Agriculture committee  —but when you look at the facts, for some reason the Americans get some of these markets and we don't. So I'm not quite sure how to answer that question.

Agriculture committee  I think that's why I called it a “trade” issue when I did my presentation.

Agriculture committee  And you're right.

Agriculture committee  I think the disadvantage for Manitoba is that, as a rule, it costs more to keep a cow in Manitoba than it does in Alberta or Saskatchewan. With our climate, we have snow—

Agriculture committee  Yes. We definitely have a problem in the cow-calf industry in Canada, not just in Manitoba. We've lost, I believe, 700 producers in the last year or year and a half. The problem is that everybody got hit so hard in the first three years of BSE--this year was a little better—and lost so much equity that they now don't have the equity to move ahead.

Agriculture committee  Another aspect, if you would just allow me, is that the reason some of these guys are in trouble is that the older cows weren't worth too much, and the herds got older. Now we're sliding into where you can't turn around or get back into it because your cattle are old.

Agriculture committee  We call them cull cattle, in the cattle industry. The older cattle are usually from 12% to 15% of the gross income on any cattle ranch. For example, before the BSE situation, I sold a bull, a mature cull bull, for $1,830 on May 2. In July I sold another bull, and he brought $261.

Agriculture committee  Right. I guess an easy explanation is that it used to be, when you sold the cull cow, that the cow would pay to feed the heifer to become a cow. But when you face a cash crunch temporarily in the cattle industry, you sell what you have to in order to pay the bills. So what guys have done is they've sold the younger cattle.

Agriculture committee  The fact is that we aren't sure if it will. It's one of those things where if you don't try it, you won't know. There are many people who think it will, and it should—

Agriculture committee  I think I alluded to it in my statements, that if there is a disaster component, it has to be something that can be done within months, not six months later or a year later, in order to keep the confidence in the industry. As you well know, in the feedlot industry—and that really is the driving force in our industry, the feedlots—massive amounts of money are borrowed every day, and lost, and made every day.

Agriculture committee  Going back to the question on SRM removals, the perception is that it will help us.

Agriculture committee  I'd just like to say something about the concern we have with insurance for the cattle industry. Right after the BSE situation, the feedlots were getting $320 for an animal that cost $1,400 to produce, and this type of thing. There has to be some type of insurance that would look after those situations.

Agriculture committee  I'd just like to add that the ethanol and biodiesel industry is a good industry to get into for the grain growers at this time, but I think feedstocks in the near future will change for ethanol and biodiesel, so we're talking about a short-term, temporary feedstock here for ethanol and biodiesel.

Agriculture committee  Thank you, Mr. Chairman and members of the standing committee, for visiting Manitoba to discuss the agricultural policy framework and future farm programs. My name is Martin Unrau, and I'm the president of the Manitoba Cattle Producers Association, which represents approximately 10,000 producers in various aspects of the beef industry, including cow-calf, backgrounding, and finishing.