Environment committee  I find it a little bit strange and a little peculiar why we would be committing ourselves to something in the future, not knowing what that agreement will be, the Convention on Climate Change, and what those targets would be. Just on a personal basis, when I'm involved in some kind of agreement to buy an acreage, to buy whatever it happens to be, and then I'm making agreements that down the road there are these unforeseen, unknown things, whatever they happen to be, I'm agreeing to that too, and I don't have a clue what it is.

Environment committee  I'm unclear as to the focus of the amendment that Mr. Bigras has proposed. However, the United Nations Framework Convention on Climate Change does not itself include any specific targets, which has been mentioned. I'd like to remind Mr. Bigras that the ultimate objective of that convention is the stabilization of greenhouse gas emissions and concentrations in the atmosphere at a level that would prevent dangerous anthropogenic interference in the climate system.

Environment committee  All of them have in one fashion or another--this is directly on point to the parliamentary secretary's remarks, unless I'm missing something--agreed to common but differentiated responses to the climate change crisis in different timelines. Our own minister, your minister, went to Bali to launch the two-year negotiation round as contemplated perfectly in the Kyoto Protocol to bring annex 2 countries like India and China and others inside the tent, so that by 2012 they would have hard targets like the 36 annex 1 countries that are first off the mark.

Environment committee  I move that Bill C-377, in Clause 5, be amended by replacing line 8 on page 3 with the following: reduced, subject to the targets identified in the United Nations Framework Convention on Climate Change, It is important for our targets to be in line with those of the international communities. I realize that this amendment is debatable and I am open to considering a friendly amendment from the opposition or from the government.

Environment committee  Stern. He indicated that under a business-as-usual scenario, the cost of the impacts of climate change will be in the tens of trillions of dollars and will greatly exceed the cost of mitigating climate change in attempting to achieve as much greenhouse gas reduction as possible in the short term.

Environment committee  More importantly, I think the reason we focus on Kyoto per se as opposed to getting on with climate change is that it distracts us from getting on with solutions. Canada clearly has a very big challenge. We are an inherently energy- and GHG-intensive economy for many historical reasons.

Environment committee  Perhaps you could keep on the climate change issue. I don't find a lot of relevance in the War Measures Act in this one.

Environment committee  Chairman, to this committee that the real question is how to get China and India in. It's a matter of being pragmatic. We know that humanity will not be able to face climate change other than by adaptation if the major economies do not participate in limitations of emissions. We know that. So you start from there. How do we get there? I think the Bali process is indeed important, but at the same time it would be a huge mistake not to use the MEM process to go forward.

Environment committee  Secondly, on substance, for instance, Bali is considered a fairly positive contribution to the climate change process in the international community. Why? Because a major decision had to be taken on whether we go on two tracks, and what are on these two tracks to get to Copenhagen in 2009?

Environment committee  As well, I apologize, as I had my flights cancelled in northern British Columbia. It's all this climate change weather we're having. I have two questions. One is to Mr. Johnson, first of all. We met at the conference, and one of the questions we exchanged and had several conversations about was this credibility gap that's been developing on the international stage for Canada.

Environment committee  I guess that's pretty much at the heart of the issue: either we think climate change is important, or it isn't. I happen to believe it is. It's also my perception that the minister believes it is. He has stated and reiterated in front of us, and I believe publicly, that he accepts the science of the IPCC.

Environment committee  McGuinty earlier, my expertise on the public policy side has been more related to activities within the province of Ontario and the climate change action plan process that was set up in the late 1990s. But it was a few years ago that I was involved in those processes.

Environment committee  My problem is the perception—and I certainly won't ask you about what you personally spoke of with Mr. Baird on these issues—that the government is not fully convinced that climate change is a result of human activity or that we actually have a role to play in it. You had talked about these very good, professional people on the team you were with and of trying to convince him otherwise.

Environment committee  Well, I think many of our negotiators who work with the international climate change bureau at Environment Canada have been involved with the negotiations since the beginning and have both the historical knowledge and expertise to provide counsel to the government with regard to the various aspects of negotiating specific elements, be they technology transfer, adaptation, or other areas in which Canada can play a very constructive role in moving forward.

Environment committee  Did you advise the government to highlight the reference to the 2°C increase in the body of the Bali document, instead of in a footnote, out of respect for the report of the intergovernmental panel on climate change?