Government Operations committee  There was no company associated with the second option.

Government Operations committee  Thank you for the question. I don't know how many employees Deloitte has. I know it is a multinational. I was not referring to the number of employees, but the way—

Government Operations committee  I gave you my quick math depending on rates. We are not privy to the rates that these companies charge, etc.

Government Operations committee  In watching these appearances, I heard them say that their typical rates are between 15% and 30%. I did the math of 15% to 30% of $11 million. That is not a factual statement of mine. That is what I heard them say. I do not know what rates they charge, and the rates change depending on which subcontractor they deal with.

Government Operations committee  The allegations around a CV changing.... I'm not part of any of those investigations and can't speak to that. In terms of the subcontracting model, this exists everywhere. It exists in the private sector, the construction business and others. It is a model that is common—

Government Operations committee  For ArriveCAN, we needed access very quickly, as I said, to many different types of skills, such as cybersecurity and others, that we didn't necessarily have at the agency.

Government Operations committee  The Government of Canada is working very actively to increase our IT skills and resources, but we're in very hard competition with the private sector, which offers much more generous compensation packages for skills in cloud, artificial intelligence and others. The other reality is that it takes the government a long time to hire somebody from the outside, so—

Government Operations committee  From what I've heard in these committee appearances, there were no allegations in 2021 raised by Botler. Mr. Utano spoke to this. There was a contracting dispute. PSPC was engaged, and the issue was resolved, from what I understand, fairly quickly. The allegations of wrongdoing by Botler surfaced in November 2022—

Government Operations committee  I did not have a relationship with Mr. Firth either prior to it or after it.

Government Operations committee  No, I do not.

Government Operations committee  As I've said a few times, the decision to go in the technical direction that led to GC Strategies was mine. I'm accountable for it. I still do not know who picked up the phone and asked them to solicit a bid in the first place. I believe the CBSA is investigating this matter.

Government Operations committee  Thank you for the opportunity. I think people need to understand that I'm not making this up in terms of what we were living at the time. On March 11, the World Health Organization called a global pandemic. Five days later, the government sent most of its employees home. At the same time, we closed our borders internationally.

Government Operations committee  Yes, that's right.

Government Operations committee  Yes, that's right.

Government Operations committee  Those multinationals have the necessary experience and expertise to take on huge projects. Typically, a company such as Deloitte would not be chosen to develop an $80,000 application.