Veterans Affairs committee  No. To give you a little bit of history, in March of 2020 we had 34 term case managers and 455 indeterminate case managers. As of August 30 of this year, we have 53 term and 441 indeterminate, which means that there have been 14 indeterminate positions lost there.

Veterans Affairs committee  No.

Veterans Affairs committee  There is stuff being worked on currently in the collective bargaining process, but not specific to this, no.

Veterans Affairs committee  It would absolutely be less than what this contract is costing the Canadian public, absolutely.

Veterans Affairs committee  We haven't done a full analysis. I have done some. In terms of looking at the promise of the 25 to one ratio, we would need at least 700 case managers to meet the 25 to one ratio that's been promised since 2015.

Veterans Affairs committee  I've submitted three official letters to him that I know off by heart. There might have been five, but there were three for sure.

Veterans Affairs committee  No.

Veterans Affairs committee  The case managers absolutely feel that way, yes. We feel and support them in their concerns. That's why we want to speak to the minister. He's just not willing to meet.

Veterans Affairs committee  We have to remember that some of our case managers are veterans as well. They're seeing this from both sides of the field. That's another concerning piece.

Veterans Affairs committee  Right now that's the average. We've had case managers count their cases, because the department will state that they have a 30 to one ratio. Case managers are carrying a minimum of 40, and some of them have as many as 60 in their caseloads.

Veterans Affairs committee  Permanent funding is key. Having this temporary stopgap funding is not helping. We need to hire more case managers in house. Having that $100 million would easily provide the ability to hire more case managers and retain them in house.

Veterans Affairs committee  We don't know the exact profit margin, but we have sort of calculated it out. We estimate that it's going to cost about 25% more to have this contractor on board than it is to hire more case managers.

Veterans Affairs committee  No, and the contractor will be doing their own quality assurance. It is really concerning when you have a contractor doing the quality assurance of their own work. I don't see—

Veterans Affairs committee  They have the quality assurance. We have documentation from the department, from one of the town halls, that specifically states that the contractor “will oversee the service delivery to ensure adherence to the contract requirements, accountability and service excellence.” This i

Veterans Affairs committee  Yes, they are.