Evidence of meeting #27 for Human Resources, Skills and Social Development and the Status of Persons with Disabilities in the 40th Parliament, 2nd Session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was need.
3:15 p.m.
MD, Salvus Clinic
It's Latin for safe and well, and that's what we want our people to be.
3:15 p.m.
Liberal
Michael Savage Liberal Dartmouth—Cole Harbour, NS
Thank you very much.
We talked a little bit and some of you mentioned that other provinces have anti-poverty strategies.
It's not just a matter of resources. Newfoundland and Labrador kicked off their anti-poverty strategy when they had the highest debt. This was before the oil was rolling in. It's a matter of political will for people to make those decisions, don't you think, as opposed to just having the resources? Governments prioritize just as people do, right?
3:15 p.m.
Coordinator, Business Community Anti-Poverty Initiative Inc.
I think it's a will of leadership. It's not just political will.
A lot of communities are looking at how Saint John's business leadership came to the table. It's not normal for business leaders to be focused on this particular issue. But it does take leadership within every sector, and that's what we're looking for from all sectors.
It does include the federal government in terms of the political will to say that we've got a problem. It's just like Saint John said, “We have a problem and we're going to fix it. We don't know how, but we're going to fix it.”
3:15 p.m.
Liberal
Michael Savage Liberal Dartmouth—Cole Harbour, NS
In terms of reinventing neighbourhoods, we heard from somebody yesterday who is working in my own community of Dartmouth, Nova Scotia, Paul Shakotko. He's part of United Way. The United Way is doing some of this, where they actually go into communities. They did it in Spryfield and Halifax and now they are doing it in Dartmouth.
Is the United Way involved with you in any way, or is that a model that you're familiar with?
3:15 p.m.
Coordinator, Vibrant Communities Saint John
I know the United Way across the country is quite involved in neighbourhood renewal; in Saint John, a little less so. But we certainly have a lot of partners who are. For example, in Saint John, the Department of Social Development for the provincial government stepped into the largest housing project in the province. It had the most units, 388 units. They said we need to transform this neighbourhood and we need to do it from the ground up. We need to completely redesign this neighbourhood in a very integrated way, where, in the end, we'll have a place where anybody would be proud to live. Right now, very few people want to live there.
3:15 p.m.
Liberal
Michael Savage Liberal Dartmouth—Cole Harbour, NS
One of the reasons we do these hearings and why it's important for us to travel around the country--and we don't travel in Lear jets--is that it's part of our job to get out and see what is actually happening with people on the ground. It's a unique circumstance from place to place.
We've heard a lot today about the paltry support for people living on social assistance in New Brunswick. Somebody this morning mentioned $294 a month. He had compared that to 1974, when I think it was $254 a month, and then it was cut and then it was brought back some time ago. How does somebody live on that?
3:20 p.m.
President, Voice of Real Poverty Inc.
There's no way they can.
I happen to be a dairy farmer by profession. I have made the statement on a number of occasions that I have more regulations, more restrictions, more responsibility on how I treat my cows than what I see with our people. That disturbs me a lot, to the point of being involved in this organization. I find it very disturbing, and I haven't had anyone yet explain to me, and maybe someone here could, but I've thrown it out a lot.... The $294 that you're talking about is the single so-called employable person. We meet at the soup kitchens, and I dare challenge anyone to come along with me to the soup kitchen and pick out who you would employ in your office. Some of these people are my best friends and they know I wouldn't hire them on my farm because they have major issues. They are not employable in the world of business today. To give $294, that is $3,500 a year to live on. To rent a boarding room alone in Moncton, I haven't heard a rate of less than $300 a month. Some of the landlords have lowered their rate to take the cheque in hand because they know it's coming every month. There are absolutely zero dollars left for that individual to survive.
When you look at Atlantic Canada, before the provincial government of the day got in they had a beautiful plan on how to deal with poverty. They talked about bringing up those rates to the Atlantic Canada average. That particular rate would have to be raised 70% to be equivalent with Nova Scotia, P.E.I., and Newfoundland. Someone explain to me how that is rational because I don't get it. Even if you're lucky enough to get the classification of disability as a single individual in this province, you get a maximum of $600 a month to live on. Even to get categorized in that you have to prove you can't personally take care of yourself. It's unbelievable.
3:20 p.m.
Conservative
The Chair Conservative Dean Allison
Thank you very much.
We're going to move to our next questioner, Madame Beaudin.
You have seven minutes, please.
May 12th, 2009 / 3:20 p.m.
Bloc
Josée Beaudin Bloc Saint-Lambert, QC
Thank you.
Mrs. Thorne-Dykstra, would you be a member of the committee that will work on an anti-poverty strategy here?
