Evidence of meeting #81 for Human Resources, Skills and Social Development and the Status of Persons with Disabilities in the 44th Parliament, 1st Session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was youth.
A video is available from Parliament.
12:10 p.m.
Liberal
The Chair Liberal Bobby Morrissey
Committee members, a motion has been moved by Mr. Aitchison. The motion is in order, I have been advised.
Is there discussion on the motion?
I have Mr. Fragiskatos.
12:10 p.m.
Liberal
Peter Fragiskatos Liberal London North Centre, ON
We do recognize that Canada is in a housing crisis, Mr. Chair. The minister has spoken about it and has acted accordingly.
I was just at a panel discussion with the Canadian Real Estate Association with my colleague. It was a good discussion on where things are and a good discussion on measures introduced by the government thus far, and there's more to do.
I'm just wondering what the intent is to bring the motion here when it has been acknowledged already that the situation is as described. That's a question.
12:15 p.m.
Conservative
Scott Aitchison Conservative Parry Sound—Muskoka, ON
I'm happy to speak to that.
Mr. Fragiskatos is quite correct. At least the new minister acknowledges that we're in a crisis, and we've talked about housing. We've had studies on housing. I think it's important for this committee to unanimously declare it and report that to the House. Anybody who's been on a municipal council knows that occasionally we would pass motions just like this to identify an issue and signal to constituents that we acknowledge that a problem exists and that we're working to fix it. That's really all it is. It's an acknowledgement.
I think this committee knows that as well, and that's why I suggest that we do it.
12:15 p.m.
Liberal
The Chair Liberal Bobby Morrissey
Is there any discussion?
Do you have your hand up, Mr. Fragiskatos?
12:15 p.m.
Liberal
Peter Fragiskatos Liberal London North Centre, ON
I do, yes.
Usually if an idea is put on the table like this, it would come with attached ideas: Canada is in a housing crisis, and therefore X, Y and Z should happen.
I mentioned to my colleague today that I was disappointed to see that the Conservatives had put half measures on the table when it comes to their approach to waiving the GST. As you know, Mr. Chair, it is not an across-the-board waiver for purpose-built rentals. There's a very important asterisk, so to speak, that would prevent housing from being built. Some housing would be built, but not nearly as much.
I wonder if my colleagues had a chance to review the testimony at the finance committee that was made available a few days ago. The blues are there. Finance officials made it clear that the Conservative approach on this particular issue would not lead to very much housing, certainly not in comparison to what the government has done. This is, as you know, a much broader waiver with respect to the GST, which will see purpose-built rental apartments constructed across the country. In fact, Dream Unlimited, a very large developer in Toronto, has said that they will now, as a result of this specific measure, construct more than 5,000 units.
Where are the ideas? If we're just going to report to the House a statement, I'm wondering if my colleague is trying to find ways to eat time from the House of Commons and distract from the legislative agenda of the government. Is that the overall intent of the motion here? We know that Canada has this particular issue in front of it, which I agree is a crisis. Then what exactly is the approach?
12:15 p.m.
Conservative
Scott Aitchison Conservative Parry Sound—Muskoka, ON
The committee could be forgiven for thinking that maybe my colleague is trying to waste the time of the witnesses here, and I'm not trying to do that. The minister was here and acknowledged that we're in a crisis. It's not a complex thing. I just think it's important for us to be unanimous in declaring that it is a crisis, just like your minister has done. It shouldn't be complex. I didn't think it would take this much time. I know these folks are here to talk about other things, and I thought it would be a fairly quick thing to do.
We have a crisis. I think it's important for us to acknowledge that crisis, as your own minister has, and I thought this would be a fairly quick thing we could all agree on.
12:15 p.m.
Liberal
Wayne Long Liberal Saint John—Rothesay, NB
Thank you.
Can we suspend for a couple of minutes, Chair?
12:15 p.m.
Liberal
12:20 p.m.
Liberal
12:20 p.m.
Liberal
Wayne Long Liberal Saint John—Rothesay, NB
I'm happy to chat, Chair. I don't know if I have the floor. I just asked for a suspension.
12:20 p.m.
Liberal
The Chair Liberal Bobby Morrissey
I see Mr. Fragiskatos and Madam Zarrillo.
We have Mr. Fragiskatos, then we'll go to Madam Zarrillo on the motion.
12:20 p.m.
Liberal
Peter Fragiskatos Liberal London North Centre, ON
I'll just go back to the point that I made earlier, Mr. Chair.
He knows this. I won't belabour the point, and I have a lot of respect for the colleague opposite. He's an effective critic, and he knows his file. He knows it because of his years in the municipality, and I know that he spent time in real estate as well. Therefore, he knows better that something like this is only going to distract from the overall legislative agenda.
There is important work that's happening in the House, including the lifting of the GST on purpose-built rentals that I hope Conservatives support. I know it's under their skin now that the measure we've introduced—and it's verified—is more effective, but what they're doing now is not a way to blow steam effectively. If they're upset about that, this doesn't move things in a terribly meaningful way.
I'll just leave it there, Mr. Chair.
12:20 p.m.
NDP
Bonita Zarrillo NDP Port Moody—Coquitlam, BC
Thank you, Mr. Chair.
I wanted to hear the debate on this one today, but I definitely had concerns when the past housing minister came to this committee and wasn't willing to admit that the Liberals had undertaken a market-driven program to try to get housing built in this country and had totally walked away from social housing, as had the Conservatives.
There was a comment today from the Liberals about Dream Unlimited. I brought it to this committee that Dream was awarded money from the Canada Infrastructure Bank. Dream is a group of three different companies with publicly traded TSX shares. One of them is a REIT with a portfolio of over $13 billion. We're talking about that being the solution. Now that it's getting a GST rebate, it's actually willing to build some rental housing. It's insulting.
When I was sitting as a municipal councillor, I brought forward the motion on the GST rebate that went to the FCM. It's been in the FCM policy book for a long time, and now the Liberals are saying this is revolutionary. They need to have a fire lit under them, because they don't seem to understand the critical nature of what we're dealing with here.
Many of us who are in the Confederation Building and who go back and forth from the West Block would have seen the person outside today saying that winter is coming and we need to address homelessness. Encampments are growing.
I have a friendly amendment that I hope the Conservatives and the committee will be open to. I move that after “recognizes Canada is in a housing crisis”, we add the words “that requires urgent action by the federal government to end homelessness”.
Thank you, Mr. Chair. I'll ask for a friendly amendment. If that's not the way we'd like to go, I could move a firm amendment, but I'm going to first ask if the mover would be open to a friendly amendment.
12:25 p.m.
Liberal
The Chair Liberal Bobby Morrissey
Madame Zarrillo, could you repeat that slowly so that it's in the record?
12:25 p.m.
NDP
Bonita Zarrillo NDP Port Moody—Coquitlam, BC
After “housing crisis”, it would read, “that requires urgent action by the federal government to end homelessness”.
12:25 p.m.
Liberal
The Chair Liberal Bobby Morrissey
Okay, committee. You now have an amendment by Madame Zarrillo to the motion of Mr. Aitchison.
Mr. Aitchison, do you want to speak to the amendment?
12:25 p.m.
Conservative
Scott Aitchison Conservative Parry Sound—Muskoka, ON
I'm just going to say that I'm amenable to that friendly amendment. I think it's good. Thanks.
12:25 p.m.
Liberal
12:25 p.m.
NDP
Bonita Zarrillo NDP Port Moody—Coquitlam, BC
After the words “in a housing crisis”, we would add “that requires urgent action by the federal government to end homelessness”. It would then continue with “and that this motion be reported to the House”.
