Status of Women Committee on Nov. 16th, 2010

[Sébastien Goupil]

We are trying to use the most rigorous and relevant data possible. We are relying on the expertise of our colleagues at Statistics Canada to direct us to sources of data most likely to document the situation.

Right now, we are being told that the sources of data we are going to use will allow us to cover the issue of unpaid work, among others, in a much broader way. A chapter in the sixth edition of Women in Canada will cover this.

[The Chair, Liberal, Hedy Fry]

Thank you very much.

We go to Ms. McLeod for the Conservatives.

[Cathy McLeod, Conservative, Kamloops—Thompson—Cariboo, BC]

Thank you, Madam Chair.

I have a couple of short questions, and then perhaps a longer one.

The first one is to Statistics Canada. Certainly we all recognize unpaid work as being important, but to truly understand equality of women in Canada, it looks as though we require a much more comprehensive process. You talked about creating 12 chapters and using labour force surveys, Canadian community health surveys, and surveys of labour. All of those, which are voluntary surveys but are considered reliable data, help you to understand how women are faring in Canada by taking a number of comprehensive sources together.

Is that accurate? Have the sources that you're using been created predominantly through a voluntary survey system?

[Sébastien Goupil]

Yes, Status of Women Canada tries to understand the situation of all women in Canadian society, in all their diversity and in all regions. We know that women are not a homogenous group and that it is essential to consider the many aspects of the contributions of various groups of women to Canadian society. We also need to look at certain obstacles they face when they want to take full part in social, economic and democratic life. It is crucial to be able to grasp some of the differences that exist among the women in the various groups. As I mentioned, this is why the next edition of Women in Canada will include chapters on Aboriginal women, visible minority women, immigrant women, seniors and women with a participation or activity limitation.

[Cathy McLeod, Conservative, Kamloops—Thompson—Cariboo, BC]

My next questions are focused to Statistics Canada.

Is it accurate to say that all those surveys I just talked about--labour force, Canadian community, health surveys--are voluntary processes?

[Jane Badets]

All of those surveys are voluntary, except for the labour force survey, which is mandatory.

[Cathy McLeod, Conservative, Kamloops—Thompson—Cariboo, BC]

Do you deem those surveys to be providing quality data in terms of how we analyze what we're doing and where we're going?

[Jane Badets]

All the data released by Statistics Canada is of high quality and is very comprehensive.

[Cathy McLeod, Conservative, Kamloops—Thompson—Cariboo, BC]

In order to truly understand, how long does it currently take the average individual to do either what was the long-form census or the household survey? How long does that take?

[Marc Hamel, Director General, Census Management Office, Statistics Canada]

I would say that for the average household, which is about two persons, it takes about 30 minutes.

[Cathy McLeod, Conservative, Kamloops—Thompson—Cariboo, BC]

If we were to include all the questions, to really understand women, we would be lengthening this particular survey. If you include the sorts of sources Status of Women Canada used to release their 12 chapters, it would require a massive addition to the survey.

[Jane Badets]

Yes, well, it depends on what the user is looking for and what the research question is as well. Different survey vehicles provide different types of information. For example, on the general social survey, the time use diary is a very different vehicle or way to collect the information than, say, would be possible in the census.

A lot depends on what the survey is designed to provide as well. So you have different ways of collecting the information or different ways of posing the questions, or you ask a different set of questions. Each survey has an objective, and each survey has a reason to be designed the way it is.

[Cathy McLeod, Conservative, Kamloops—Thompson—Cariboo, BC]

In terms of understanding, really, unpaid work, you have indicated that the general social survey is a very robust data source. It's a very comprehensive view. Can you talk a little more about that particular survey?

[Jane Badets]

Yes. In particular, the general social survey is a survey we do annually. And it is on different topics, such as, for example, families or victimization.

One of those cycles is the time use cycle, and that's conducted every five years. We started in 1992. The time use diary collects information on a 24-hour diary, so it's a little bit burdensome for respondents. We ask them what activities they're doing throughout the day and how much time they're spending on them. We ask about primary activities, and now we're starting to ask about secondary or simultaneous activities as well. For example, the GSS time use diary would capture someone making supper, but at the same time they're doing child care. That's the kind of information it collects, so you can look at the extent to which people are working on unpaid household activities, whether it's elder care, child care, volunteering, or looking after family members. And you can see over a 24-hour time period how much time they spent. That set of information is in that particular cycle.

