Procedure and House Affairs Committee on March 5th, 2013

[The Chair, Conservative, Joe Preston]

Okay, as long as we have that for the calculations.

Mr. Cullen, did you have one more question before we finish?

[Nathan Cullen, NDP, Skeena—Bulkley Valley, BC]

It was just about following up on what you talked about here. I'll be curious what Mr. Saxton says, because he's left it open to appear. But essentially, virtually keeping the status quo, is that what you're proposing for North Vancouver? You would be staying with the ridings that currently exist, keeping all of North Vancouver together with this extended arm out there, the way it is right now.

[Kennedy Stewart, NDP, Burnaby—Douglas, BC]

Leave the north shore ridings, essentially.

[Nathan Cullen, NDP, Skeena—Bulkley Valley, BC]

To confirm, did the commission hold meetings in North Vancouver?

[Kennedy Stewart, NDP, Burnaby—Douglas, BC]

Yes.

[Nathan Cullen, NDP, Skeena—Bulkley Valley, BC]

And the public at the meetings in North Vancouver said what?

[Kennedy Stewart, NDP, Burnaby—Douglas, BC]

They didn't want this, almost unanimously. I think one person at the very end of the meeting objected.

[Nathan Cullen, NDP, Skeena—Bulkley Valley, BC]

One out of 10, one out of 20?

[Kennedy Stewart, NDP, Burnaby—Douglas, BC]

Nineteen were there.

[Nathan Cullen, NDP, Skeena—Bulkley Valley, BC]

So to be clear, and this is, I think, answering the question as to where those folks would go. Sorry, what was the first nation again?

[Kennedy Stewart, NDP, Burnaby—Douglas, BC]

Tseil-Waututh. Also, former MPs and city councillors showed up and said they didn't want that either. So a very strong voice in North Vancouver said they didn't want this change.

[Nathan Cullen, NDP, Skeena—Bulkley Valley, BC]

Thank you.

[The Chair, Conservative, Joe Preston]

One more question, this one from Mr. Lukiwski, and we'll finish with this panel.

[Tom Lukiwski, Conservative, Regina—Lumsden—Lake Centre, SK]

Thank you very much.

Sorry to make you go over ground that I think you've already covered here, but I'm trying to get it clear in my own head. Nathan said originally it's a difficult job for any commission, particularly when they're adding seats to a province. It's one thing if you're not adding anything and just trying to make changes within the existing construct, but here they're trying to add seats. So I'm wondering again, with the arguments that you have made to the commission when you appeared before it, even though you have brought forward some additional information since that time, what was their primary reason for, as my colleague said, ignoring, or I would say rejecting, your arguments at the hearing level, and coming forward with the map we see before us today? Were there a series of arguments? There must have been something—

[Kennedy Stewart, NDP, Burnaby—Douglas, BC]

What's disappointing is they provided none. They made a statement at the beginning of the hearing process saying this change was going to go ahead no matter what the public said. It was quoted in the paper, which made the commission quite nervous during their presentations. Then they just went ahead and made the change with no justification in the report. You can look at the report; it's not in it.

[Peter Julian, NDP, Burnaby—New Westminster, BC]

I'd just like to add that it's far beyond the members of Parliament. We have submissions from the City of Burnaby. City of New Westminster councillors and City of Coquitlam councillors came out. So really, within the community, within Burnaby—New Westminster, and I would suggest Coquitlam as well, there is a real consensus that this is not in the interests of the community generally. That pushback has been community-wide.

[The Chair, Conservative, Joe Preston]

Mr. Gill, very quickly, you haven't had a question so I'll let you jump in.

[Parm Gill, Conservative, Brampton—Springdale, ON]

Yes, I have a very quick question.

I understand these are two different communities obviously, represented by two different municipalities, two different mayors and so on. Is it also true that from 1968 up to about 1988 it was represented by one MP?

[Kennedy Stewart, NDP, Burnaby—Douglas, BC]

That's why the community is so dead set against this. They have experience in the past. They got rid of that configuration. It was proposed again in 2002. All the communities came out and completely rejected this change. That's why they're fighting against it. It's because they have lived through it once and it didn't serve them.

[Peter Julian, NDP, Burnaby—New Westminster, BC]

The growth in the Lower Mainland has meant that we don't need to do this. When the Lower Mainland was a smaller area in terms of riding quotients 20 years ago, it may have been acceptable. It is not acceptable to this community now. I referenced the former member of Parliament for Burnaby—Douglas, who talked about what the impacts have been for servicing those two communities.

The reality is what we've proposed to you today is within the riding quotient, so there is no need to rip apart and forceably join two communities that don't have that community of interest between them.

[The Chair, Conservative, Joe Preston]

Thank you.

Mr. Cullen, did you have one more quick comment, please, so we can change out?

[Nathan Cullen, NDP, Skeena—Bulkley Valley, BC]

Absolutely. On what Mr. Stewart said, you said the commission made a statement about the impact of community submissions, or the lack of impact. Did they say this in front of the community members who were presenting, or did they say this in the newspapers?

[Kennedy Stewart, NDP, Burnaby—Douglas, BC]

It was an interview that one of the commissioners, Commissioner Ladyman, gave right at the beginning of the process to The Huffington Post, I believe, and it actually made it through all the local papers and they were backtracking all the way through the process.

[Nathan Cullen, NDP, Skeena—Bulkley Valley, BC]

I see, okay.

[Kennedy Stewart, NDP, Burnaby—Douglas, BC]

Again, they were slightly poisoned right from the beginning.