Thank you.
Evidence of meeting #22 for Veterans Affairs in the 42nd Parliament, 1st Session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was come.
A recording is available from Parliament.
Evidence of meeting #22 for Veterans Affairs in the 42nd Parliament, 1st Session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was come.
A recording is available from Parliament.
September 29th, 2016 / 3:55 p.m.
Liberal
Alaina Lockhart Liberal Fundy Royal, NB
Thank you, everyone, not only for being here today and giving us your testimony but for the work that you are doing for veterans. We appreciate it.
Mr. Allen and Mr. Thorne, being from New Brunswick, I'm quite interested in what your footprint is in Atlantic Canada.
3:55 p.m.
Program Coordinator, Atlantic, Veterans Transition Network
I have gone out to New Brunswick—I think it was last year—and we did speak to Veterans Affairs at the two offices there, one in Moncton and one in Saint John. It was very well received. We did have a couple of members go on to a program from that.
Right now I am actually looking for a facility we could use to run our program out in New Brunswick. We haven't found one yet that is suitable; we're still working on that.
One thing about the Atlantic region is that when we run a program there, anybody in the Atlantic provinces can attend. It's part of that one-stop shop kind of bill. If the member is in Atlantic, we'll bring that person to where it is. If we're running the program in Nova Scotia and they're in Newfoundland, we'll bring them. We'll bring them from New Brunswick. That hasn't been an issue thus far, but we are trying to expand so that we can get it as close to where the members are looking for it as possible.
4 p.m.
Liberal
Alaina Lockhart Liberal Fundy Royal, NB
For your program, you don't require a permanent infrastructure, per se. You run the program in the community for periods of time.
4 p.m.
Director, National Operations, Veterans Transition Network
I can speak to that from an operational perspective as well.
As Doug was saying, we are keen to keep that program accessible. If somebody who may not be in an area where we're consistently delivering requests the program, then we will, as a charity, eat the cost of bringing them down, whether it's flying them down, paying for their travel, and paying for a ferry or a taxi, or whatever it may be. We will cover their costs to attend the program.
We keep our eyes on those areas, and when we hit the critical mass for a local program, that's when we would look at finding a local centre where we can deliver the program. When we hit the magic number—and for us it is six to eight, because each of the programs we run is small and has six veterans attending for the first time—we start to look seriously at expanding in that area.
As well, speaking about local resources, our mission as we grow across Canada is to train clinicians locally. That includes registered psychologists and registered clinical counsellors or their equivalents. We're looking to train them in local communities, so that not only do our costs of delivery go down and become more sustainable, but we're also training psychologists and clinicians in local communities in working with veterans so that better care is available in those communities at large, as well as through our programs.
4 p.m.
Liberal
Alaina Lockhart Liberal Fundy Royal, NB
I noticed when we were talking about career transition.... We've been focused a lot on the transition in the service delivery study. Are you finding that veterans are coming to you without a sense of purpose? Is that part of the issue? Could you talk a bit about that?
4 p.m.
Director, National Operations, Veterans Transition Network
I will give that to Doug to speak about the experiences in the program and what people are saying.
One of the things I've found.... As an operations director, my direct contact with clients is limited these days, because I'm overseeing our program expansion. What I have heard in the past, especially working as a coordinator, is that people are not necessarily always struggling with unemployment, but they're struggling with under-employment. I think there is that lack of purpose and not feeling invested in what they're doing, or not feeling as if they have a future or a career in the area where they're working.
That's something we try to focus on in the program, which is to find out where their interests may lie and perhaps what their long-term goals could be. Yes, I think there is a lack of investment sometimes, and a lack of purpose in that sense.
4 p.m.
Liberal
Alaina Lockhart Liberal Fundy Royal, NB
You mentioned as well communication skills—and I'm working backwards—with family and loved ones.
Can you tell us again a bit of what happens or why that's required?
4 p.m.
Program Coordinator, Atlantic, Veterans Transition Network
We teach soldiers how to listen and speak all over again. It's something that probably even civilians could learn.
When we use it with veterans, of course, they have their own culture and their own way of speaking. They're also dedicated to learning how to get things done, so they're dedicated to learning how to speak and how to listen.
When they practice it on the program with each other, that then carries over to their family. What happens is that initially there is a bit of a shock because when they go home after phase one they're speaking differently and they're listening. When a veteran says to his wife, “What I hear you saying is...”, then the wife is thinking, “What...?” That comes from the program. They've tested it on some hard-core stuff with their comrades in the program, so they've already gone deep. Now they're able to say, “Okay, I've gone pretty deep here. I'm going to go back out into the real world and try it with my loved ones at home”, and they're able to do that.
