Finance committee  On a cap, whether floating or hard, we don't know what the effect would be. I can tell you that if the government moved close to doing it, I believe the banks and the other credit card issuers would say they're going to cut off half the customers who have credit cards currently because they wouldn't be making enough money under a restricted, regulated interest rate.

Industry committee  No. I believe I was actually speaking about caps overall, whether they're floating caps or hard caps. It's possible to set a cap, but first you need to know what the profit levels are of the companies involved. That's why we're calling--not just for that reason but overall--for the government to mandate one of the federal financial agencies, whether it's OSFI, the Office of the Superintendent of Financial Institutions,the Competition Bureau, or the Financial Consumer Agency of Canada, to conduct an independent audit of these companies to find out what their credit card divisions' profit levels are and whether they are excessively profitable or reasonably profitable.

Industry committee  On a cap, whether floating or hard, we don't know what the effect would be. I can tell you that if the government moved close to doing it, I believe the banks and the other credit card issuers would say they're going to cut off half the customers who have credit cards currently because they wouldn't be making enough money under a restricted, regulated interest rate.

Finance committee  Yes, I will. Our estimate is that consumers provide $200 million in annual costs to financial industry advocacy efforts. We are asking for three simple things. Yes, you can cap credit card interest rates, but you need an independent audit first, which should go back at least 10 years.

Industry committee  Yes, I will. Our estimate is that consumers provide $200 million in annual costs to financial industry advocacy efforts. We are asking for three simple things. Yes, you can cap credit card interest rates, but you need an independent audit first, which should go back at least 10 years.

Finance committee  Thank you, Mr. Chair. My name is Duff Conacher. I am the coordinator of Democracy Watch and chairperson of the Canadian Community Reinvestment Coalition. Thank you for the invitation to appear today on this very important topic, which essentially amounts to corporate responsibility and effective accountability measures in this area of access to credit, fair pricing, and the fair treatment of consumers across Canada.

Industry committee  Thank you, Mr. Chair. My name is Duff Conacher. I am the coordinator of Democracy Watch and chairperson of the Canadian Community Reinvestment Coalition. Thank you for the invitation to appear today on this very important topic, which essentially amounts to corporate responsibility and effective accountability measures in this area of access to credit, fair pricing, and the fair treatment of consumers across Canada.

Finance committee  The committee is missing two key pieces of information, and as a result, I don't think it can make any recommendations that would actually solve any of the problems we are raising, in reality. Those two key pieces of information are these: what does it actually cost the banks to provide all of their services and products versus the fee revenue from each of those services and products; and secondly, what is actually the level of competition?

Finance committee  You also need to look at the effects on competition and whether there actually is competition in many areas of the country for banking service providers that are providing services in the ways that Canadians want to bank. When you look at those, I think you will find monopolies and duopolies across the country for these essential services.

Finance committee  The lowering of one fee will just be replaced by the banks' adding a new fee or increasing other fees. The banks have said that, although the bank official who said that to The Globe and Mail did not want to be named. As a result, the only solution is to regulate the banks as providers of essential banking services--services as essential as heat and hydro and telephone for living in today's society--as other essential service companies are regulated.

Finance committee  Perhaps I could just say one other sentence. The overall solution is an audit, looking at what happened in the past 15 years and annually in the future. If that audit is not done, nothing that you recommend will protect consumers, nothing will hold the banks accountable, and the gouging will continue.

Finance committee  Thank you very much, Mr. Chairman and committee members, for this opportunity to present on this important topic, which may seem like small change to some people. Certainly the banks try to make everybody think that it's just about small change. But it's actually a very important issue, not only of consumer protection but also of bank accountability.

Finance committee  It is possible. It clears overnight.

Finance committee  That may come from a credit union from another province, for example.

Finance committee  But within the bank system, as far as we know, it's clearing.