Foreign Affairs Committee on Feb. 23rd, 2009

[Paul Dewar, NDP, Ottawa Centre, ON]

I'm glad you mentioned that, because it has changed significantly. In conversation recently in Ottawa someone corrected someone who was saying it was 85%. I think it's important to note that 74% of our trade is with the Americans. In other words, it has changed significantly as we've entered into trade with other countries; the BRIC is often mentioned. The reason I mention that is that our focus certainly has to be with the United States, but it also bears to look at the rest of the world, because the percentage changed.

I'm looking toward our relationship with the United States and some of the conversations that would have happened last Thursday around stimulus. We had the G-20 number, which I thought was a commitment, of 2% of GDP as a goal. What was the number we referenced when we were talking to the Americans about our stimulus package? What did we say we are investing? How much of our budget?

[Elaine Feldman]

In his press conference, the Prime Minister referred to 1.9%.

[Paul Dewar, NDP, Ottawa Centre, ON]

And did we define what that meant? In other words, did we say that was 1.9% fully federal dollars or did we just say 1.9% as an aggregate general figure?

[Elaine Feldman]

I have the language here somewhere, but I believe it's an aggregate number.

[Paul Dewar, NDP, Ottawa Centre, ON]

Thank you.

Did we get from them what they were spending in their stimulus package as it relates to the GDP? Do we know that?

[Elaine Feldman]

We know the number that's been out there, which is in the order of just under $800 billion, but as a percentage of GDP, I don't know that number.

[Paul Dewar, NDP, Ottawa Centre, ON]

I would drill down a bit farther and ask you if you're doing an analysis about how much is being spent of their stimulus package on things like environmental investments versus our budget. Is that kind of study being conducted, or are we looking at that?

[Elaine Feldman]

Within Foreign Affairs and International Trade we would be looking at where the U.S. is spending its money, but we're not responsible for domestic spending.

[Paul Dewar, NDP, Ottawa Centre, ON]

No, certainly. But you'd have access to that data. The reason I'm asking you this and where I'm going with this is because of this so-called dialogue, which I think everyone supports. We also want to be informed in the dialogue; everyone should be informed in any dialogue. My concern is the amount of money we've dedicated to stimulus versus the Americans. We're not spending as much--and that can be a debate we have between parties--but it's also where it's going to be spent. Mr. Rae talked about not just being cooperative but competitive, and my concern is that we are seeing economies changing significantly, trying to deal with economic crisis, but we're also in a transformative phase, I think most people would agree. I think it would be important to understand where we have common linkages in terms of the vision we've heard from Mr. Obama and his administration and make sure we're not left behind. I would hope our government would look at that, do a juxtaposition between where they're spending their stimulus and where we're spending ours.

I had another question. Is looking at the cap and trade market something your department has been tasked with, as it relates to the continent and the United States, or is that shared with another department?

[Elaine Feldman]

Environment Canada would have the lead on environmental issues, including a potential continental cap and trade. We're following it, of course, because a number of United States states have already come together to look at a potential cap and trade, along with a number of Canadian provinces. So, yes, we're involved in that regard. Of course, the Obama administration has spoken of cap and trade, as have a number of influential congress people. So, yes, it's something we're following closely.

[Paul Dewar, NDP, Ottawa Centre, ON]

But your department isn't the lead department; it's something that's being done in Environment. I'm just trying to get an association of who's taking the lead.

[Elaine Feldman]

We're not the lead on cap and trade. We're not the lead on environmental issues.

[Paul Dewar, NDP, Ottawa Centre, ON]

Right.

[Elaine Feldman]

But we would work very closely with Environment Canada and on the clean energy technology dialogue with NRCan.

[Paul Dewar, NDP, Ottawa Centre, ON]

So it's safe to say that...I should be going through the chair.

[The Chair, Conservative, Kevin Sorenson]

That's fine.

[Paul Dewar, NDP, Ottawa Centre, ON]

It's safe to say that relationship might be changing as we move along. In other words, you might take more of a role in this area than at present?

[Elaine Feldman]

Any time there is a discussion with the United States that might lead to an eventual agreement between the two countries, the Department of Foreign Affairs and International Trade would be very involved.

[Paul Dewar, NDP, Ottawa Centre, ON]

I have another question. I will just move from the environmental file to one around trade itself. We had an interesting presentation just before yours. I'm not sure you were here for the comments. On the whole issue of NAFTA, Mr. Hart basically said NAFTA is there, don't worry about it, and as to taking the side agreements on the environment and on labour that Mr. Obama was talking about and vetting in NAFTA, so what, we can do that. Is it something the department has looked at--in other words, taking those side agreements on labour and on the environment concerning what it would take on any concerns we would have about putting them directly into NAFTA?

[The Chair, Conservative, Kevin Sorenson]

Very quickly, Ms. Feldman.

[Elaine Feldman]

Our concern would be about reopening the NAFTA and the possible unravelling of the NAFTA. In the press conference I think it was the President who indicated that officials could look at these issues, and we would wait to hear from the United States about what they have in mind.

[The Chair, Conservative, Kevin Sorenson]

Just before we go to the next question, I do want to tell you that as far as committee business goes today, we do have to pass a budget that allows us the opportunity to bring these witnesses in and actually pay for their expenses while they are here, so we want to leave a little time.

I don't know if there are any other motions that anyone is intending to bring forward. If not, I'll leave the last five minutes for the budget, and we're going to talk about the supplementary estimates (C) as well. That could probably be done in five minutes.

Mr. Goldring.

[Peter Goldring, Conservative, Edmonton East, AB]

Thank you very much, Mr. Chairman.

Ms. Feldman, maybe you could elaborate a bit on whether these restrictions at the border are both ways, or how they would compare, coming and going. Also, it seems to me that a lot of these holdups and delays are due to a lack of capacity as part of it. It seems to me there was some work being done on an initiative on the east coast, somewhat like the Pacific gateway. It would open up more deep-water trading, interaction with seaboard states as well as with our Atlantic ports. Could you also elaborate on whether this isn't some way that will help to offset and take the pressure off the main north-south border? In particular, with shipments that are going by, say, rail or going across the border straight through to Mexico or through to the Caribbean, is there any real movement to take that deep-water trade out of our Atlantic and Pacific ports instead of trying to squeeze it all through the United States?

What other initiatives, perhaps along this line of developing infrastructure to do so, are on the books or are being discussed and talked about, like harbour, infrastructure, maybe new highways? I understand there is a new bridge for Windsor. Are there other bridges and access points? In other words, are there efforts being made to develop other ways to move product through the border until perhaps some of the security issues can be taken care of?

[Elaine Feldman]

Again, a number of the points you raise really fall within the jurisdiction of the Department of Transport. There is a lot of work going on in terms of developing both an Atlantic and a Pacific gateway, for exactly the reasons you've mentioned, in order to provide opportunities for the movement of goods through the ports of Vancouver and the Pacific and then on the east coast through Halifax, in order to speed the movement of goods through the Atlantic and Pacific gateways.

[Peter Goldring, Conservative, Edmonton East, AB]

With the drop that had been mentioned, the percentage of Canada-U.S. trade from 85% to 74%, how much of that is due, or is there any way of determining how much of that is due, to border restrictions? Has that had any influence on that cross-border trade, or is this because we're looking out to other initiatives around the world?