Human Resources Committee on Oct. 31st, 2006

[Diane Finley, Conservative, Haldimand—Norfolk, ON]

We want programs that will deliver results. I'm not worried about whether a given organization...[Inaudible--Editor]. What I'm worried about is getting literacy training to individuals.

[Yves Lessard, Bloc, Chambly—Borduas, QC]

I do not want to embarrass you, but we want to know where your cuts are. Your answer is not at all an answer to the question we are asking. You are saying that most of the cuts affect the Canada Mortgage and Housing Corporation Program. That accounts for $45 million, which leaves $107 million, which is not insignificant. Other organizations have been affected as well. Even within the Canada Mortgage and Housing Corporation Program, we don't know what has been cut.

I repeat: I do not want to embarrass you. The fact is that within each program, people work in the field, often on a volunteer basis, to improve things. They have forged ties and developed social solidarity, but they suddenly find that their funds have been withdrawn. They want to know how their activities will be affected by this.

Can you tell me what has been cut?

[The Chair, Conservative, Dean Allison]

We're almost out of time here, so just a quick response, Ms. Finley.

[Diane Finley, Conservative, Haldimand—Norfolk, ON]

We are still spending over $80 million a year on literacy programs, we are still investing in affordable housing, and we're investing in the homeless initiatives. What we are doing is spending the money wisely on programs that deliver real results for the people who need it: for the homeless, the illiterate, and for those who need social housing. These are the people we are focusing on. We are going to help them, but we are not going to help others who aren't contributing to easing the burden that those vulnerable people are carrying.

[The Chair, Conservative, Dean Allison]

That's all the time we have. Sorry, Mr. Lessard.

We're going to move to the last questioner today. Mr. Van Kesteren, you have five minutes, please.

[Dave Van Kesteren, Conservative, Chatham-Kent—Essex, ON]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

Thank you, Minister, for coming here.

This is not my normal spot on committee, but I find it most interesting. I've learned much and I appreciate the time you've taken. I appreciate the candid responses you've given us.

I'm interested, Minister, in communities, and I think we all are. We all agree that communities are what make up this great country, and we recognize that government has a strong role in building communities.

Could you explain to this committee what your vision is to facilitate stronger communities? Furthermore, can you explain what your role would be in facilitating that vision?

[Diane Finley, Conservative, Haldimand—Norfolk, ON]

This is a very broad question, and I thank you for it.

As I just mentioned, one of the key things is to make sure that our people are housed safely and reliably. So we have to make sure that the homeless are taken care of. We have to make sure that there's sufficient affordable housing, and we've heard a lot of talk about it for years. But we're actually delivering on these programs with another $1.4 billion in affordable housing, because there is a shortage. We recognized that in the early days; we're making a difference.

We also need to work with the voluntary sector that contributes so much. As I mentioned earlier, they deliver a lot of our programs, particularly through, with, and for Service Canada. We have a voluntary sector council that meets on a regular basis to provide us advice on just how we can do those things. We also have to make sure that the vulnerable in our communities are taken care of. That's a responsibility we have.

So it's initiatives like the employment insurance compassionate care benefit, which we expanded, that are good. These things mean that terminally ill patients are no longer restricted, as they were under the Liberal government, to having only immediate family receive the EI benefit for taking care of them. Because so many people don't have immediate family or immediate family nearby now, anyone of the patient's choosing can receive the EI benefits to provide care for the terminally ill patient.

This is part of our social commitment to Canadians. It's helping the vulnerable by making sure they have the basic standard of living and access to government services and programs. That's why we expanded our outreach for the guaranteed income supplement, because not enough people were getting access to it.

There's a whole wide range of things that help build a community, but we have to take care of the most vulnerable within it first. That's what my department is focused on doing.

[Dave Van Kesteren, Conservative, Chatham-Kent—Essex, ON]

I'm hearing that your commitment is to doing the right things. You stated earlier that we saw a billion dollars in cutbacks on a budget of $210 billion federally. Did you say that your budget in the HRDC is $70 billion?

