Public Accounts committee  Yes.

Public Accounts committee  Unfortunately, I have it in English.

Public Accounts committee  It is not about whether or not I feel like it, but you are asking me to read this sentence. You have it in front of you, so I am presuming that I can give you my interpretation of this sentence in French: "The new conflict of interest policy...”

Public Accounts committee  —“is expected to retain substantially the same requirements as the current policy”.

Public Accounts committee  This is really an issue where the individual deputy heads have to take into account the nature of their organizations and what is the nature of the risk to their organizations. It is not something we can dictate from the centre. It really has to be done department by department, organization by organization, depending on the nature of the work, depending on the percentage of terms versus temporary help, all of those.

Public Accounts committee  Briefly, all of this is really around creating an opportunity for dialogue and constant evolution. These issues are not static. The principles are core, the values are core. How people interpret them, how they deal with them on a daily basis, changes. Issues arise, and we have to create an opportunity for people to be able to discuss them.

Public Accounts committee  First of all, we responded that we were in favour of the recommendations made by the Auditor General. To answer your question, I would tell you that the action plan that we have developed will be carried out in compliance with the new code and the new policy.

Public Accounts committee  If I may, I will answer that, Mr. Chair, since I raised the issue of grants and contributions. When I headed an organization the primary responsibility of which was in fact the management and overseeing of grants and contributions, we launched a number of discussions among employees, because sometimes the issue, as you've quite rightly pointed out, of what is real versus what is perceived is in fact a very complex discussion to be had.

Public Accounts committee  At TBS we have done an ethical risk assessment. And in the audit policy, there is a requirement for departmental audit committees to have an annual look at the departmental risk profile. They are supposed to have a conversation on values and ethics within the organizations. Departmental audit committees do this each year.

Public Accounts committee  I think I'll ask Ms. Meredith to talk about the issues we are working our way through.

Public Accounts committee  We are planning for spring 2011. The code and policies have not yet been presented to Treasury Board ministers. As I said earlier, there are still some legal issues that require some validation. A couple of things have delayed some of the discussions. One is the restructuring of the organization called the Canada Public Service Agency and its reintegration into the Treasury Board Secretariat.

Public Accounts committee  I think there are two aspects to this. One of them is training, which is a component of what we provide our employees. I'd simply make the point: consultants and contractors are not employees of the Government of Canada. The training we provide is on the basic elements of the code and the responsibilities, but there is an added component, which is the ongoing discussion, as I mentioned earlier, that deputy heads have through their management, through their employees, about what it means to deal with these issues on an ongoing basis.

Public Accounts committee  Mr. Chair, on this particular issue—

Public Accounts committee  The code that we are developing as well as the policy on conflict of interest do not change the law. The commissioner takes direction from the law. The code simply provides a framework for certain practices, but it does not replace the law.

Public Accounts committee  Yes, but there is a process to review the act that could be triggered by Parliament starting in 2012.