Veterans Affairs committee  I don't know that it would be the same amount, but it very well could be. What the fees would be depend on if they're going into a condominium. Veterans Affairs, under the veterans independence program, would pay whatever the costs are to the individual. In places where it's included in the cost of the overall logement, it's going to be a little difficult to determine.

Veterans Affairs committee  I don't know. I can't comment on what National Defence does or does not do. They'll have to speak for themselves.

Veterans Affairs committee  If there is a specific or a general problem with the acceptance of professional advice and guidance, there's no reason that I know of why that should be, sir. If it's on an individual case basis, we'll have to deal with that.

Veterans Affairs committee  Thank you, Madam, and thank you for your kind words. They are very well appreciated.

Veterans Affairs committee  As I mentioned in the opening comments, I think you'll find a very rich ground for comparison by looking at the G-8 benefits and those of the Commonwealth. I'd like to think we've borrowed the best from at least the Commonwealth countries we've talked to, and they from us. One example I gave is the case management system, which is New Zealand.

Veterans Affairs committee  Mr. Chair, I'll finish up in about 90 seconds. The glue that holds the programs together, be it the veterans independence program or the rehabilitation program in the new veterans charter, is a case management service, which Veterans Affairs has been offering since 1946 in one form or another.

Veterans Affairs committee  Thank you very much, Mr. Chair and members of the committee. Ken Miller and I will divide this up. I'll do the easy part; he'll do the hard part. This is meant to be sort of VAC 101, in aid of your comparative study of Commonwealth and G-8 services and benefits. Before I begin the presentation--and it's been handed out to you--for what it's worth, I think this is a very important study or undertaking from the public service point of view.

Veterans Affairs committee  The 20% vacancy rate isn't everywhere. There is a bit of a challenge in Ottawa, as some of you will know, and there's a challenge in New Brunswick that we're looking at.

Veterans Affairs committee  Palliative care can be provided in our contract beds.

Veterans Affairs committee  We don't have specific hospice settings for veterans, but we can provide that kind of support for individuals who go into palliative care under the veterans independence program. We also provide palliative care support in the home, which is quite unusual in the Canadian health care system.

Veterans Affairs committee  Thank you very much, on behalf of Ken Miller and myself.

Veterans Affairs committee  Yes, they did. One of the individuals who is on there is probably one of the foremost researchers on family caregiving in the country, if not North America. That's Professor Norah Keating from the Centre of Human Ecology at the University of Alberta. She's a very gentle and kind individual and she made her views on this subject very well known.

Veterans Affairs committee  I don't know whether Norah appeared before your committee or not.

Veterans Affairs committee  We'll see if we can get an extract from her and send it to you, sir. How's that?

Veterans Affairs committee  I can't really speculate on that, but if we were to ask any ten veterans who are now eligible for long-term care in our own contract beds in larger centres where they would like to go, seven of the ten would say they'd like to stay in their own communities.