Environment committee  Just to give you a sense, when we were looking at the costs more than a decade ago, on an annual basis, the cost in insured goods or assets per year after catastrophes and environmental disasters was an average of close to $500 million. We're more in the $2-billion range now, so when the minister uses the $2-billion figure, that's where it's from.

Environment committee  I will turn to John, who has been our specialist on this for years.

Environment committee  When the carbon pricing increases, 80% of people who receive more money than they pay through the tax will receive even more money. If you look at the numbers the minister presented, they increased compared to last year. Money doesn't stay in the government's pocket; it's sent back.

Environment committee  I don't do that. That's not the work I do. What I'm saying is that from a purely mathematical perspective, the money that comes from carbon pricing is going back to Canadians. It's going back to a redistribution that makes sure that people who are in worse conditions get more, people who are in rural areas get more and people who are in first nation, Inuit and Métis communities get more too.

Environment committee  The minister told you about the numbers from the.... I beg to disagree with the PBO on this. What can I tell you? As I said, I don't disagree with the Bank of Canada, which says carbon pricing has a very limited impact—I think it was 0.2% or 0.3%—on inflation.

Environment committee  We have a methodological issue with him. With the way he calculated it, if he doesn't take that into account.... I trust he is using the right numbers, but we would take into account the cost of climate change. It's the same thing when he doesn't take into account the investments from businesses to green their businesses or invest in clean energy, which also creates jobs and creates growth in the economy.

Environment committee  Let's say we would take that into account, because we are the Department of the Environment and we think the costs.... I've been the deputy minister of other departments and managed emergency issues. The costs of managing emergency issues have increased significantly in departments—

Environment committee  We can. We actually published our difference with the PBO at the time, so we can share it with the committee. As the minister said, it's not something new. It's something that's been said before, but we would be more than happy to share that.

Environment committee  I'm not sure I had the numbers for Regina. I spent a lot of time on the issues of the food banks when I was the deputy minister of ESDC, because that was part of the mandate. Like any Canadian, I'm quite concerned by this issue of affordability. I'm quite pleased to see that inflation is going down a bit.

Environment committee  I don't think the department is necessarily the one responsible to track those things. I would like them to track the indicators on the environment, which is their core responsibility, but they're aware and take it into consideration, of course. The rest of the departments do that too, on any measures we're taking, and the impacts on the rest of the population.

Environment committee  We don't have impacts, necessarily, on what happens with food banks. We have the Bank of Canada, which said that the impact of the carbon pricing on inflation was actually very, very small. Inflation is due to other factors that actually are way more significant than the carbon pricing.

Environment committee  We do work with other departments. The numbers the minister showed previously, for example, were from Finance. We work with Finance. We work with ESDC. We work with other departments. They analyze the impacts of all measures. When we go to cabinet, this information circulates among departments, and everybody has a chance to get in and talk about the impacts.

Environment committee  We have departments that are really science-based departments. Environment is one of them. There are committees among the departments that are really important and significant from a science perspective. We of course share a common agenda. Our scientists work together. We try to encourage them more and more to do that, even sometimes in sharing the same labs in the same place so that the ideas can come together and we can avoid duplication.

Public Accounts committee  I'll make a start and then give the floor to my friends from Natural Resources Canada, who are handling framework review management. To begin with, calculations pertaining to forests and their contribution in greenhouse gas emissions are complex. We acknowledge that. It's much more complicated to report on forests than on emissions from other sources.

Public Accounts committee  On the goal with the trees, it would probably be better for NRCan to respond, to be honest.