Canadian Heritage committee  Again, I don't think much of that idea. I think it's disingenuous. I think it is opportunistic, and it doesn't reflect the orderly marketplace and the reality of how film and television get produced and financed in Canada. I think that my colleagues at the Writers Guild and the Directors Guild are trying to take a role in the ownership of content that they're only one part of—an important part, but not the most important part.

Canadian Heritage committee  I will undertake to provide a response to you.

Canadian Heritage committee  We always look at the production sector in Canada, both domestic production and service production, and we try to do no harm to each other. They're very different business models, but they are very good businesses and create a lot of jobs for artists, directors, actors and crews.

Canadian Heritage committee  I think we have talked about it a little bit today, so I don't want to repeat myself, but I think the role of a Canadian producer in this system is to develop IP—great stories—that can then find platforms that attract eyeballs and audiences in Canada, to take that content outside of Canada and export it to the greatest extent possible, to both tell stories and generate revenue in the system, and to have it recirculate in the system.

Canadian Heritage committee  Obviously, from my testimony, you will understand that I'm not a supporter of that approach. I think it's a bit disingenuous by a lot of the parties putting forth that argument. I think that if they are going to be the copyright owners, the end result would be that there may not be as much production that gets done unless they're going to do a deal with someone who's going to pay for that content.

Canadian Heritage committee  I apologize. I missed the beginning of your question, sir.

Canadian Heritage committee  I think that it's a very important role. I think that we have to manage production. We manage the creation process. We manage the production process and we manage the exploitation process. We work with all these people, who are very important to what we do and we need them. We need to work with them and collaborate with them, but that doesn't mean that they need to be controlling the copyright.

Canadian Heritage committee  It's not one size fits all, unfortunately. We have shows. To use Murdoch as an example, we developed that show to a certain extent and then we brought in a showrunner who hadn't been involved in the development phase at all. We built the structure and then they came in. They worked two years and then they wanted to go off and do something else.

Canadian Heritage committee  No. We are going to do 18 shows this year. We tell them the stories we want to break out. They workshop ideas and then they allocate who will write which script. In the Murdoch case, we've had three different head writers who have all done a good job, because the show is still on the air.

Canadian Heritage committee  The thing I find really important about this is clarity on who owns it and who can exploit it, and a really orderly exploitation of what you've made in the marketplace. The worst thing is to have any grey area so that you're sitting on your hands because you can't sell things because you don't have the rights.

Canadian Heritage committee  Do you mean the challenges of the disruption facing us, writ large, or with respect to copyright? There are lots of issues, lots of disruptions, lots of different platforms, new ways of doing business and new challenges that we deal with every day, and we have to find ways. One thing that Canadian producers have always been very good at is that we've never been like the American model, where you have a studio that funds 100%.

Canadian Heritage committee  We don't want to appropriate that story.

Canadian Heritage committee  I'll talk generally. There are some people who aren't governed by collective agreements. We do prime-time drama in Canada. We deal with ACTRA, WGC and the Directors Guild. There are projects that are done outside the protections that those guild arrangements provide, but we still have to come to an arrangement, and I assume that it's a market arrangement.

Canadian Heritage committee  I'm sorry, sir. I would have to talk to the CMPA, who could canvass the structure outside of Canada.

Canadian Heritage committee  I think it's favourable to the industry. I think there's a clear road map on how it's dealt with on the television and film side. The parties have agreements that are negotiated in good faith between them, the writers, the directors, the actors and all the people who are part of it.