As well, we ask sets of questions similar to what's asked in the census. But we ask about unpaid household activities, such as caring for seniors, not only inside the household but outside the home as well. That's why it's a more comprehensive set of information. It's just captures the whole range of household activities that can be undertaken by Canadians in any time period.

We've done that cycle every five years. We're just doing a cycle right now, in 2010, and we'll release the results in the spring of 2011. That's a fair bit of data with over 20 years of data.

[Cathy McLeod, Conservative, Kamloops—Thompson—Cariboo, BC]

It would be fair to say that from the round tables and the consultation processes you've had, your researchers, your communities, tend to find that a very valuable data source, as opposed to perhaps one question in a...?

[Jane Badets]

Yes, based on the feedback we got, the GSS was being used more frequently.

[The Chair, Liberal, Hedy Fry]

Thank you very much.

Now for the New Democratic Party, we'll have Ms. Mathyssen.

[Irene Mathyssen, NDP, London—Fanshawe, ON]

Thank you, Madam Chair.

Thank you very much for providing us with this background information, but I need some clarification.

I'd like to start with you, Monsieur Goupil.

You said that it was very important for Status of Women Canada to examine the progress women are or are not making in terms of equality. Can you tell me exactly where unpaid work of the type covered in question 33 in the 2006 questionnaire is discussed in the StatsCan publication Women in Canada?

You referenced that. Where is that exactly?

[Sébastien Goupil]

Unpaid work will be discussed in the chapter on family status and time use. So far we're still waiting to receive the data from the general social survey. StatsCan can speak to that. The data will be released later on. We haven't yet undertaken the discussion about the content of this chapter, but based on the discussions we've had with StatsCan, we will have a more comprehensive portrait than the previous edition of Women in Canada.

[Irene Mathyssen, NDP, London—Fanshawe, ON]

Are you talking about chapter 5 in that report? That chapter has only unpaid volunteer work and no other unpaid work. Pursuing that seems to be less than helpful, because we want to know the full gamut.

[Erin Leigh, Senior Policy Analyst, Gender-Based Analysis and Strategic Policy Branch, Status of Women Canada]

That's right. When we went to move ahead with producing the next edition of Women in Canada, we looked at the previous edition and used it as the basis for moving forward with the next edition. We consulted with our other colleagues in government, as well as with Statistics Canada, about whether the 2005 edition captures what we need to know.

Looking particularly at the unpaid work information, we also felt that the information could be improved and expanded upon, so in consultation with Statistics Canada we determined that the general social survey on time use, which is being collected right now, I believe, will have a much fuller picture of unpaid work captured in that chapter. As Sébastien said, it hasn't yet been consulted in full yet because the data aren't yet available to look at, but we will be expanding much more fully in the next edition.

[Irene Mathyssen, NDP, London—Fanshawe, ON]

Okay, but I have a concern about that.

Basically my understanding is that the long-form census gives you the wider framework. It provides solid indicators, something that is important in order to establish that sort of baseline, that framework. The GSS, because it's only a sample of 20,000, as compared to the far greater sampling of 25% of Canadians in the general census, can confirm or only help you to understand the data if it is in line with the larger census form. What you're relying on here is a smaller sample, and you don't know how reliable those data are until you can compare the data with the long-form census. That, I think, is of profound concern to all of us here.

Could you help me with that?

[Erin Leigh]

I would ask my colleagues at Statistics Canada to respond, because that's a very specific data question.

[Rosemary Bender]

In analyzing the data from the general social survey on unpaid work, the survey itself and the methodology do provide quite robust estimates on their own. We have, over time, done some analysis at a very high level between the results from the census and the results from the general social survey. There were consistencies, and they do hold together.

However, the analysis itself--the deep and rich analysis, including the high-level aggregates--can be produced through the general social survey. This is what is being recommended, or what is being used, as the primary source for analysis of unpaid work.

[Irene Mathyssen, NDP, London—Fanshawe, ON]

When Ms. Badets began, you indicated that you didn't know what the end result would be and that there is still a huge question. If there is still a huge question, how do you know, without the long-form census, that the GSS data are giving you that deeper level of understanding that is so important if we're going to move the women's agenda along?