National Defence committee  That's absolutely a lie. I'm not sure what you're referring to, but I've never, ever changed my opinion on sole-sourcing, or anything--if he's talking about me. I have no idea what he's referring to. I would defend my integrity totally. I have never changed my views on these things.

National Defence committee  Then I have no idea to what he's referring or who gave him what notes to suggest and actually impugn my integrity. But I take great offence at that.

National Defence committee  I agree totally. That's what I said. The first step has to be to make sure that you have a policy framework for the role that we as Canadians see for the Department of National Defence, and then to make sure that all of the equipment we buy, for the army and the navy too, fits into the role that we've articulated.

National Defence committee  I don't know. As I said, back in 2004 I know that 8.8% of the time it was sole-source money, but I can't comment beyond that.

National Defence committee  I've no idea. But I'll tell you one thing. It is partly because of spending five years in the Department of Public Works, which is in fact the arm responsible for the integrity of the process, that I became so focused on that. I had a special organization set up to make sure that there were never....

National Defence committee  I would be. I'm not sure what they were for. They must have been fairly small amounts of money, because as I said, it was only 8.8 cents on the dollar of the total value.

National Defence committee  Well, maybe. I would argue that in the last five years we have spent $40 billion on sole-sourcing. Sorry to disagree with you. I would like to see those figures—it's easy to quote them, I guess—any time.

National Defence committee  I'm not so sure what that has to do with anything.

National Defence committee  I'd like to answer one thing. You talked about sole-sourcing. The biggest deal I know of that would have been sole-sourced was $3 billion for NATO flying training. That issue came up on February 17, 2000, at the standing committee when I appeared before it, along with the Auditor General.

National Defence committee  The issue was sole-sourcing of the NATO flying training. I'll make my comment, and then I'll get to Denis Desautels' response to it. There's probably nobody around more committed to trying to undertake competitive procurement than I am. Both this position and my previous one were as accountable for them.

National Defence committee  Okay, all I'm saying is--

National Defence committee  That's exactly right. It was agreed to by the Auditor General, by the way, at the end.

National Defence committee  Okay. I still stand by my record of 8.8% as opposed to 42.1% of dollars.

National Defence committee  Well, what?

National Defence committee  It is eight percent of dollars. If the government sole-sourced a lot of procurements for $30,000 and $35,000, that's a big difference, in terms of the overall money being spent, from 42 cents on the dollar.