3:20 p.m.
President, Voice of Real Poverty Inc.
No.
I submitted a presentation to them. They did meetings in different areas, so I attended the one here in Moncton.
3:20 p.m.
Bloc
Josée Beaudin Bloc Saint-Lambert, QC
We have been told that about 30 partners will be involved in phase 2 of the strategy and you will not be one of them?
3:20 p.m.
President, Voice of Real Poverty Inc.
I have not been invited currently.
3:20 p.m.
Bloc
Josée Beaudin Bloc Saint-Lambert, QC
I come from Quebec. I am very proud to meet six very active women who are directly involved, who know the issue and who work on the front lines. Before becoming an MP, I also used to work for a community organization in Quebec. You were suggesting that we should look at the best practices used elsewhere. I heard you talk about core funding for community organizations. Is that a priority for you? When the time comes to make an important decision, how do you decide between what is urgent, essential or a priority? In which category would you put core funding for community organizations?
3:20 p.m.
Community Development, As an Individual
That was in the non-profit task force report, which was--we went all around the province and we heard from several hundred non-profit organizations that core funding was the top priority across the board, absolutely number one, way ahead of anything else.
3:20 p.m.
Bloc
Josée Beaudin Bloc Saint-Lambert, QC
How would this funding be provided? How should it be provided to community organizations? Have you thought about what the structure should be or how it would work?
3:25 p.m.
Community Development, As an Individual
It's a very difficult question because there are so many kinds of non-profits. Some are delivering services in a contractual arrangement on behalf of a government. They should be paid a core amount they can count on every year, with increases according to the cost of living. That should be in the contract. No question. So that one's fairly simple.
As far as other organizations that operate on project funding mostly, there are several ways people suggested it could be done. For example, a portion of a project fund could be for operating costs or you could apply to a fund. There would be a central fund. We never figured out where the money would come from. Maybe from the lotteries. That was one possibility. But if there was a fund for non-profits to apply to, and they could show they were stable, they had good boards of directors, governance models, and all that sort of thing, then they could qualify for some level of core funding every year. But we really don't have a formula.
3:25 p.m.
Bloc
Josée Beaudin Bloc Saint-Lambert, QC
Thank you.
Mrs, Crouse, what should we do to make sure that there would be more organizations like yours?
3:25 p.m.
MD, Salvus Clinic
In terms of how the federal government could provide more services to medical? Is that what you're asking?
3:25 p.m.
Bloc
Josée Beaudin Bloc Saint-Lambert, QC
It could be through the federal government. I suppose that, when in doing your work, you see that there are not enough resources to provide the medical services required by homeless persons. I suppose that you think there should be more of you. What would be the solutions, at any level?
3:25 p.m.
MD, Salvus Clinic
We have a huge health crisis, of which I'm sure you may be aware, here in New Brunswick. We have approximately 5,000 patients without family doctors on waiting lists here in Moncton. To provide service to people who are marginalized, who consume lots of time, who have complex needs, is very difficult. Addressing that health care component is important, to work with our medical association and different levels of government is important, in terms of that and in terms of training. The expertise is out there to manage, but everybody's restricted because of cutbacks at our provincial level. We've had cutbacks in mental health, and that has long waiting lists. It's a very slow process to get medical things seen. So looking at how to improve the ease at which people dealing with poverty get into the system is important.
As I mentioned, medication is a huge issue for us. If you're on social assistance, you can get a white card that will cover you. But if you're trying to find employment and improve your circumstances, you lose your white card or you have to go through a very complex formula of looking at your income and getting letters from your doctor and pharmacy showing exactly what you need. It is a complex system. Simplifying that or providing some type of drug plan for those who are working would be a huge gap that could be filled.
Also, someone has already mentioned looking after children. Trying to provide single mums with adequate day care so they can go out to work and go to school and help the whole family would be another big gap that could be filled.
3:25 p.m.
Conservative
The Chair Conservative Dean Allison
We're out of time here, but Monica, do you have a quick response?
3:25 p.m.
Coordinator, Business Community Anti-Poverty Initiative Inc.
Yes. It just struck me. I don't know if you've heard from the Canadian Council on Social Development yet. They've been advocating for a long time that social funds coming from the federal government need to be protected through social transfer activism, because money is flowing into provinces, but we have no idea if that money is really being dedicated to social needs or not. Our suspicion is that the money isn't.
Reducing poverty takes investment. There's no doubt about it. The business community is down there going “Aaah!” It's a lot of money, but it's worth it. It's an investment. We have to come up with these new investments, we have to protect the money, and it has to flow—I agree with Susan—through provinces, and communities have to work with their provinces.