Human Resources committee  For the PSSSP, the post-secondary student support program, we believe it supports around 23,000 students. The program is delivered by the communities, and we don't have perfect data. It's too imperfect to know exactly how many students it supports, but our information tells us it

Human Resources committee  For PSPP, the post-secondary partnerships program, the annual amount is $15 million.

Human Resources committee  That's very hard for us to estimate, because we don't know how many students would be, I'll say, rejected, or not able to access it. We have very anecdotal information. We don't have a solid piece of data around how many students are not accessing it. We know there is a backlog.

Human Resources committee  It isn't being compiled in one place. The Assembly of First Nations has done some work in the past, from which they have said it's around 10,000 students, but I suspect it's probably higher.

Human Resources committee  We do need more data, absolutely. It's something that should be tracked. It's a very dispersed program, and it's difficult to know who has asked and has not received, because it's difficult to collect that.

Human Resources committee  I will say that we are working very closely with the ESDC to make sure that we don't create perverse disincentives, that students can access post-secondary student support as well as a Canada student loan or grant. Right now the programs don't work seamlessly together, but we are

Human Resources committee  That's for post-secondary.

Human Resources committee  Again, it depends. Because the communities deliver it themselves, they determine the amount. It could be they might pay the full cost of education for that person to go through—

Human Resources committee  I don't think we have that. We don't ask communities how much they pay for each student. Some may pay for everything, including all the wraparound services, such as child care, transportation—

Human Resources committee  It's given to communities based on a formula and on the potential number of students, but we don't know if they're augmenting that. We don't know how many students ultimately they may be supporting, so that is the challenge. We don't have data to be able to make—

Human Resources committee  We don't know how much the individual student is getting. We don't know that. We have some basic statistical information about graduation rates from universities by indigenous students.

Human Resources committee  We can get the graduation rate for indigenous students.

Human Resources committee  I will just have to see if I can find it.

Human Resources committee  We'll have to get back to you in writing. I don't have it with me.

Human Resources committee  Yes, thank you, there are other ways, and what I failed to mention in my earlier comments was that we also fund Indspire, which is a charitable organization that provides bursaries to indigenous students in post-secondary education. It receives funding from a number of partners—t