[Diane Finley, Conservative, Haldimand—Norfolk, ON]

It's eighty.

[Dave Van Kesteren, Conservative, Chatham-Kent—Essex, ON]

It's eighty? That was close to Ontario's budget, I think. Remarkable.

We have a commitment from you, then, that you're going to continue on in these programs that are important to Canadians, programs that are working, but I would assume.... What was your portion of the cuts? We cut $1 billion, and how much did we cut from HRDC--$288 million, was it?

[Diane Finley, Conservative, Haldimand—Norfolk, ON]

It was $107 million over two years.

[Dave Van Kesteren, Conservative, Chatham-Kent—Essex, ON]

That represented more than one-third?

[Diane Finley, Conservative, Haldimand—Norfolk, ON]

It was a very small portion. It was $107 million over two years.

[Dave Van Kesteren, Conservative, Chatham-Kent—Essex, ON]

We can see, then, that in a large budget like that there must be some areas in which we can give Canadians better value.

[Diane Finley, Conservative, Haldimand—Norfolk, ON]

I'd be surprised if there weren't, just because of the sheer numbers. If you think about your own personal budget, can you cut out a coffee a week? Because that's just about what it works out to. There has to be room for improvement. I would suggest to my honourable colleagues that I'm surprised they don't want to see things evaluated so that they can become more effective.

[Dave Van Kesteren, Conservative, Chatham-Kent—Essex, ON]

We can expect from your department that we're going to continue to do those things and make sure that we give Canadians good value, but we will continue to keep those things that are important and important to building strong communities as well?

[Diane Finley, Conservative, Haldimand—Norfolk, ON]

Absolutely. Strong communities and strong families are really important to us, because they are the backbone for our whole society, quite frankly. If we don't have those, then we're in trouble. That's why we have our choice in child care plan, because we don't believe that one size fits all. We respect the parents.

[Dave Van Kesteren, Conservative, Chatham-Kent—Essex, ON]

Okay. Thank you.

[The Chair, Conservative, Dean Allison]

Thank you, Mr. Van Kesteren.

I want to thank you, Minister, and your staff for being here today and answering all of our questions. We understand how busy you are, so thank you once again for being here.

We're going to take a few minutes for the room to clear, and then we're going to get to committee business. Okay?

[The Chair, Conservative, Dean Allison]

We have before us today almost 19 motions that we need to deal with. I understand we agreed, when we looked at a motion by Mr. Brown, that the first four motions before you would be set aside until after the employability study. However, there are still an additional 15 motions we need to have a look at. I'd like some direction on how we should move forward.

Mr. Lessard.

[Yves Lessard, Bloc, Chambly—Borduas, QC]

In connection with the order of precedence, I propose that we begin with the motion we proposed and which reads as follows:

That the Standing Committee on Human Resources, Social Development and the Status of Persons with Disabilities give priority consideration to Bill C-257 (replacement workers) and that a work plan be adopted no later than November 2, 2006.

[The Chair, Conservative, Dean Allison]

In the past we've taken motions in the order of precedence, in the way they've come in. We've talked about the first four motions being removed until after the employability study is done. I am proposing that we look at number five. Mr. Lessard is suggesting we move to his motion, which is number 16 in the order of precedence. Are there any comments on that?

Mr. Lessard.

[Yves Lessard, Bloc, Chambly—Borduas, QC]

I respect your opinion, Mr. Chairman, but the committee controls procedure in terms of establishing an order of precedence. Under the circumstances, I think that my motion is altogether appropriate.

[The Chair, Conservative, Dean Allison]

You're making a formal motion to move number 16 to the forefront of the debate. That will open the floor for discussion on that.

Mr. Lessard.

[Yves Lessard, Bloc, Chambly—Borduas, QC]

Mr. Chairman, I raise a point of order. A motion on this order cannot be debated. It is immediately voted upon.

I refrained from arguing.