Natural Resources committee  Typically, homes right now are built at around an EnerGuide 72 or 68 range. The province is suggesting that they get to 80. The Province of Ontario is suggesting that they'll be at EnerGuide 80 in a short period of time, by 2011 or 2012, I think at this point. My only opinion about the role of the code is that the code brings everybody onto a level playing field.

Natural Resources committee  Well, it's of all governments, if you were speaking specifically of the federal government. I go back to a principle of what we were about and what we came to be about. It is that it requires a paradigm shift in the policy, in the way we view energy produced in this nation. We tend to look at the residential or the built environment as a consumer-only issue: how to reduce the consumption.

Natural Resources committee  I most certainly do. First of all, if I've given any impression that I was critical of the industry, that was not my intent. Frankly, it's quite the opposite. You're right, Canadian homebuilders have been among the best in the world in building safe, healthy homes. As for R-2000, I'll speak to that point, because it helps illustrate some of the challenges.

Natural Resources committee  Sure. Mr. Trost, I would say to you regarding the quality of life that it goes into lower operating costs for the homeowners and how they can manage those costs more effectively if they have lower operating costs from energy use and the utility side. It's also healthier living.

Natural Resources committee  The United States has already targeted 2020 as where they want to see 70% to 80% energy reduction in their homes, which is effectively net-zero timelines and targets. I would say we're that far away. But I don't like to suggest that's where we have to look to right now. The vision is important, but nothing prevents where we are going to be in the very near future.

Natural Resources committee  That's what I'm trying to get to. That's the stepped approach we're aiming for.

Natural Resources committee  I would agree that the code is an important tool to move the builders along the green building continuum. That's important. The codes are designed right now for the lowest common denominator—the laggards, if you will. Codes should be designed to help provide a pathway to a better place and incrementally grow and bring everybody along with them.

Natural Resources committee  You're asking the coalition, and I'm sorry, at least in terms of the experience we have with some of the demonstrations that have happened to date, no, nothing underground. I would concur, though, on the point of geothermal. That's about as close as we've seen where any interest is about going underground and in any capacity.

Natural Resources committee  I think the first goes back to an earlier question. I think we need a dedicated program toward a vision of net-zero-energy housing, a fundamental transformation in the way we look at housing in this country—not to impose a federal presence over all provincial jurisdictions but rather have a vision that can be shared across the nation, much like the model national energy code is shared across the nation, but one that's geared around net-zero energy.

Natural Resources committee  Madame Brunelle, the cost is always going to be an issue right now. We are in the early stages of proof of concept homes. Builders are becoming more familiar with this principle of net-zero-energy housing. A moderate number of consumers are asking for it, to some extent. When you address the issue of cost, which is the first question any consumer is going to ask when they want to purchase a house, especially a house of this kind, you're going to get an extraordinarily high amount associated with that incremental cost to the house, above and beyond conventional design.

Natural Resources committee  That has been a long-standing issue for many years. There is a concentration of effort on the retrofit side, which understandably has a lot of merit. What I take issue with is that we are constantly trying to bring our existing building stock up to a new level, whether it be an EnerGuide level of 80 or higher as we move forward....

Natural Resources committee  Thank you, Mr. Chair. Ladies and gentlemen, thank you very much for this opportunity to present before the committee. It's a pleasure being here today on behalf of the Net-Zero Energy Home Coalition. My name is Gordon Shields and I'm the executive director of the coalition. Joining me, as you pointed out, is Bruce Bibby, the manager of energy conservation at Hydro Ottawa.

Natural Resources committee  --a GST abatement. So we would be happy to resubmit that. If we need to deal with proposals in that fashion, how much and over how long, we're happy to do that. But those are tools that certainly we like to suggest. And I will resubmit it to you, I promise.

Natural Resources committee  Thank you for supporting it.

Natural Resources committee  I don't have that final figure yet, but as I said earlier, we will provide a budget submission asking for money. There was a figure applied to what our suggestion was on the GST abatement. I believe it was over 15 years. I'd have to go back to my records. I threw this out as a discussion point because I think it's worth revisiting.