Subcommittee on International Human Rights committee  Thank you very much, Mr. Chairman. I pay my respects again to the Parliament and to the people of Canada for the support that Canada gave to the work of the commission of inquiry.

Subcommittee on International Human Rights committee  This would take me into areas in which I am not an expert, but I think it's a legitimate question. It's a little bit analogous to the issue of trafficking and those who take advantage of the escapees. It's also analogous to the quite significant and increasing numbers of North Korean workers who go into neighbouring countries to work—and sometimes distant countries, like Gulf countries, to do particular jobs—and get only a small fraction of the money that is paid to the Government of North Korea for the work they perform.

Subcommittee on International Human Rights committee  I can't comment in any way disrespectfully of the Republic of Korea, or South Korea. South Korea has absorbed 27,000 to 28,000 refugees. It gives them a passport. They are entitled to citizenship under the constitution of the Republic of Korea, because South Korea asserts that it is the legitimate government of the Korean peninsula.

Subcommittee on International Human Rights committee  It's true that the economy in North Korea has, to some extent, been stimulated by areas that are often on the border, especially the border with China, which allow joint projects. The Economist magazine last week reported that the economy of North Korea grew by 7% last year. Whether or not that's true, it certainly has improved.

Subcommittee on International Human Rights committee  It is true that the escape lines have been made more difficult in recent times. The usual mode of escape was across the rivers in the north of the Korean Peninsula during the winter when the rivers froze over. But one of the duties that was assigned to Kim Jong-un by his father during his father's lifetime was to go up to the border area.

Subcommittee on International Human Rights committee  First of all, Professor Cotler, I pay my respects to you. In our respective earlier lives, you as an academic and me as a practising judge, we met on a number of occasions and I'm most respectful of your question. I think the answer I would give is the answer I gave when I was asked a very similar question in the General Assembly: what can we do?

Subcommittee on International Human Rights committee  Not at all. In fact, we made statements so that it didn't affect it. Mr. Shin, in the manner of the North American media, was created a kind of poster boy and sort of celebrity. This tends to happen in some parts of the world, but so far as the commission of inquiry was concerned, he was just another witness.

Subcommittee on International Human Rights committee  My father would be pleased.

Subcommittee on International Human Rights committee  The best-case scenario for securing accountability would be for the case of North Korea to be referred by the Security Council of the United Nations, with it exceptionally exercising jurisdiction under the Rome statute, which sets up the International Criminal Court, to refer the file of North Korea to a prosecutor of the International Criminal Court.

Subcommittee on International Human Rights committee  Most of the countries that voted “no” in the Human Rights Council and the General Assembly, and even in the Security Council, took no issue with the content of the report of the commission of inquiry. They objected, as they put it, to specific-nation inquiries. They said that had been the fault of the former Human Rights Commission and that in establishing the Human Rights Council, with the procedure of universal periodic review, the way forward in international pursuit of human rights was not finger-wagging or naming-and-shaming, but engagement and mutual criticism of each other, and that view was expressed by countries such as Cuba, the Russian Federation, China, and so on.

Subcommittee on International Human Rights committee  There have been cases of violence from North Korean sources reported in South Korea; however, that is not the source of the problem. The source of the problem is that if families can be linked to people who are friendly to the Republic of Korea, it is definitely not a good development from the point of view of the family left in North Korea.

Subcommittee on International Human Rights committee  First of all, in relation to regime collapse or regime change, please keep in mind that we were officers of the United Nations. North Korea, DPRK, is a member of the United Nations. It has signed the Charter of the United Nations, with its strong commitments to peace and security, economic equity, and universal human rights.

Subcommittee on International Human Rights committee  Thank you for that question. There were very high hopes with the arrival of the new supreme leader, Kim Jong-un, that the position in North Korea would improve. He was a young man. He'd had education in Europe. He was said to be interested in digital technology and modern celebrities.

Subcommittee on International Human Rights committee  Thank you very much, Chair. I offer my respects to the Parliament of Canada. It's a great privilege for an Australian and a former Australian judge to come here and to be in the House of the people and in the presence of elected members of Parliament. This is a privilege that Canada has and that Australia also enjoys, which is a great historical tradition that, sadly, the people of North Korea do not enjoy.