It's a bit of a shock and a little bit of a shake, but what happens is that it's successful. How does it translate back to family and friends, and back into the community? They're taking the skills that they're learning in speaking and helping each other through what their sticking points are in the program and carrying that over into their home life. That makes home life better, because the family is involved as well.
4 p.m.
Liberal
Alaina Lockhart Liberal Fundy Royal, NB
Do I understand from your testimony that you're an independent charity, and that you're not a third party provider to Veterans Affairs?
4 p.m.
Director, National Operations, Veterans Transition Network
We are a registered service provider for Veterans Affairs Canada. We're designated as a multidisciplinary clinic, but we are independent in that we are a non-governmental organization. We have our own board of directors that oversees and directs our activities, and we are a registered charity.
4:05 p.m.
NDP
Irene Mathyssen NDP London—Fanshawe, ON
Thank you very much, Mr. Chair.
Thank you very much for being here and providing this information.
I want to ask a few questions in a different direction. There was discussion about the injuries that veterans exhibit and come to you with. Are you seeing any emotional injuries among women? I'm thinking in terms of women who have suffered sexual assault or sexual harassment. Is this something you're dealing with?
I'd like to hear from both groups, please.
4:05 p.m.
Director, National Operations, Veterans Transition Network
I'm in pretty regular contact with our clinical director, Dr. Mike Dadson. He oversees all of our training and all of our clinical protocols as they relate to the program. He is the clinician who's really been at the head of translating our programs and bringing them to female veterans and to female service members. The program initially, when it began, was for men. That was the focus of the three doctors and psychologists who had really built the program. Our focus was to bring this to everybody and make sure it was accessible. That did require some tweaks to the way in which we delivered the program.
The unfortunate reality is that so far, a large number of the women veterans who have requested our program have suffered some level of either sexual harassment or sexual trauma in the military. We are seeing that. We're seeing it in the majority of the clients at the moment who are requesting our programs.
4:05 p.m.
Program Coordinator, Atlantic, Veterans Transition Network
One thing we're doing to enable them to speak up about this is that we're training women clinicians. When we run a program, we're running a men's program and we're running a women's program.
Initially there is a lot of push-back from women veterans. They say, “We're used to being in a male-dominated society and culture. That's the military.” We ask them to give it a chance, and when they do give it a chance, they find that because they're among women who have similar experiences, they're able to open up in a much different way.
Now, whether or not that's because of sexual assault, I can't tell you, because I'm a man and I'm not a clinician on their program. What I can say, though, is that they're very grateful for being provided an all-women clinical team and an all-women group with the veterans transition program.
4:05 p.m.
Director, Nursing, Réseau d'accueil des agents et agentes de la paix (Maison La Vigile)
Our clients are more than 95% men. We have seen a few military women, some of whom have been victims of harassment, even sexual assault, not only in their military careers but also in their personal lives. They are still a very small part of our clientele. In the consultations, the reasons they bring up are not about the abuse. They came for other reasons but they talk to us about the abuse they have suffered.
4:05 p.m.
NDP
Irene Mathyssen NDP London—Fanshawe, ON
Do you think there's a reticence among women to talk about what's happened to them? As you were saying, Mr. Allen, they come from a man's world, where you have to be tough. Do you have a sense that they're not able to break through that? Is that a barrier to being well?
4:05 p.m.
Program Coordinator, Atlantic, Veterans Transition Network
I don't think they're not able to; I think in our approach we provide an ability to. We provide an all-women clinical team and an all-women group that provides an open window and an opportunity for them to actually explore those things that they perhaps wouldn't otherwise.
4:05 p.m.
NDP
Irene Mathyssen NDP London—Fanshawe, ON
Merci.
Madame Dussault, you made reference in your brief to the absence of support for families. We've heard that families very often are left on the fringes because they can't access the services from Veterans Affairs. Are you hearing from the families of veterans? Are they coming to you and saying they need more support than what they're getting, and what are you able to do in that regard?
4:10 p.m.
Director, Nursing, Réseau d'accueil des agents et agentes de la paix (Maison La Vigile)
Those comments did not come directly from the families, from the wives or the children, they came rather from the veterans who have stayed at La Vigile and who said that they wished their families had access to those services.
