circle of support.

Veterans Affairs committee  I think it's also important to realize that we attack nationally because.... I'll give you one specific example, of the Canadian Paediatric Society. We talked about the impact on children. They came up with a position paper and recommendations for pediatricians across the country.

Veterans Affairs committee  I think Nora hit perhaps the most important aspect, and that's to listen. Those who have gone through suicidal ideation who I have encountered and had the privilege of speaking with of course have come away and are in recovery, but they and I both agree that the common thread of success has always been that somebody who refused to give up on them and who had no judgment just sat there and listened to their story and listened to their perspective and tried to understand without judgment.

Veterans Affairs committee  A specific example happened just this week. The ombudsman published that transition process for regular forces and for reservists, and it's a wonderful thing. It must have taken months to do. However, if a veteran or a veteran's family is looking at that and does not relate, you've created expectations that cannot be met.

Veterans Affairs committee  That is an excellent question. It is like the myth that all military and veterans' families are strong and resilient. That angers families. One day, my wife might be very strong, confident, and able to deal with various situations, but not be able to do so the next day. She's a bag of worms and doesn't know what to do because too many impacts, both social and due to lifestyle, have piled up at one time.

Veterans Affairs committee  Yes, absolutely.

Veterans Affairs committee  I think families will tell you that investing in communication and investing in keeping those families together will greatly increase the odds that they'll stay together through transition and post, and will reduce the odds of homeless incidence. We know the evidence says that families will offer support, but families tell us to help them learn how to handle communication.

Veterans Affairs committee  I don't think that's a bad idea at all. We definitely want to take the insights gained from that case study and definitely have the long view in mind.

Veterans Affairs committee  What policy and program implications does that generate for us? I don't think it's a bad idea at all.

Veterans Affairs committee  Big change starts with small steps, and a case study starts to build evidence that might generate a pilot, which builds a bigger body of evidence and then leads to implementation. It's just frustrating for me because I recognize the timeline. I'm just working the math in my head thinking that's really long, but in government terms, that's really fast, so let's try for a case study and see what happens.

Veterans Affairs committee  Some of my past experience is in software development, not for Veterans Affairs but for other purposes. One of the things I learned from the industry is you don't develop in isolation. You develop with users influencing the decisions. You have great smart minds who build nice tech things, but if they can't be used, they're not valuable.

Veterans Affairs committee  But the research does tell us that caregivers are not just partners. A caregiver is part of a pie chart of friends, aunts and uncles, and parents; it can be a brother or sister; it can be an older sibling. It can also be a spouse. A veteran identifier, a My VAC Account, and the family getting access to work with the veteran as part of the circle of support are all absolutely critical, and I think these things could achieve the kind of outcome you're after, which is faster, more efficient, and more effective support.

Veterans Affairs committee  My own experience is that it's largely a myth. I had a bad transition experience but I had outstanding follow-up. They didn't forget me, they didn't leave me alone, and they made me feel connected. That's all I needed.