Canadian Heritage committee  I think so. We don't hold copyright in works; we contract with authors who hold the copyright. It's our job to step out and make money with it. There are authors for whom we act, and we're always conscious of that. The question of income is, for us, so that we have to keep runni

Canadian Heritage committee  I might say quickly that income from educational markets for our company was a small piece of the pie. We're present in a number of different markets. It was a pillar of income for us, to run our business, so the removal of that income is not going to take down our company—we're

Canadian Heritage committee  Most certainly. It weakens—

Canadian Heritage committee  Sure. What I meant by that was a mechanism whereby certain uses of material could be paid for, I guess, and we could collect for that. If I understand your question, were you asking what the events were that might have changed that?

Canadian Heritage committee  I think the reduction in income for us was as a result of the educators choosing to stop paying. To Mr. Katz's point earlier, nobody was telling us that they were going to stop using our material. We had very detailed reports from Access Copyright about the use in the classroom

Canadian Heritage committee  I think as a model for artist remuneration, collective licensing is a very good one. It's an efficient way, I think, of supplying the educational marketplace with material that is useful and that will be used and reused. The principle of payment for use comes back via that collec

Canadian Heritage committee  CANCOPY is what Access Copyright used to be called.

Canadian Heritage committee  Yes, that's right. Our company had a licence with them.

Canadian Heritage committee  The direct contacts I mentioned were usually from educators. If a school wanted to use material in a way that was not covered by the licence they had with the collective, such as using more than a certain percentage of the book, then they could check with us as the rights holder.

Canadian Heritage committee  I would hazard that it's not to the same extent as some educational publishers who might have come to speak with you. We are a general trade publisher. We're present in many different markets. We're not heavily present in the educational market. Our exposure financially is less t

Canadian Heritage committee  Yes. Thank you, Madame Chair. Good morning, everyone. Thank you for having us here. I'm Matt Williams, vice-president at House of Anansi Press/Groundwood Books in Toronto. We are an independent trade publisher, and we publish books for readers of all ages. Anansi is now over