Natural Resources committee  We would love to see an energy policy whereby you could force the big oil companies to build a refinery around.... Say, if they had three mines, they would have to have one refinery; if they have two mines, they would have to have an upgrader. I don't know; that's your bailiwick,

Natural Resources committee  Miles ahead of them.

Natural Resources committee  No, none of our guys, or none that I know of, are heading to the United States. We're importing Americans. Regarding trades training, the Canadian system is miles ahead of the American's. I shouldn't say that because those people pay me, but that's the way it is. That's the tru

Natural Resources committee  Yes, if you had five welders.

Natural Resources committee  We're accelerating our welder program because we know that we're low on welders. We've neglected it for far too long. It still takes three years to produce a top-quality alloy welder. In the time that it takes us to get those people up, we're going to have to use some temporary f

Natural Resources committee  I don't think we can train enough to look after what's in front of us now. I also think there is some work to be done within the industry. I think that if we could get the oil companies to stagger shutdowns and expansions, we could utilize the workforce. Unfortunately, everything

Natural Resources committee  There's no doubt that there is a tremendous workforce in the aboriginal communities. It's not being utilized.

Natural Resources committee  I think you had two questions there. First of all, the training grants that are out there are very important to us. You know, 15 or 20 years ago every apprentice who came to us was 18 years of age, right out of high school. We're having 27-, 28-, 30-year old apprentices now with

Natural Resources committee  Zero in on the specific trades—don't use the shotgun effect. They've got to zero in on where the shortages are. I would say that the most TFWs right now for such a small workforce are in heavy equipment operation. We need heavy equipment operators in this country, and you can tur

Natural Resources committee  You can phase out the temporary foreign workers.

Natural Resources committee  If you looked at jobs in Alberta right now, they're desperately in need of welders. We don't have any more in Canada; we're tapped. If we got five welders from the United States—and that's where we're going now—on a job site, two Canadian pipefitters are going to go to work for e

Natural Resources committee  At the Edmonton West upgrade at Scotford, my particular trade had 4,000 people on the job. That job lasted for over three years. It was a 12,000-person job. That's an upgrader.

Natural Resources committee  It was a three-year project.

Natural Resources committee  The Irving Oil refinery every day has about 185 of my guys working. You can sort of figure the size of Irving Oil.

Natural Resources committee  Oh, they're forever.