National Defence Committee on April 3rd, 2008

[LGen Michel Gauthier]

Into theatre.

[Cheryl Gallant, Conservative, Renfrew—Nipissing—Pembroke, ON]

So they are available.

[LGen Michel Gauthier]

That's what I was told, but we will get you more specific information.

[Col Jean-Robert Bernier]

There are other efforts under way that are much more expansive than that. They're all classified efforts because of the operational security, but there are many things that are probably going to be even more protective than that.

[Cheryl Gallant, Conservative, Renfrew—Nipissing—Pembroke, ON]

So the everyday soldier going into a LAV or doing patrols on foot does have access to this type of equipment, or will have access in a short length of time.

[LGen Michel Gauthier]

They will. How soon I couldn't say. The more general answer to the question I think is that we follow this quite precisely in-theatre and back in Canada, from a medical perspective, from an equipping perspective, from any number of different perspectives.

We've been making adjustments to both the vehicle set that we have, in terms of how they are protected, and to personal protective gear, based on the results of this analysis we do. And that evolves over time. It's very dynamic. So we could take this one example of the groin protector, but it actually applies much more broadly than that.

[Cheryl Gallant, Conservative, Renfrew—Nipissing—Pembroke, ON]

Thank you.

For any soldiers who want the throat protector part that goes onto the front of their collar, any deployed Canadian personnel who want that protection, do they have it accessible in-theatre?

[LGen Michel Gauthier]

I can't answer that question. I don't have that detail. I can take that on notice.

[Cheryl Gallant, Conservative, Renfrew—Nipissing—Pembroke, ON]

Would you be able to follow up with us?

Lastly, would you describe, step by step, the process a soldier goes through in order to, first of all, try to remain in the military if there's an amputation involved? Let's say it's a leg amputation. And then, if there is no way to accommodate the soldier, what are the steps this soldier must take in order to obtain all the compensation that he or she is entitled to receive through the military, through DND, SISIP, and Veterans Affairs? Please walk me through it.

[LGen Michel Gauthier]

Unfortunately, I have to respond in the same way that I have to a couple of other questions. I'm just the wrong person to ask that question to. They're very good questions, and I don't have the answers to those. It would be the chief of military personnel who would have the responsibility to provide you with those answers.

[Cheryl Gallant, Conservative, Renfrew—Nipissing—Pembroke, ON]

Thank you.

I'll share the rest of my time with my colleague.

[The Chair, Conservative, Rick Casson]

No, you've used it all up, I'm afraid. You'll have to straighten it out with your colleague.

Mr. Bouchard, you have five minutes.

[Robert Bouchard, Bloc, Chicoutimi—Le Fjord, QC]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

Thank you also, Lieutenant-General Gauthier and Colonel Bernier, for being here with us.

My question is a general one, so it goes to the general, of course.

We are aware that we have a large number of military personnel on missions overseas. The most significant mission is in Afghanistan. Soldiers are deployed there by a rotation system. Some leave and others are recruited. We know that recruiting is not easy and has some constraints. The fact that soldiers are deployed repeatedly or more frequently in the rotation could have health implications.

Is the number of military personnel serving in foreign missions sufficient, most specifically in Afghanistan?

[LGen Michel Gauthier]

Once again, I am not necessarily an expert on the implications of recruitment and attrition in the Canadian Forces, or even in the army. The Chief of Military Personnel or the Army Commander would be in a better position to answer those questions. To date, at my level, the army has not indicated any problem with the ability of the Canadian Forces to supply troops to accomplish its mission. Nor do we foresee any up to 2011.

[Robert Bouchard, Bloc, Chicoutimi—Le Fjord, QC]

Thank you.

You told us about your health care personnel deployed in the mission in Afghanistan, in Kandahar. You also said that wait times were not long. Can you give me specific examples of what that might mean for a soldier needing a health care service. Are we talking days or weeks?

[Col Jean-Robert Bernier]

Normally, we are talking hours, or a few days at most. For acute problems, service is immediate, 24 hours a day, seven days a week.

[Robert Bouchard, Bloc, Chicoutimi—Le Fjord, QC]

For DND, how important is the rehabilitation of soldiers who have been treated for psychological wounds that are classified as severe or moderately severe and who want to get back to the operation?

[LGen Michel Gauthier]

I would say that it is of utmost importance.

I will let Colonel Bernier talk more specifically about our health system.

[Col Jean-Robert Bernier]

All available resources are provided to maximize rehabilitation. It can take years, but we keep those people in the army. At a certain point, if we are sure that no further improvement is possible, we conduct an assessment to see if the person can continue to serve as a soldier. The decision on whether the Canadian Forces can continue to employ him is made at that point.

[Robert Bouchard, Bloc, Chicoutimi—Le Fjord, QC]

So there are several stages, and the assessment is simply one of them.

[Col Jean-Robert Bernier]

We are continually re-evaluating, and, as long as it is possible, with rehabilitation treatment, for the person to resume military service in a way that the Canadian Forces deem acceptable, that person remains in the army.

[LGen Michel Gauthier]

For us, that is a basic principle. Absolutely nothing should be more important than taking care of those who have been wounded in the service of their country overseas. Be assured that this is how we see things.

[The Chair, Conservative, Rick Casson]

Very good. Thank you.

We'll go to Mr. Tonks and then back to Mr. Lunney.

[Alan Tonks, Liberal, York South—Weston, ON]

Thank you.

Colonel Bernier, I don't sit on this committee and haven't heard previous witnesses, so I'm coming from an information vacuum, to say the least.

Some personnel come back from active operations and are decommissioned, which in my mind means they leave the forces. Do they have the same ongoing monitoring for traumatic and post-traumatic stress disorder, and ongoing mental health treatment? Do they have the same opportunities as troops who have simply come back and may be redeployed? In other words, do they continue in the forces?

[Col Jean-Robert Bernier]

For those who are released from the armed forces, the responsibility for their military service-related care becomes the responsibility of Veterans Affairs Canada. We no longer have a legal mandate to carry on with providing them health care. We do everything we can to smoothly transition their care to Veterans Affairs and ensure they get all the benefits necessary. I don't know all the details of that. It's outside my area. We don't carry on monitoring them, except in some cases where we do ad hoc studies and try to find the records for those people after they've left.

We did one particular study, for example, a mortality study of Gulf War veterans. We had tremendous effort and collaboration with Statistics Canada to follow up on veterans who had long left the armed forces to try to get as many records as possible, as much information as possible, to assess what the long-term impact was. There are various collaborations with Veterans Affairs, but generally, once they leave the armed forces we no longer have a legal or other mandate to carry on with providing their care.

Veterans Affairs has its own series and whole template of services that are offered. In some cases, they are more expansive. I don't know all the details of them, but they're very generous as far as the treatment that's available to soldiers who've suffered any kind of military service-related injury.