Fisheries Committee on Nov. 30th, 2023

[Serge Cormier, Liberal, Acadie—Bathurst, NB]

I think you also just resigned as an MLA.

[Jamie Fox]

That's right.

[Serge Cormier, Liberal, Acadie—Bathurst, NB]

If my information is correct, Mr. Chair.... It's from CBC, so I'm not sure my Conservative colleagues will believe it.

Let me read a bit of the article. It said:

While [Premier] King said he tries to provide members of his caucus as much freedom as possible, Fox's plans to run against the governing federal Liberal Party, which included attacks on the federal government in the P.E.I. Legislature, were becoming a problem.

Premier King said:

My job as the premier is to make sure we have as solid federal relations as we can have with the government.

As Jamie got closer to becoming the declared candidate [for the Conservative Party of Canada] that was causing a strain that probably we didn't need.

Mr. Chair, I'm questioning why Mr. Fox is here. Perhaps it's to promote his next federal election campaign. We don't have the actual, current minister of fisheries for P.E.I. here.

My next question, which gets serious, will be for Mr. MacPherson.

Mr. MacPherson, how do we solve this problem of unregulated fishing?

[Clifford Small, Conservative, Coast of Bays—Central—Notre Dame, NL]

On a point of order, Mr. Chair—

[A voice]

That's ridiculous.

[Clifford Small, Conservative, Coast of Bays—Central—Notre Dame, NL]

—we had Mr. Morley Knight here, a former assistant deputy minister of fisheries. His testimony was taken and accepted because of the expert role he was in, and his knowledge. To cherry-pick and single out.... What I'm seeing happening here right now is not cool.

I'd like you to pass that message on to my honourable colleague across the way, Mr. Cormier.

[Bobby Morrissey, Liberal, Egmont, PE]

Mr. Chair, I have a point of order.

[The Chair, Liberal, Ken McDonald]

Before you go to that point, I'll answer Mr. Small.

The time is allocated to Mr. Cormier. He can ask whatever question he likes, or he can use his time and make a speech if he likes. It's his time.

I'll go to Mr. Morrissey now.

[Bobby Morrissey, Liberal, Egmont, PE]

Thank you, Mr. Chair. That ruling is correct.

[Serge Cormier, Liberal, Acadie—Bathurst, NB]

Thank you.

Mr. MacPherson, as the son of a fisherman, I understand we have a huge problem in fisheries right now, even if it's going well in some.

How do we solve the problem we're dealing with right now? I know the lobster industry is facing a big problem right now when it comes to illegal, unreported fishing.

What is the solution we need? How do we come to that, once and for all, and solve this problem?

[Ian MacPherson]

I think there are definitely some good systems out there, but they need updating, or they need to move into the digital age. For example, there are electronic logs for some of the reporting and tracking. As I mentioned, we have fisheries where dockside monitors are supposed to be at a much higher percentage. There just aren't the people there to do it. Maybe we need to look at, as I said, the qualifications.

[Serge Cormier, Liberal, Acadie—Bathurst, NB]

Okay.

On dockside monitoring, Mr. MacPherson, we were told by officials that it is probably impossible to do it for all the water we have in Atlantic Canada, because there is too much.

Do you believe it's impossible to do dockside monitoring at all of our wharves in Atlantic Canada?

[Ian MacPherson]

I can speak only for Prince Edward Island, but I know that one of the companies over there has had real challenges for a number of years hiring enough people to cover its commitments.

[Serge Cormier, Liberal, Acadie—Bathurst, NB]

Are you saying that the problem is hiring people or that we don't have enough people? Is that what you're saying? I want to make sure I understand.

[Ian MacPherson]

The way I understand it now, a big challenge is that it's hard to get enough people to meet the commitments that DFO would like to see on the boats.

[Serge Cormier, Liberal, Acadie—Bathurst, NB]

Do you think a really good dockside monitoring program, if we can call it that, in every single wharf in Atlantic Canada would solve maybe not all of the problems but some of the problems?

[Ian MacPherson]

I think that would definitely help, for sure, whatever the system is, but that's a challenge. I mean, COVID was a unique circumstance, but there were fisheries that didn't have any dockside monitoring during that period.

[Serge Cormier, Liberal, Acadie—Bathurst, NB]

Do you think fishers would be willing to have a system like that implemented?

[Ian MacPherson]

I think the biggest thing, Mr. Cormier, is to involve harvesters and harvester groups in the discussion on how maybe there's a better way to do it. As we know, there are different programs, spot audits and such things that are also a deterrent, so things like that could possibly be looked at.

[Serge Cormier, Liberal, Acadie—Bathurst, NB]

On the illegal selling of lobster, do you see that in P.E.I.?

[Ian MacPherson]

I'm not personally aware of it, but I am aware of situations in which sometimes lobster is being advertised on social media or something that is quite public.

[Serge Cormier, Liberal, Acadie—Bathurst, NB]

I ask this question purely for some context and answers: Is this from commercial fishermen? Is this from indigenous fishermen? Is it all sorts of groups, like criminals or whatever? Is there a particular group we're looking at who are doing the illegal selling of lobster, or...?

[Ian MacPherson]

I wouldn't want to target one group, and I think, certainly, that needs to be looked at. We all know, and certainly you would, sir, that the value of lobster skyrocketed in the last few years, and it's a very valuable commodity. When there's money out there and big money to be made, people get involved who normally wouldn't.

[Serge Cormier, Liberal, Acadie—Bathurst, NB]

Thank you.

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

[The Chair, Liberal, Ken McDonald]

Thank you, Mr. Cormier.

We'll go to Madame Desbiens for six minutes or less, please.