Evidence of meeting #17 for Transport, Infrastructure and Communities in the 41st Parliament, 2nd Session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was bridge.
A video is available from Parliament.
9:05 a.m.
NDP
Marjolaine Boutin-Sweet NDP Hochelaga, QC
So you're saying that the review period for a $100-million plus project is 18 months, and yet no construction season will be lost. I don't think we're doing quite the same math.
9:05 a.m.
Conservative
Denis Lebel Conservative Roberval—Lac-Saint-Jean, QC
You are the one saying that it will take 18 months for a project to be approved. That's not what I—
9:05 a.m.
Conservative
Denis Lebel Conservative Roberval—Lac-Saint-Jean, QC
That's not what I said to you. I just told you that in provinces like British Columbia and Ontario, where review processes already exist, we won't duplicate what's already been done. That is the basic concept behind what we're trying to do.
We established a $70-billion plan over 10 years, and $53 billion of it is in the new building Canada plan. We want to see that money invested and we want that investment to be ongoing. There's a history. Before I became an MP, I spent seven years as a mayor, so I know how much support we got from the previous government.
9:05 a.m.
Conservative
9:05 a.m.
NDP
Marjolaine Boutin-Sweet NDP Hochelaga, QC
Very well.
The government said it wouldn't sign a framework agreement with the provinces. What are you going to do to make sure you have an agreement by April 1?
9:10 a.m.
Conservative
Denis Lebel Conservative Roberval—Lac-Saint-Jean, QC
Talks are already well under way in terms of the overall plan. I am convinced that we won't miss out on any construction seasons. Don't worry about that. Officials are working very hard. I look forward to announcing agreements with the provinces soon.
9:10 a.m.
Conservative
The Chair Conservative Larry Miller
Your time has expired. Thank you.
Mr. McGuinty, you have seven minutes.
9:10 a.m.
Liberal
David McGuinty Liberal Ottawa South, ON
Thanks, Mr. Chair.
Monsieur le ministre, welcome back to committee.
Minister, I want to go right to the money. When I hear your presentation today, and I've watched your responses in the House in the last little while about the money, I'm reminded of a card trick, kind of a shell game.
I've gone through your report on plans and priorities. I've read the whole document. I've gone through the estimates. I've read that document. I'm looking through this document on 2014-15 estimates and I'm looking for the money.
You keep saying there's money available on April 1. Where is the money, and how much is available on April 1?
9:10 a.m.
Conservative
Denis Lebel Conservative Roberval—Lac-Saint-Jean, QC
I think you know how it works. We pay the provinces and our partners when the job is done. We can estimate how they will realize their project. About the estimates, it's always the same.
I will ask Mr. Lévesque to elaborate on the numbers.
9:10 a.m.
Louis Lévesque Deputy Minister, Infrastructure Canada
I'll explain that what is in the estimates does not reflect the new plan that has been announced in budget 2013, and funded and reannounced in budget 2014. This will come to supplementary estimates. What's in the estimates reflects both making the gas tax fund a statutory element—
9:10 a.m.
Liberal
David McGuinty Liberal Ottawa South, ON
I understand.
Let me ask you this. In previous estimates, funding for the building Canada plan was present. If I'm the mayor of Laval, or if I'm the mayor of Victoria, and I'm now looking, casting out over the next federal fiscal year, how much money am I eligible to apply for? What is the size of the fund available on April 1?
9:10 a.m.
Deputy Minister, Infrastructure Canada
What is currently before Parliament for the estimates is fundamentally the continuation of the programs that are largely committed, but not entirely—
9:10 a.m.
Conservative
9:10 a.m.
Liberal
David McGuinty Liberal Ottawa South, ON
So we don't have a deal, do we, frankly speaking?
I keep hearing that you're negotiating with the FCM, that you're going to have a deal on April 1, that there's going to be money available. Today is March 25, if my calender is right. So where's the money?
I keep hearing these numbers being bandied about, $54 billion, Mr. Chair. We know this is a gas tax transfer here, and it's a GST rebate over there. I know it makes for great slogans, Minister, because your government is big on slogans. It makes for great slogans.
Right here, the Library of Parliament's researchers ask the question why these expenditures have been omitted from the 2014-15 main estimates. Why? This is the Library of Parliament research staff asking the question.
Where's the money?
9:10 a.m.
Conservative
Denis Lebel Conservative Roberval—Lac-Saint-Jean, QC
The money will be.... We sent the renewal of the agreements to all provinces and territories which is starting on April 1 on November 5. We'll make some announcements soon for the agreements signed with provinces and territories. All mayors in the country know that the renewal of the gas tax fund is available on April 1. That's more than $2 billion a year. They know that's money.... We will invest $32 billion over 10 years in municipalities through the gas tax fund, just—
9:10 a.m.
Liberal
David McGuinty Liberal Ottawa South, ON
I'm sure you will, in years six, seven, eight, nine, and ten.
9:10 a.m.
Conservative
Denis Lebel Conservative Roberval—Lac-Saint-Jean, QC
I was a mayor when you were in government. I remember that era. We had no money. We have money on the table now.
9:10 a.m.
Liberal
David McGuinty Liberal Ottawa South, ON
—that Minister Flaherty on the way out the door has issued a decree to all the departments, including you as a minister, to say, “You're not getting the money right now because we have to eliminate the deficit, we have to balance the budget for political purposes before 2015”?
Isn't that the real reason we see no money booked here for April 1?