Industry committee  Work remains to be done.

Industry committee  Bell is able to cut its rates, but it cannot do so selectively, meaning only in areas that it shares with its competitors Videotron and Cogeco. Your question is valid with regard to those areas. I couldn't say, but I can tell you that, according to Mr. McTeague, Bell may increase its prices.

Industry committee  I can't give you an answer, but I'll give you two answers. I'll try to make it short. One point of view--from a rural operator who has 4,000 to 12,000 customers and competes with Telus, SaskTel, Bell Canada, or Aliant--is why would I invest to bring my network and organization up to the capacity where I can offer voice-over-Internet protocol when, under the minister's proposed order in council, Bell Canada, Aliant, or SaskTel, my incumbent competitor, is immediately forborne and can immediately compete, targeting my customers?

Industry committee  Following the important process that I described earlier, the CRTC had a very lively internal debate.

Industry committee  Very lively in the sense of very active, very intense.

Industry committee  The CRTC ultimately decided to interpret the sections of the legislation, including the one you referred to, in the manner recommended in the decision on the absence of regulations. Furthermore, did the commission believe at that time that this was the only possible interpretation?

Industry committee  I can only give you the breakdown in terms of the voice-over-Internet product. And let's be clear that we're talking about five companies--Cogeco, Vidéotron, Rogers, Shaw, and EastLink. EastLink's product is not a voice-over-Internet product, but it has a very high competitive market share.

Industry committee  I haven't been directly involved in those discussions, but you'll be hearing from Sheridan Scott, and I think she's probably in the best position to give you the response. From our point of view, it's been extremely educational, because we've been able to access a lot of competition economics expertise that we didn't have ourselves, and that's been very helpful.

Industry committee  Mr. Shipley, I want to say first that the interpretation of our act suggests that we do not have, in relation to telecommunication rates and services--and John will correct me if I'm wrong--the option of saying let's wait and see what happens. We have, in fact, an ex ante regime in our act.

Industry committee  I'm sorry, could you help me with that?

Industry committee  Here's the counterintuitive reality: Nowhere in the world has competition in a former monopoly telecom system--and they were all former monopoly telecom systems--ever occurred without policy initiatives to foster that competition in the early stages. The discussion and debate right now are on how soon you walk away from those pro-competitive initiatives.

Industry committee  Mr. Masse, I can well imagine how you can't imagine it's revenue neutral, but believe me, it's something that we do in our industry regularly, and I don't claim to you that we get it to one dollar, totally, precisely. The real issue here, to be honest with you, is that people who don't move are going to be subsidizing people who move often.

Industry committee  Mr. McTeague, you're referring to the proposed order in council. There are basically two tests, but it's clear that the one test is the one that constitutes the body of the innovation. Basically, that test says that where there are three facilities-based telecommunication providers, including one mobile wireless provider, which are independently owned and which offer residential local exchange services throughout the market, then that market can be forborne.

Industry committee  Yes. With the greatest respect, the market is not a market for stand-alone services. More and more, the market is a market of packaged services. So what I want to do is this. I want to get cable, I want to get high-speed Internet, I want to get my television, and possibly my wireless from the same company.

Industry committee  I'm not here to support either. I'm trying to provide you with as many facts as I can, and I don't wish to try to persuade you of the validity of one point or another.