Transport committee  I'll just add that there are multiple factors that attract and retain people. Money is one of them, as the Teamsters recognize, as are different shift schedules. Many fleets are doing it, but the more flexible you get.... For example, some fleets that do long haul—and what I mean by long haul is Winnipeg, Texas, Toronto, Los Angeles—are saying it's one week on, one week off.

Transport committee  I'm not trying to avoid the question, but to be honest I'm not clear where we're going with this question. The reality is that fuel has gone up. There's a separate system for how fuel is captured, and there's costing of the carrier system, including labour.

Transport committee  A lot of us have talked about drivers, and it's the number one concern, as we've said, because the issue here is that if we don't have a driver, the truck doesn't move and the freight doesn't move. We've all said that, and that is the reality. Perhaps one—I wouldn't necessarily say that it's under the radar in our sector, but it's perhaps not talked about enough—is heavy-duty mechanics.

Transport committee  In terms of going to the underground economy, it's all age groups. Yes, we have the oldest age group, the largest percentage of employees over the age of 55 in the drivers' community, and that's contributing to people exiting the industry faster than in other sectors. With regard to the specific reference you're making to the TruckingHR Canada report, what you're seeing there is a big percentage of those drivers leaving those labour-compliant companies and going to the underground economy.

Transport committee  Technology isn't going to replace truck drivers. It's the driver-assist technology that's going to make truckers safe. The truck technology is by no means remotely close to dealing with the driver shortage. It's simply not. It's going to make us safer. It might attract more people, because the trucks will be safer to drive.

Transport committee  People leave a profession for all types of reasons. One is retirement, and I mentioned that in my earlier comments. The other is the major reason people are leaving trucking companies. I'm very familiar with TruckingHR Canada and who they survey. Many of them are on my board and throughout boards across Canada.

Transport committee  I don't think the issue here is about technology per se. We're looking at technology this way: Driver-assist technology is making trucks safer in terms of the truck itself, the vehicle. If you are aware of how to use that vehicle in a safe manner and have been given proper training and proper onboarding, we can move the economy more safely.

Transport committee  Mr. Chair, is that question for CTA or for the panel?

Transport committee  Sure. Currently, the trucking industry has zero access to training dollars other than through what I'll refer to as, and I'm not trying to belittle them, more one-off programs. We would like to see almost an apprenticeship-like program, whereby once an individual goes through the mandatory entry-level training in our industry, they have the ability to drive either a straight truck, as we call it in our industry, or a tractor-trailer.

Transport committee  I'll jump in. I want to applaud Minister Fraser, who's already made a significant announcement. The change isn't in place, but the trucking industry, specifically the truck driver, will become part of the express entry program. That was a significant change and a significant announcement.

Transport committee  Really, sometimes life is more complicated, and sometimes it is really easy. In this one, CRA needs to enforce the laws that are currently on the books. There is no legislation required. From a CRA perspective, enforce the laws on the books. From an ESDC perspective, ESDC is out in the field.

Transport committee  As an alliance, we really haven't looked at that aspect from the Government of Canada. Other provincial associations may advocate down that avenue. Our board hasn't examined that particular issue. I can assure you that driver pay has gone up over 20% to 30% over the last two years.

Transport committee  Absolutely. We are strong advocates and supporters with regard to this particular issue, and I'm glad you asked the question. We believe that whether it's training dollars for people who are Canadian citizens currently going through programs or for people who are new to Canada coming through various immigration programs, we need programs for trucking companies, but we want them screened.

Transport committee  Sure. It's referred to as a personal services business. It's a technical term for what is really a misclassification scam. It allows trucking companies to organize drivers.... It's not allowed now, but they misclassify them so as not to pay them overtime or give them holiday pay and severance.

Transport committee  The most recent projection we have with regard to the driver shortage goes out two years, and that estimate is 50,000 people short. What that really means—I say it again—is that 50,000 trucks are needed in the supply chain. They aren't moving, and they aren't moving customers' goods, whether across the U.S.