Subcommittee on Neurological Disease committee  Yes, there were studies in Sweden and Germany that actually showed very different--as, Kirsty, you know--results from those of Dr. Zamboni. Actually, essentially, they found no difference between the venous anatomy of patients with MS and that of normal controls.

Subcommittee on Neurological Disease committee  I don't remember. I don't want to venture a number. I'm not good at remembering numbers. I can't remember my phone number, so I won't go there. But that's why we're doing these studies. When you have a controversy like this, and you have one group finding one thing and another

Subcommittee on Neurological Disease committee  Sorry, it's a bit technical.

Subcommittee on Neurological Disease committee  It's very clear. The risk of not waiting for the signs is subjecting patients to a treatment that is not innocuous--and we have proof of this--and that could have a number of complications, without having the proof that we're actually improving their condition. Some of these comp

Subcommittee on Neurological Disease committee  By and large, it's really the position of most MS societies. And it is certainly the position of the U.S. and the Canadian MS society. The German MS society had a very harsh statement. On the other hand, the international MS society had a more balanced statement, stating the impo

Subcommittee on Neurological Disease committee  I think this is an important point. First of all, Dr. Zamboni was originally part of the very large association studies that involved I think around 20 sites in Italy, and he withdrew from the study. The scientific director of the Italian MS Society told us that he withdrew becau

Subcommittee on Neurological Disease committee  I will inform the deputy ministers of this message on Thursday when I meet with them to debrief them about the working group, because I think it's a key message. It's one of the key messages. The other one is that it is not a very safe procedure, as we are starting to realize.

Subcommittee on Neurological Disease committee  The opening of the veins and either the angioplasty or the insertion of a stent.

Subcommittee on Neurological Disease committee  Yes.

Subcommittee on Neurological Disease committee  At CIHR—and we're certainly not the sole investors in MS research—we've invested $49 million in the past 10 years in MS-related research.

Subcommittee on Neurological Disease committee  Right now, $2.4 million has been the total amount invested by the Canadian and U.S. MS societies in the seven projects looking at the association.

Subcommittee on Neurological Disease committee  No, no, it's actually to do the research. That money is actually to do the research.

Subcommittee on Neurological Disease committee  Oh, yes, they're all clinical trials.

Subcommittee on Neurological Disease committee  There are seven clinical trials going on.

Subcommittee on Neurological Disease committee  It all depends. We're talking of several hundred patients altogether, for sure. The number of patients varies between the studies. I couldn't tell you the exact number of patients.