Health committee  Manitoba has those statistics. I thought I brought them, but I don't think I did.

Health committee  The federal government produces statistics that talk about status Indians, non-status Indians, Métis, Inuit, and that's the way it's divided. That's because in provinces, those aboriginals not on reserve are counted as part of the provincial total as opposed to aboriginal totals, unless they have two addresses, which many people do.

Health committee  I'll say something Pam would say. Theoretically, yes, the treatment is known. TB is curable, and 98% of people who take their medication will be cured, everything else aside. If you give treatment to people who were contacts, positive tuberculin reactors, and they take their medication, they will not get tuberculosis in the future.

Health committee  It's a jurisdictional problem. The federal government--I don't think--comes to the Province of Manitoba and says, “I'm going to do this in Lac Brochet”, without consultation, at least, with the provincial program.

Health committee  Yes, I would. I agree with you, but the fact of the matter is that when I was director of Manitoba, we had regular meetings with FNIHB, the province, and everybody. And that's the way the program ran. Right now in Manitoba it's fragmented to a bunch of different agencies and/or regions.

Health committee  I go back to what I said previously: each province has to have a vertical tuberculosis control program. This is frowned on by some people in public health. It isn't to say that the director of tuberculosis control is a world unto him or herself, and in fact they should be responsible to the chief medical officer, but the tuberculosis control program in each province must be single, vertical.

Health committee  Yes. One of the problems in Canada is that we do not have a national TB program. We have provincial programs that can do as they like at any time, but we do not have a national program. That's the trouble in trying to compare Canada with other countries. One of the things that I would hope would come out of a committee like this is that there should be a national program.

Health committee  There isn't a vacancy, but the director of tuberculosis control happens to be the chief medical officer, who has 117 other jobs to do. So there isn't a tuberculosis control program as such with a head. That's what the problem is, as I see it, in Manitoba. The other problem in Manitoba with respect to FNIHB is that they have abdicated their responsibility by contracting out the services on reserve to the Winnipeg Regional Health Authority.

Health committee  Thank you, Madam Chair. For me, this is a reminder of what Yogi Berra said, “It's déjà vu all over again.” I've been to a number of these meetings over the years. What I want to talk briefly about is what I consider a proper tuberculosis control program. We can discuss later whether it is being applied across the country.

Health committee  I have one more statement, if I might.

Health committee  Too rapid a diminution or discontinuation of a public health program often leads to resurgence of the problem that appeared to be under control. It's a public health maxim and it has been shown in the literature over and over again. If you dismantle a program—